Fools have more fun

[Lauri-CoyoteFrostbite]

.
I think most people on these forums have heard of Ernest Shackleton, and particularly his Antarctic Expedition of 1914- This was a remarkable story of adversity overcome in multiple near disasters of early 20th century antarctic exploration.
I particularly find his 1914 trans Antarctica attempt entralling for I have this passion for all things early 20th century radio. This was a exciting time of spark gaps and coherer receivers, long long wavelengths- and it was a time when every radio operator was in some degree a radio 'ham.'


***********

" ...........Adventure is just another word for poor planning..... "
Roald Amundsen, (leader of the first success expedition to the geographic South Pole)

************
Shackleton 'story revolves around his ship, the Endurance, becoming frozen in the ice of the Weddell Sea while searching for a path thru that sea ice for a site to land his expedition. Trapped in this ice, his ship was slowly destroyed, forcing everyone's evacuation- and then a harrowing escape across ice and open water to remote Elephant Island. Shackleton made a subsequent small boat voyage to rescue the stranded crew by sailing across the antarctic oceans for help... a sailing feat un-paralelled to this day. But while all this happened the outside world knew nothing.

There are any number of excellent books about his ill fated expedition, and I will leave it the curious to fill in the details.

My interests were piqued when I gave a series of talks to US Naval Academy Midshipmen. These were about early radio communication, mentioning Admiral Byrd and other polar explorations, --I was asked concerning Shackleton's near disaster - "where was his radio ?"
Simple answer, he didn't have one- at least he didn't have a transmitter- he only had a receiver aboard the Endurance. This was post 1912 Titanic - by 1914 the whole maritime world now valued spark as a lifesaving tool. But obviously Ernest didn't, and his ignorance put his expedition in terrible danger when he omitted this invaluable piece of equipment.

This article by John L. Fuhring is a great exploration of Shackleton and his (lack of) wireless-

Shackleton's missing radio equipment

My take on a failure of Shackleton to appreciate the value of "modern" radio technology and a description of just what that technology was.

www.geojohn.org

[/URL]

but it leaves me with this great saying:

".......... the difference between an adventure and a disaster is that in an adventure, nobody gets killed....."



Lauri



.

 

[K4EET]

Ahhh… the great Antarctic Expedition of 1914. What an adventure that must have been. Hopefully you have caught the interest of the younger folks who may not know this story.

Lauri, I’ve not heard that last quote:
".......... the difference between an adventure and a disaster is that in an adventure, nobody gets killed....."

Maybe since I’m in a wheelchair, I haven’t gone on any DXpedetions to have heard that yet. 🤣 Do you know who that can be attributed to?

73, Dave K4EET

 

[Lauri-CoyoteFrostbite]

Hi Dave
".......... the difference between an adventure and a disaster is that in an adventure, nobody gets killed....." is from John Fuhring, the author of "Shackleton's missing radio equipment"

Lauri

 

[K4EET]

Hi Dave
".......... the difference between an adventure and a disaster is that in an adventure, nobody gets killed....." is from John Fuhring, the author of "Shackleton's missing radio equipment"

Lauri

Thanks Lauri. I should have known that…

73, Dave K4EET

 

[WA2E]

.
I think most people on these forums have heard of Ernest Shackleton, and particularly his Antarctic Expedition of 1914- This was a remarkable story of adversity overcome in multiple near disasters of early 20th century antarctic exploration.
I particularly find his 1914 trans Antarctica attempt entralling for I have this passion for all things early 20th century radio. This was a exciting time of spark gaps and coherer receivers, long long wavelengths- and it was a time when every radio operator was in some degree a radio 'ham.'


***********

" ...........Adventure is just another word for poor planning..... "
Roald Amundsen, (leader of the first success expedition to the geographic South Pole)

************
Shackleton 'story revolves around his ship, the Endurance, becoming frozen in the ice of the Weddell Sea while searching for a path thru that sea ice for a site to land his expedition. Trapped in this ice, his ship was slowly destroyed, forcing everyone's evacuation- and then a harrowing escape across ice and open water to remote Elephant Island. Shackleton made a subsequent small boat voyage to rescue the stranded crew by sailing across the antarctic oceans for help... a sailing feat un-paralelled to this day. But while all this happened the outside world knew nothing.

There are any number of excellent books about his ill fated expedition, and I will leave it the curious to fill in the details.

My interests were piqued when I gave a series of talks to US Naval Academy Midshipmen. These were about early radio communication, mentioning Admiral Byrd and other polar explorations, --I was asked concerning Shackleton's near disaster - "where was his radio ?"
Simple answer, he didn't have one- at least he didn't have a transmitter- he only had a receiver aboard the Endurance. This was post 1912 Titanic - by 1914 the whole maritime world now valued spark as a lifesaving tool. But obviously Ernest didn't, and his ignorance put his expedition in terrible danger when he omitted this invaluable piece of equipment.

This article by John L. Fuhring is a great exploration of Shackleton and his (lack of) wireless-

Shackleton's missing radio equipment

My take on a failure of Shackleton to appreciate the value of "modern" radio technology and a description of just what that technology was.

www.geojohn.org

[/URL]

but it leaves me with this great saying:

".......... the difference between an adventure and a disaster is that in an adventure, nobody gets killed....."



Lauri



.

Saw a documentary on Discovery or History concerning this fate full exploration.

Mike

 

[trentbob]

.
I think most people on these forums have heard of Ernest Shackleton, and particularly his Antarctic Expedition of 1914- This was a remarkable story of adversity overcome in multiple near disasters of early 20th century antarctic exploration.
I particularly find his 1914 trans Antarctica attempt entralling for I have this passion for all things early 20th century radio. This was a exciting time of spark gaps and coherer receivers, long long wavelengths- and it was a time when every radio operator was in some degree a radio 'ham.'


***********

" ...........Adventure is just another word for poor planning..... "
Roald Amundsen, (leader of the first success expedition to the geographic South Pole)

************
Shackleton 'story revolves around his ship, the Endurance, becoming frozen in the ice of the Weddell Sea while searching for a path thru that sea ice for a site to land his expedition. Trapped in this ice, his ship was slowly destroyed, forcing everyone's evacuation- and then a harrowing escape across ice and open water to remote Elephant Island. Shackleton made a subsequent small boat voyage to rescue the stranded crew by sailing across the antarctic oceans for help... a sailing feat un-paralelled to this day. But while all this happened the outside world knew nothing.

There are any number of excellent books about his ill fated expedition, and I will leave it the curious to fill in the details.

My interests were piqued when I gave a series of talks to US Naval Academy Midshipmen. These were about early radio communication, mentioning Admiral Byrd and other polar explorations, --I was asked concerning Shackleton's near disaster - "where was his radio ?"
Simple answer, he didn't have one- at least he didn't have a transmitter- he only had a receiver aboard the Endurance. This was post 1912 Titanic - by 1914 the whole maritime world now valued spark as a lifesaving tool. But obviously Ernest didn't, and his ignorance put his expedition in terrible danger when he omitted this invaluable piece of equipment.

This article by John L. Fuhring is a great exploration of Shackleton and his (lack of) wireless-

Shackleton's missing radio equipment

My take on a failure of Shackleton to appreciate the value of "modern" radio technology and a description of just what that technology was.

www.geojohn.org

[/URL]

but it leaves me with this great saying:

".......... the difference between an adventure and a disaster is that in an adventure, nobody gets killed....."



Lauri



.

Thanks for re-sparking an interest in this story I heard of a long time ago. It is amazing they made it back.

It's hard to fathom that they did not have a transmitter, the steam yacht was required to have a receiver so as to hear and assist in emergencies but why they didn't they have a transmitter on such a mission?

I enjoyed the article of the things to consider, that it wasn't just the radio that you needed, you also needed a skilled professional radio man. They set off on this journey right at the start of WW1. Radio operators were highly skilled professionals and there was a great shortage of them. Most went into the armed services at the start of the war. Maybe a radio man was not available or was not willing to take the low pay and give up that much time.

Amazing that a crew member was a very talented and skilled carpenter which made all the difference of life and death. Since the ship took its time sinking they were able to offload everything including the lifeboats and this carpenter was able to make a reinforced seaworthy boat from the lifeboats. He was also able to make very adequate shelters for the crew to live on the ice.

What a difference having a transmitter and skilled radio man would have made. The article points out they even had a Marconi antenna atop the boat.

Very interesting topic.

 

[samcken]

It's surprising the "scientific" expedition on the Karluck didn't have a radio when they set sail in 1913. But considering the haste with which the expedition was thrown together and the quality of supplies and personnel, I guess the odds were in favor of disaster.

 

[Lauri-CoyoteFrostbite]

.
.
It took me a bit of mental gymnastics to get my thoughts around this "why no radios.'

What I came up with is a mixture, but part of that mix is very much alive today, -------- which I will get to.

These early British Antarctic explorers were the pinnacle of the 'stiff upper lip class"- a time when an Englishman could do anything if he just had fierce determination enough. After reading accounts of their exploits I came to the conclusion that these men felt that any inadequacy-- be it equipment, prepartion, mental focus etc., they could be over come because that is what Englishmen do. But most of all, never admit you were less than your public persona. If you didn't know how to do it or anything about a technology, then it wasn't worth doing or knowing. The attitude was very powerful in the Victorian/Edwardian period before WW! when the sun never set on the British Empire.

"...... "Mad dogs and Englishmen go out in the midday sun."

Not a very good attribute for a bunch of explorers.

Ernest Shackleton, Robert Scott- these explorers didn't understand radio and therefore it must not be that important. Shackleton, in particular- for although a dynamic leader, he did not tolerate criticism well.*
Also these early radio's required a lot of skill to operate- I dare say, far more than most hams today are capable of. These radios were mechanical beasts, more like vacuum cleaners or sump pumps than the modern electronics of today. Not just anyone could sit down and make them communicate.

Which brings me back to my original "mixture" comment. Do you think hams today are so superior to these Edwardians?...what, with there pricey Kenwoods and big beams ?
I am not a contester but I like to venture - briefy- into them to see what I can do. This weekend was a big Sideband contest, and where else but 20 metre's to play contest.

I made a few initial contacts- easy pickings into Western Europe, when I tuned across a 20-over state side signal calling "CQ Contest." He would repeat this call with hardly a pause between transmitting and listening (???)
I know he would have heard me (Triband beam at 60 feet, 1500 Watts) but the bugger never shut up long enuff to listen.

I just smiled to myself, pulled the switch and went for a walk.


Maybe Shackleton understood radio far better than I was giving him credit.


Lauri


___________________________________________________________________
*I would have lasted about a half hour in his company


.

 

[trentbob]

.
.
It took me a bit of mental gymnastics to get my thoughts around this "why no radios.'

What I came up with is a mixture, but part of that mix is very much alive today, -------- which I will get to.

These early British Antarctic explorers were the pinnacle of the 'stiff upper lip class"- a time when an Englishman could do anything if he just had fierce determination enough. After reading accounts of their exploits I came to the conclusion that these men felt that any inadequacy-- be it equipment, prepartion, mental focus etc., they could be over come because that is what Englishmen do. But most of all, never admit you were less than your public persona. If you didn't know how to do it or anything about a technology, then it wasn't worth doing or knowing. The attitude was very powerful in the Victorian/Edwardian period before WW! when the sun never set on the British Empire.

"...... "Mad dogs and Englishmen go out in the midday sun."

Not a very good attribute for a bunch of explorers.

Ernest Shackleton, Robert Scott- these explorers didn't understand radio and therefore it must not be that important. Shackleton, in particular- for although a dynamic leader, he did not tolerate criticism well.*
Also these early radio's required a lot of skill to operate- I dare say, far more than most hams today are capable of. These radios were mechanical beasts, more like vacuum cleaners or sump pumps than the modern electronics of today. Not just anyone could sit down and make them communicate.

Which brings me back to my original "mixture" comment. Do you think hams today are so superior to these Edwardians?...what, with there pricey Kenwoods and big beams ?
I am not a contester but I like to venture - briefy- into them to see what I can do. This weekend was a big Sideband contest, and where else but 20 metre's to play contest.

I made a few initial contacts- easy pickings into Western Europe, when I tuned across a 20-over state side signal calling "CQ Contest." He would repeat this call with hardly a pause between transmitting and listening (???)
I know he would have heard me (Triband beam at 60 feet, 1500 Watts) but the bugger never shut up long enuff to listen.

I just smiled to myself, pulled the switch and went for a walk.


Maybe Shackleton understood radio far better than I was giving him credit.


Lauri


___________________________________________________________________
*I would have lasted about a half hour in his company


.

With regard to your last sentence, it might take some days and be a little complicated but yes you would... you would fit right in with that crew.

I agree about "Sir" Ernest Shackleton, you are not to question his orders.



This is not meant to be off-topic at all but I equate this with the Zulu Wars. Overwhelming forces against a relatively small contingent of Brits. The Zulus didn't have the weapons but they had the bodies and the generations and generations of resolve. Their biggest weapon was their chants... long story short the British held the line through standard OP and discipline.

They could have been beaten easily but after several battles, Zulu chanted that they respected their opponent so much that they could not battle with them and they retreated. They respected the discipline and honor against overwhelming odds. I think that's what we're talking about here with Sir Ernest's crew, Most crews would have perished. I'm not sure but I don't even think all of them where the same nationality.

 

[majoco]

Lauri - he might have been listening on another receiver - often they say "listening up 5" or similar although if he was working his own 'pile-up' you would expect him be saying something " youarenumber562&5&9plusnextplease"!

 

[Lauri-CoyoteFrostbite]

Hi Guys !

T-Bob, I do agree with you- Shackleton was a awesome expedition leader- he was also at the same time careless of his men's safety. On his Weddell Sea voyage he repeatedly ignored warnings from experienced whaling captains about the unusually thick pack ice that year. When he encounter'd the ice pack he insisted on butting against it, un-sucessfully, trying to find a way thru to make a landing- Then winter set in and they became helplessly frozen into that ice. The Endurance, while a sturdy ship, had a hull not designed to withstand frozen-in Antarctic winters. We know what followed.

What upsets me is how we don't hear about the other half of this expedition... The party on the Aurora; which was to land on the opposite side of Antarctica and lay supply depots for Shackleton to use in his second half of his trans continental trek. Since Shackleton never made his landfall, these men risked their lives (with a death) in a fruitless attempt to carry out their mission,-- which unbeknownst to them was now aborted. The Aurora had a wireless station. What a different story it would have been if only the Endurance had one too.

I admire Shackleton for the man he was- truly a pioneer that was pushing the technology envelope years before Gore-tex clothing, portable HF radios, and vitamin C. The world needs hero's and he was one for the ages, flaws or no.

___________________

I have been to Antarctica several times-- its a land of unbelievable beauty and also of severe harshness. I had to actually experience it, though, thru my lens of modern luxury, to gain an inkling of appreciation of what these early 20th Century explorers accomplished.... And though I think Shackleton and I would have been at each others throats, he still has my admiration.


Lauri


.

 

[k7ng]

Lauri, Funny you should have discussed Shackleton at length when you did - I just saw that the wreck of 'ENDURANCE' has been found.

I've been to Antarctica, even spent a winter there, but these days life isn't too bad there. It surely took a special person to have gotten through an expedition way back when, though.

 

[WPXS472]

This is off topic, and not Antarctic, but there is an excellrnt movie on Netflix right now about the Danish expedition in Greenland. They face incredible hardship. Talk about stiff upper lip! The title is "Against the Ice".

 

[AK9R]

I just saw that the wreck of 'ENDURANCE' has been found.

Endurance, Ernest Shackleton’s Lost Ship, Found in Antarctica After 107 Years

One of the greatest maritime mysteries of modern times was solved when a team of explorers said they had discovered the wreck of a ship that disappeared under Antarctic sea ice in 1915.

www.wsj.com

 

[majoco]

oops...

 

[majoco]

In today news here....

Stuff

www.stuff.co.nz

Also tells the story of his 'escape' with all of his crew.

 

[trentbob]

Endurance, Ernest Shackleton’s Lost Ship, Found in Antarctica After 107 Years

One of the greatest maritime mysteries of modern times was solved when a team of explorers said they had discovered the wreck of a ship that disappeared under Antarctic sea ice in 1915.

www.wsj.com

Very cool... Perfectly preserved, standing upright, in water that is clear as distilled water.

 

[6079smithw]

but it leaves me with this great saying:

".......... the difference between an adventure and a disaster is that in an adventure, nobody gets killed....."

Lauri

Robert Scott and Terra Nova came to mind when I read that...