• Effective immediately we will be deleting, without notice, any negative threads or posts that deal with the use of encryption and streaming of scanner audio.

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    https://forums.radioreference.com/rants/224104-official-thread-live-audio-feeds-scanners-wait-encryption.html

El Paso County Help

Joined
Mar 18, 2005
Messages
20
Location
Woodland Park, CO
#1
I'm trying to understand more about why my old scanners(RS-Pro96/Pro197and HP1) no longer pickup APCO25-P1 CSPD, CSFD and others. From what I can gather from other forum threads, COS went to simulcast which these units can't decode. This leaves me with a few questions.

1) Was this change just for COS or also CSP/EPCO? (I can still pickup CSP/EPSO when in Teller but not much in COS)
2) I don't see a simulcast designation in the database, this would help me understand which services are affected. Am I missing this somewhere?
3) RR-freq database no longer shows sites like AustinBluffs, CheyMtn, TempGap, etc. Are they gone with new Simulcast changeover?
4) Sentinel database for HP1 still show old ones listed above and none of the new ones, Whiskey Tango Foxtrot?
5) Any recommendations on new scanner to solve simulcast?
Thanks for your thoughts,
Mike
 
Joined
Mar 18, 2005
Messages
20
Location
Woodland Park, CO
#3
I'm trying to understand more about why my old scanners(RS-Pro96/Pro197and HP1) no longer pickup APCO25-P1 CSPD, CSFD and others. From what I can gather from other forum threads, COS went to simulcast which these units can't decode. This leaves me with a few questions.

1) Was this change just for COS or also CSP/EPCO? (I can still pickup CSP/EPSO when in Teller but not much in COS)
2) I don't see a simulcast designation in the database, this would help me understand which services are affected. Am I missing this somewhere?
3) RR-freq database no longer shows sites like AustinBluffs, CheyMtn, TempGap, etc. Are they gone with new Simulcast changeover?
4) Sentinel database for HP1 still show old ones listed above and none of the new ones, Whiskey Tango Foxtrot?
5) Any recommendations on new scanner to solve simulcast?
Thanks for your thoughts,
Mike
 

Spitfire8520

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Jun 29, 2009
Messages
1,772
Location
Colorado
#4
1) Was this change just for COS or also CSP/EPCO? (I can still pickup CSP/EPSO when in Teller but not much in COS)
This change affects all agencies that uses the Colorado Springs Simulcast site in Colorado Springs and northern El Paso County. This means that Colorado Springs, El Paso County, and CSP 2B will use the site when it is optimal.

You might be getting CSP and EPSO off of the Woodland Park site whenever they are affiliated to it. You may notice periods of silence when they affiliate to other sites. It is not likely that someone from Colorado Springs will be traveling up Highway 24, so that would explain why you don't hear Colorado Springs much.

You might not be able hear the simulcast site from your location if you were not previously able monitor using the old sites (like Stanley Canyon, Cedar Heights, or Ski Summit) that were absorbed into the simulcast. You can try to enter the control channel for the simulcast (853.7125 MHz) into one of your scanners and see if you can hear/decode it.

2) I don't see a simulcast designation in the database, this would help me understand which services are affected. Am I missing this somewhere?
Simulcast only applies to sites. It does not apply to agencies unless they are using the simulcast site.

An EPSO Deputy on Highway 24 near Green Mountain Falls might be using the Woodland Park site, which is not a simulcast. If he drives back towards Colorado Springs, his radio will automatically switch to the Colorado Springs Simulcast when he gets close to Manitou Springs.

3) RR-freq database no longer shows sites like AustinBluffs, CheyMtn, TempGap, etc. Are they gone with new Simulcast changeover?
The old Zone 4 sites of Airport, Austin Bluffs, Cedar Heights, Ski Summit, Stanley Canyon, and Templeton Gap were merged into a single simulcast site which is in the database as Colorado Springs Simulcast.

Cheyenne Mountain was moved to Zone 6 along with other sites in southeastern Colorado.

4) Sentinel database for HP1 still show old ones listed above and none of the new ones, Whiskey Tango Foxtrot?
You will need to connect your HP1 to your computer and update the the onboard database.

See this video: HomePatrol-1 Updating Your Database

This will not work if you have created a custom favorites list. You will need to manually go into the favorites list and add/remove the sites.

5) Any recommendations on new scanner to solve simulcast?
The only scanner that is available today is the Uniden SDS100. Whistler is currently designing the TRX-100 and TRX-200 to handle simulcast, but they will not be released until next year.
 
Joined
Mar 18, 2005
Messages
20
Location
Woodland Park, CO
#7
Spitfire8520

Thanks a lot for the detailed answers. After updating the scanners and experimenting I found the following.

- Correct, I am getting some ElPaso activity off of the WP tower when they wander close enough to it.
- in COS I get mostly crickets on the Pro96 and HP1. Occasional hit, probably from CheyMtn.
- The Pro-197 is pretty much working in COS. After some logging, I am definitely getting traffic on COS simulcast freqs however, I still think I am missing traffic.

Why would the Pro-197 pick up a lot of the simulcast?

Should I consider just getting a Pro-106/PSR-500/WS1040 for a handheld instead of the SDS100($$) or TRX-100?

Thanks,
Mike
 

Spitfire8520

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Jun 29, 2009
Messages
1,772
Location
Colorado
#8
El Paso County and Colorado Springs heavily favor Zone/RFSS 4 sites. This means that using sites like 1-014 Douglas County South Simulcast, 6-048 Cheyenne Mountain, and 6-039 Quail Loop will result in mostly silence. If your Pro-96 and HP-1 locks onto those sites, then that might be why you are hearing mostly silence. Only an extremely small handful of El Paso County talkgroups are allowed on those sites, and Colorado Springs will not be heard on them at all. Those sites are used by out of county agencies and CSP. I tend to suggest keeping your Zone 4 programming independent from the rest of DTRS because of this.

With any simulcast, you will likely encounter simulcast distortion. What this means is that you will likely notice the scanner struggling to receive in the middle of what should be an area with strong signal. All scanners older than the SDS100 and not yet released TRX-100/200 will exhibit some effects of simulcast distortion, they just might not show it in the same areas. There is pretty much a whole thread of people noting their experience with this issue over at Simulcast coming to Colorado Springs.

Due to the simulcast distortion, it is possible that some of your scanners ignore the simulcast site and lock onto a different site because they can't get a good decode.

I would not suggest buying the older scanners unless you are planning to use it while stationary. This allows you to tweak things like positioning and antennas to receive a signal. This is not practical while in motion.
 
Joined
Dec 12, 2016
Messages
3
Location
colorado springs colorado
#9
so is this the problem i could be having with my uniden 996xt. i have cspd programmed into my list to listen to but none of the channels work on cspd... i would think that even with simulcast issues it would still pick up some of the cspd... but nothing at all.. but my old radio shack scanner still picks up cspd... is there a setting to turn on the cspd frequencies?
 

Spitfire8520

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Jun 29, 2009
Messages
1,772
Location
Colorado
#10
so is this the problem i could be having with my uniden 996xt. i have cspd programmed into my list to listen to but none of the channels work on cspd... i would think that even with simulcast issues it would still pick up some of the cspd... but nothing at all.. but my old radio shack scanner still picks up cspd... is there a setting to turn on the cspd frequencies?
Reading both your posts, it sounds like you might not have the simulcast site programmed or your 996XT is not locking onto the simulcast site. You will want to double check your programming to verify that the new site is in the scanner, especially if you haven't refreshed it since the changes. If you have the site programmed, you will want to look into site quick keys or site hold features of the 996XT to force it to check and stay on the simulcast site.

If you are site holding on the simulcast site and still get nothing, then you will want to read the suggestions in both the simulcast distortion article and Simulcast coming to Colorado Springs thread on ways of mitigating the effects of simulcast. A number of people have had luck with a yagi antenna.
 
Joined
Dec 12, 2016
Messages
3
Location
colorado springs colorado
#11
hello spitfire.. so should i not have the multiple sites programmed in and just the colorado springs simulcast ? right now there is quail look truckton calhan cheyenne mountain ... should i take all of those out and just have one site> ? you have no idea how much i appreciate your help on this.. i have been going around and around with this so many months....
i will see if i can find the simulcast station....
tony..
 

Spitfire8520

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Jun 29, 2009
Messages
1,772
Location
Colorado
#12
hello spitfire.. so should i not have the multiple sites programmed in and just the colorado springs simulcast ? right now there is quail look truckton calhan cheyenne mountain ... should i take all of those out and just have one site> ?
You should read my previous post regarding Quail Loop and Cheyenne Mountain. Truckton and Calhan are not great choices because of affiliation, meaning that they won't carry CSPD unless CSPD happens to be out in those areas. That probably does not happen very often.

If you are specifically interested in just CSPD, then I would only program the simulcast.
 

radio

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Mar 6, 2002
Messages
387
Location
Colorado Springs CO
#13
853.7125 is the Colorado Springs Simulcast frequency you need to use. This is a Zone 4 area.

Quail Loop and Cheyenne Mountain are Zone 6. Truckton and Calhan are also Zone 4, but used outside of the city limits and do not carry any CSFD or CSPD talk groups unless they should be out there on mutual aid calls to El Paso FD, SO or CSP.

However, lately Cheyenne Mountain Zone 6, 853.0500 and/or Douglas Co South Zone 1, 853.9375 have been carrying El Paso FD Red, 4770, C zones. 494x, El Paso SO Ch 1, 4710. North/Primary Dispatch and SO Ch 3, 4712, South Dispatch during selective incidences.
 
Last edited:

icemantim8

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Jan 9, 2004
Messages
1
Location
Colorado
#14
Greetings! This is a general response to anyone in the Colorado Springs city limits that is having trouble with the simulcast system. I recently found a great used Unication G4 for sale and it works great for me. I also have a Yagi antenna for my Pro 96 when needed. I live near Powers and North Carefree. If anyone wants to bring their radios to my place and try out the Yagi, you are more than welcome. Open offer to anyone interested. You can also see first hand how the Unication G4 performs. I'm not selling anything...lol...just open to lend a hand to other enthusiasts. You may email me directly at timmazza@gmail.com if you are interested and we will go from there. By the way, my Pro 96 also works like a charm on the system.
 
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