G5 tone timing

[ffexpCP]

I have a fleet of G5s. I'm testing firmware 1.31 from 1.20. I'm having issues decoding tones on conventional analog. Everything is fine in 1.20. Once updated to 1.31, it appears to work fine when tested on my bench, but when deployed to the field it will not alert. RF signal is not an issue.

I see in PPS there's tone timing adjustments. I do not recall seeing this in prior versions of PPS. I suspect Unication has tightened up the tone tolerances when they added the adjustable settings. I'm thinking my dispatch consoles and the encoder on my bench have slight timing variances, and one is within the pager's tolerances while the other is not.

Anyone know what the pager's +/- allowance is for the timing? Maybe I can fine the 'sweet' spot to work with both. Changing all the encoders and consoles is much easier said than done.

 

[policefreak]

I'm just seeing this now. Was this issue ever resolved? What County or town's dispatch frequencies are you having an issue with?

 

[wa8pyr]

I have a fleet of G5s. I'm testing firmware 1.31 from 1.20. I'm having issues decoding tones on conventional analog. Everything is fine in 1.20. Once updated to 1.31, it appears to work fine when tested on my bench, but when deployed to the field it will not alert. RF signal is not an issue.

I see in PPS there's tone timing adjustments. I do not recall seeing this in prior versions of PPS. I suspect Unication has tightened up the tone tolerances when they added the adjustable settings. I'm thinking my dispatch consoles and the encoder on my bench have slight timing variances, and one is within the pager's tolerances while the other is not.

Anyone know what the pager's +/- allowance is for the timing? Maybe I can fine the 'sweet' spot to work with both. Changing all the encoders and consoles is much easier said than done.

Verify the timing of the tones coming out of the consoles. Standard for Motorola is A tone 1 second/B Tone 3 seconds with zero gap, and 8 seconds of one tone or the other for group call (depends on whose pagers they're using). The standard for Plectron tones is A tone 3 seconds/B tone 250ms with a 250ms gap, but I haven't seen anyone use those standard Plectron settings for years; ever since programmable encoders and pagers came into use, most of the installations I've seen have used Motorola timing, no matter whose tone frequencies they were using.

Check the tone level and deviation coming out of the consoles. If it's too low or too high, it won't activate the pagers reliably (or at all) account too little audio or too much clipping and distortion. I've known a number of techs in my day who would set those levels way too high or low because someone's pagers weren't decoding correctly, and they went too far in the other direction (ie instead of keeping the consoles standard and consistent, and fixing the real problem at the pagers, they would screw up the consoles).

Also check the signal detect wait time in the pager (protocol parameter setting page); if you've got it set too long, the pager may not be decoding part of the first tone. I'd start from the current setting and work down in 20ms intervals until you get to the sweet spot where it decodes reliably. You may have to go all the way down to zero (the recommended wait time for Plectron and Reach).

 

[ffexpCP]

As suspected, the different encoders and consoles were sending tones at slightly different timing. The pager didn't care with older firmware. The newer firmware is much more picky. A few tweaks of the pager's settings and its working again with every console and encoder.

I also found this briefly discussed here: V1.31 G2-G5 Firmware Release

I'm relived to see I wasn't the only one having the issue. I just wish the change was thoroughly documented in the PPS changelog.

 

[Webodisk]

As suspected, the different encoders and consoles were sending tones at slightly different timing. The pager didn't care with older firmware. The newer firmware is much more picky. A few tweaks of the pager's settings and its working again with every console and encoder.

I also found this briefly discussed here: V1.31 G2-G5 Firmware Release

I'm relived to see I wasn't the only one having the issue. I just wish the change was thoroughly documented in the PPS changelog.

can you share the tweaks ?

 

[wa8pyr]

can you share the tweaks ?

Ditto. What was off and what was the fix? I've got several G5s around here, and enquiring minds want to know...

 

[ffexpCP]

I changed from default (Motorola) timing to user / custom. Set A tone as 1500 and B for 4000. Left everything else alone. All this was under protocol parameters.