Electroline Question

[Dewey]

I've been searching for an Electroline EDA-UG 2402 to split my antenna input. It looks like this series may be in the mist of being replaced as it is VERY HARD to find. I found an Electroline reseller that doesn't have the EDA-UG 2402, but says that I can buy the current EDA-2403, and just not use the inline amplifier if I don't want an amplified signal. Does anyone know if this would be accurate? IOW, can does anyone know if the EDA-2403 without the inline amplifier would be as good as the EDA-UG 2402?

Thanks,
Dewey

 

[tonsoffun]

Hi dewey,

Which reseller did you call. You can try TVC Communications 1-888-644-6075 .

They are the US distributor.

Ron

 

[Dewey]

Hi dewey,

Which reseller did you call. You can try TVC Communications 1-888-644-6075 .

They are the US distributor.

Ron

Thanks Ron,

TVC is who I talked to. They acted like either they didn't know what the "UG" model was, or they could not get them. I'm inclined to believe that the problem is that they cannot get them. When I first asked about having the EDA-UG 2402 in stock, they wrote back and suggested the straight "EDA" model, the EDA-2403. When I explained that I would be using it for scanner use, and wanted a "UG" unity gain model, and not an amplified model because I didn't want to raise my noise floor, they said that's why the EDA-2403 was suggested... because I didn't have to use the power injector. They gave very good customer service concerning my questions, I just feel that they didn't have a full "appreciation" of splitting a scanner signal versus splitting a TV signal. That's the reason I've asked here... I just don't know if not using the power injector in the EDA-2403 would be as good as using the plain old EDA-UG 2402.

Thanks again,
Dewey

 

[N_Jay]

You are working on false information.

The setting of the amplifier to equal the loss is irrelevant.

The noise floor will be set by the noise figure of the amplifier and the gain of the amplifier.
There is nothing magic about a unity gain splitter.

The only difference between the 2402 and 2403 seems to be the inclusion of the power injector.

Some descriptions say it has a 5 dB noise figure which is not very good, others say 3 dB which is a lot better.

You need to inject power somehow, because the internal amplifier, no matter what the gain is set for, needs power.

http://www.electroline.com/en/products/drop_amplifiers/eda_ug/eda_ug.pdf

 

[tonsoffun]

Are you sure they where not talking about a power inserter? which is for remote powering anyways.

Did you try the other retail numbers, I am sure someone would have one somewhere!
Here are the other numbers that you may have missed.

http://www.electroline.com/en/products/drop_amplifiers/index.html

Ron

 

[tonsoffun]

Here you go Dewey

4 Port
http://cgi.ebay.com/ELECTROLINE-EDA...ptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?_trksid=p3286.m20.l1116
8 Port
http://cgi.ebay.com/ELECTROLINE-EDA...ptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?_trksid=p3286.m20.l1116

 

[Dewey]

You are working on false information.

The setting of the amplifier to equal the loss is irrelevant.

The noise floor will be set by the noise figure of the amplifier and the gain of the amplifier.
There is nothing magic about a unity gain splitter.

The only difference between the 2402 and 2403 seems to be the inclusion of the power injector.

Some descriptions say it has a 5 dB noise figure which is not very good, others say 3 dB which is a lot better.

You need to inject power somehow, because the internal amplifier, no matter what the gain is set for, needs power.

http://www.electroline.com/en/products/drop_amplifiers/eda_ug/eda_ug.pdf

I appreciate the answer, but I must say that I cannot thoroughly follow it. I have PDFs for both the EDA and the EDA-UG series. From my basic understanding, the EDA is amplified, and the EDA-UG is not (at least from the way I am reading the amplification in the EDA-UG is offset by the split). As for injecting power, both series are powered through a connection to the main unit. The side that has two inputs is for antenna in and power (what a bad idea... using an F connector for a power input to a device that uses all F connections). What TVC is basically telling me is that using the EDA-2403 without the seperate "Power Inserter" is that same as using the EDA-UG 2402.

Dewey

 

[Dewey]

Here you go Dewey

4 Port
http://cgi.ebay.com/ELECTROLINE-EDA...ptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?_trksid=p3286.m20.l1116
8 Port
http://cgi.ebay.com/ELECTROLINE-EDA...ptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?_trksid=p3286.m20.l1116

Thanks Ron... I saw those after looking around harder. I may order one of those tomorrow depending on the information that I can get about comparing the EDA-UG 2402 to the EDA 2403 with the power inserter.

Thanks again,
Dewey

 

[tonsoffun]

A power inserter can be used on any of the drop amps. A power inserter is only used for remote powering installation. The unit still needs to be plugged in for power.
Unless there saying not to plug the unit in at all.


I am sure you have seen this but for others to see.

http://www.electroline.com/en/products/drop_amplifiers/images/dropamp_installation_instructions.pdf

Ron

 

[N_Jay]

I appreciate the answer, but I must say that I cannot thoroughly follow it. I have PDFs for both the EDA and the EDA-UG series. From my basic understanding, the EDA is amplified, and the EDA-UG is not (at least from the way I am reading the amplification in the EDA-UG is offset by the split). As for injecting power, both series are powered through a connection to the main unit. The side that has two inputs is for antenna in and power (what a bad idea... using an F connector for a power input to a device that uses all F connections). What TVC is basically telling me is that using the EDA-2403 without the seperate "Power Inserter" is that same as using the EDA-UG 2402.

Dewey

There is a mistaken belief (a myth) that if the amplifier gain is the same as the splitter loss (making the whole box unity gain) it will not raise the noise floor.

This is false. All that matters is what the noise figure is of the amplifier and how muck gain it has. The goal is to have the most gain with the lowest noise.

So if a particular amp has a 5dB noise figure and the gain is 6 dB (to equal a 4 way splitter), that is WORSE than a 5 db noise figure amp with 10 dB of gain in front of a 4 way splitter (+4dB total gain).

In general these drop amps are NOT made for low signal levels and d DO NOT make good front end amplifiers for receivers.


Get a passive splitter. If you need some gain, get a proper pre-amp and put it as close to the antenna as practical.

 

[hoser147]

Hey Guys, Ron I think that is what they are telling him as far as the power not being hooked in. However when I bought mine I was told it needed the power. Im taking a wild shot here but am guessing the one Dewey is looking for EDA- UG 2402 That the UG is unity gain. When I purchased mine, I was told that you had to have the power, go figure. After tryin it at different spots along the run of coax I still had front end overload. Throw away all that you read in the ebay add, if you read it , it has contradictions in it. I do believe that they do work in some applications, just not mine. Njay is correct on how he is explaining it to you, with the loss and noise floor. I ended up getting a cable splitter and it works fine. Still got the drop amp. Another interesting tidbit is they only carried the walwart with a 6Ft cable on it and I got to agree with Dewey about the "F" connector on the power feed.(dumb) but made for Larry the cable guy. Good Luck

 

[N_Jay]

If it has any gain (including just to overcome splitter loss), it needs power.

If you don't power it, just buy a $4 splitter at Walmart.


In fact, JUST buy the darn $4 splitter, and forget about the rest.

 

[tonsoffun]

If it has any gain (including just to overcome splitter loss), it needs power.

If you don't power it, just buy a $4 splitter at Walmart.


In fact, JUST buy the darn $4 splitter, and forget about the rest.

Exactly, and well put N Jay. How is the thing going to work with no power to it, it will be completely useless.

Actually, I can get some splitters for 99 cents hehe.

Ron

 

[Dewey]

If it has any gain (including just to overcome splitter loss), it needs power.

If you don't power it, just buy a $4 splitter at Walmart.


In fact, JUST buy the darn $4 splitter, and forget about the rest.

I guess this is the part that I don't understand, which is also what started my quest for a Stridsberg or Electroline. I'm currently using a RCA gold plated splitter ("T"). While I have not yet seen a situation where one scanner has interfered with another, I thought the reasoning for the Stridsberg/Electroline was to isolate the split output to protect each device from the other interferance wise. If a "T" is going to work just as fine, what is the purpose of buying a more expensive passive device (I'm guessing that they are going to be close to each other in amount of loss)?

I also know that anything amplified is going to need power from somewhere. I just didn't realize that [gain in]=[split loss] would cause more harm than good. I may just have to leave "well enough" alone.

As always, thanks guys,
Dewey

 

[hoser147]

Dewey if you still want to try it send me a pm.

 

[NYRHKY94]

Hi Dewey:

All the technical stuff aside, all I can tell you is I have been using an 8-port EDA-UG2802 for several years now and have had zero issues with my scanners. I was fortunate to pick up both a 4-port & 8-port UG model from an e-bay auction for about $36 each. Unfortunately, they rarely come up for regular auctions anymore. You'll find a lot of guys on RR who use Electrolines and love them.

Thanks - Mike

 

[hoser147]

Hi Mike, I knew there were some out there that it worked for from past threads. It sounds like they are trying to get a sale, on the non UG models. Where in your run do you have yours hooked up? Is it powered? Thanks

 

[NYRHKY94]

Hi Hoser:

I have my Scantenna mounted at 35' (wall mount near the eave) and have the cable run connected to the 8-port UG Electroline in my shack on the same side of the house (first floor office). The Electroline is "powered" by a wall wart that came with the unit. I do not use the separate power inserter that also came with it.

I have 8 scanners connected to the Electroline, with 4 of them streaming live feeds on Scan America. I have never had an issue with either sound quailty or loss of signal across the 8 scanners. I was fortunate to get the Electrolines at a decent auction price ($36), versus the normal $70-80 buy now they sell for.

 

[hoser147]

Thanks Mike!

 

[tonsoffun]

Thats all I am using is Electroline products. My first purchase was an Stridsburg model. Then purchase a Electroline UG line and compared the two. There was no difference between the two in performance. I then sold the Stridsburg model.

All cables that come in to the shack are hooked up to one amplified version 4 port for the Omni-X then the LP log is hooked up to another amplified 8 port version.

Keep in mind I am in a low noise environment and nothing is overloading. Both units are plugged in to power the Electrolines right near the radios.

Ron