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HOBBY LOBBY OKC CORRECTED CAP+ INFO

Joined
Sep 18, 2018
Messages
373
Location
Oklahoma City,OK
#1
Well It took me a little while after noticing https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?siteId=18695 was only partially accurate. I wanted to eavesdrop on Hobby Lobby then found it had actually 16 LSN's on that CAP+ system. I manually had to find the frequencies knowing how a CAP + rest channel behaves. I wont be submitting a update to RRDB admin due to the fact one frequency isn't listed in Hobby Lobby's license.
With that said, I have done the work for those who wanted to listen to Hobby Lobby and didn't have the time to sort it out and for those who didn't know how to find a frequency in a situation with unknown's.


Firstly you must have DSD+ Fast Lane 2.165

After that is confirmed to yourself you need to edit two files.

First one is to add this line in DSDPlus.networks
CAP+, 18695,"Hobby Lobby"
Save then close

Secondly is to add these lines in DSDPlus.frequencies
;Hobby Lobby CAP+
Cap+, 18695,1,1,463.7375,0.0,0
Cap+, 18695,1,3,463.8875,0.0,0
Cap+, 18695,1,5,464.0625,0.0,0
Cap+, 18695,1,7,464.2625,0.0,0
Cap+, 18695,1,9,464.4625,0.0,0
Cap+, 18695,1,11,464.6625,0.0,0
Cap+, 18695,1,13,464.8750,0.0,0
Cap+, 18695,1,15,463.4375,0.0,0
Save then close

I reiterate https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?siteId=18695 won't show 464.8750. Only 1-10 is accurate. I had to figure out 11-16.

I must also say that I haven't posted group names because frequencies are the first importance to any trunked system especially this kind of system due to the fact CAP+ isn't transmitting a bandplan and the REST channel is always moving unlike other types with a a parked Control Channel. Group names are easy. This system has many more groups than listed at its RRDB SSID.

If help needed just ask. If I don't know the right answer please ask your question in Voice Decoders section here at RR.

ENJOY!
 
Last edited:

mtindor

OH/WV DB Admin
Database Admin
Joined
Dec 5, 2006
Messages
7,348
Location
Carroll Co OH / EN90LN
#3
Well It took me a little while after noticing https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?siteId=18695 was only partially accurate. I wanted to eavesdrop on Hobby Lobby then found it had actually 16 LSN's on that CAP+ system. I manually had to find the frequencies knowing how a CAP + rest channel behaves. I wont be submitting a update to RRDB admin due to the fact one frequency isn't listed in Hobby Lobby's license.
With that said, I have done the work for those who wanted to listen to Hobby Lobby and didn't have the time to sort it out and for those who didn't know how to find a frequency in a situation with unknown's.


Firstly you must have DSD+ Fast Lane 2.165

After that is confirmed to yourself you need to edit two files.

First one is to add this line in DSDPlus.networks
CAP+, 18695,"Hobby Lobby"
Save then close

Secondly is to add these lines in DSDPlus.frequencies
;Hobby Lobby CAP+
Cap+, 18695,1,1,463.7375,0.0,0
Cap+, 18695,1,3,463.8875,0.0,0
Cap+, 18695,1,5,464.0625,0.0,0
Cap+, 18695,1,7,464.2625,0.0,0
Cap+, 18695,1,9,464.4625,0.0,0
Cap+, 18695,1,11,464.6625,0.0,0
Cap+, 18695,1,13,464.8750,0.0,0
Cap+, 18695,1,15,463.4375,0.0,0
Save then close

I reiterate https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?siteId=18695 won't show 464.8750. Only 1-10 is accurate. I had to figure out 11-16.

I must also say that I haven't posted group names because frequencies are the first importance to any trunked system especially this kind of system due to the fact CAP+ isn't transmitting a bandplan and the REST channel is always moving unlike other types with a a parked Control Channel. Group names are easy. This system has many more groups than listed at its RRDB SSID.

If help needed just ask. If I don't know the right answer please ask your question in Voice Decoders section here at RR.

ENJOY!
This license lists all the frequencies you have above, and more. And it lists 464.8875, which leads me to believe that your LSN 13 that you have listed (464.875) is incorrect and likely is really 464.8875.

https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?fccCallsign=WQMJ857

It looks like the database has a much different LCN order than yours. If you're positive about the LCN order, you really should submit an update. Of course, do check and see whether you might be mistaken about 464.875 (license shows 464.8875).

Mike
 
Joined
Sep 18, 2018
Messages
373
Location
Oklahoma City,OK
#4
This license lists all the frequencies you have above, and more. And it lists 464.8875, which leads me to believe that your LSN 13 that you have listed (464.875) is incorrect and likely is really 464.8875.

https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?fccCallsign=WQMJ857

It looks like the database has a much different LCN order than yours. If you're positive about the LCN order, you really should submit an update. Of course, do check and see whether you might be mistaken about 464.875 (license shows 464.8875).

Mike
It is working as I described.
 

mtindor

OH/WV DB Admin
Database Admin
Joined
Dec 5, 2006
Messages
7,348
Location
Carroll Co OH / EN90LN
#5
It is working as I described.
Perhaps, but i bet 464.875 is supposed to be 464.8875 and that your decodes on that one would be better if you had it tuning to 464.8875 instead of 464.875 via the entry in your DSDPlus.frequencies file. I know you are pretty much an expert after a week, but I'm just trying to help out out.

IF it works great, please submit the updated LCN information so that an admin can actually correct the database to reflect proper LCN order. Keep in mind the database wants LCN, not LSN. So if you do [and you should, I beg of you] submit the update, please list the active frequencies and their associated LCNs, not LSNs.

Thank you
 
Joined
Sep 18, 2018
Messages
373
Location
Oklahoma City,OK
#6
Perhaps, but i bet 464.875 is supposed to be 464.8875 and that your decodes on that one would be better if you had it tuning to 464.8875 instead of 464.875 via the entry in your DSDPlus.frequencies file. I know you are pretty much an expert after a week, but I'm just trying to help out out.

IF it works great, please submit the updated LCN information so that an admin can actually correct the database to reflect proper LCN order. Keep in mind the database wants LCN, not LSN. So if you do [and you should, I beg of you] submit the update, please list the active frequencies and their associated LCNs, not LSNs.

Thank you
Could be either the FCC made a typo or their radio techs programmed the wrong frequency. Most likely the latter. If I had it wrong it would show as a different system. It is not. It is not losing the rest channel. It is the same talk groups. Working smoothly. I am not a expert.I do catch on to things when I take a interest.
 

mtindor

OH/WV DB Admin
Database Admin
Joined
Dec 5, 2006
Messages
7,348
Location
Carroll Co OH / EN90LN
#7
Yes, a type might exist at the FCC. Yes, radio techs may have programmed it wrong. Or maybe (since it's only 1.25 khz difference) it works fine even though the actual center frequency is 464.8875. All I am asking / suggesting to you is that you [with your own eyes] verify that the center is closer to 464.875 or 464.8875. If you're running FMP24, you can type in 464.875 and then quickly look to see if it looks pretty much on frequency or if FMP24 autotunes to capture the signal at 464.8875. Then you can type in 464.8875 and hit enter and do the same thing.

I'm not saying you're wrong. But usually FCC records are right, and usually radio techs do things right. It can't hurt to use easy methods to verify. If you were tuned to 464.875 and FMP24 autocorrects/autotunes to 464.8875, you wouldn't necessarily know it unless you were watching. If you were tuned to 464.875 and the actual center was 464.8875, it would probably still decode fine simply because it would only be 1.25 khz off and you may be running a wider filter width (12.5 or 9.5, instead of the recommended 7.6).

Again, I'm just trying to be helpful. You do what you want. Submit it or don't submit it. But if you are absolutely positive of every LCN and its associated frequency, why not submit it so that others within range who might be interested could monitor the system successfully as well? The only reason that I can think of as to why you might not submit it is because you aren't confident in it? If voice following is working with your setup, there isn't any reason not to be confident that you have accurate data to correct the database with.
 
Joined
Sep 18, 2018
Messages
373
Location
Oklahoma City,OK
#8
Yes, a type might exist at the FCC. Yes, radio techs may have programmed it wrong. Or maybe (since it's only 1.25 khz difference) it works fine even though the actual center frequency is 464.8875. All I am asking / suggesting to you is that you [with your own eyes] verify that the center is closer to 464.875 or 464.8875. If you're running FMP24, you can type in 464.875 and then quickly look to see if it looks pretty much on frequency or if FMP24 autotunes to capture the signal at 464.8875. Then you can type in 464.8875 and hit enter and do the same thing.

I'm not saying you're wrong. But usually FCC records are right, and usually radio techs do things right. It can't hurt to use easy methods to verify. If you were tuned to 464.875 and FMP24 autocorrects/autotunes to 464.8875, you wouldn't necessarily know it unless you were watching. If you were tuned to 464.875 and the actual center was 464.8875, it would probably still decode fine simply because it would only be 1.25 khz off and you may be running a wider filter width (12.5 or 9.5, instead of the recommended 7.6).

Again, I'm just trying to be helpful. You do what you want. Submit it or don't submit it. But if you are absolutely positive of every LCN and its associated frequency, why not submit it so that others within range who might be interested could monitor the system successfully as well? The only reason that I can think of as to why you might not submit it is because you aren't confident in it? If voice following is working with your setup, there isn't any reason not to be confident that you have accurate data to correct the database with.
It is dead center on 464.8750 talkgroup is falling onto that frequency correctly
 

Attachments

mtindor

OH/WV DB Admin
Database Admin
Joined
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Messages
7,348
Location
Carroll Co OH / EN90LN
#9
It is dead center on 464.8750 talkgroup is falling onto that frequency correctly
Awesome. I'm glad you are correct. Keep in mind though that your screenshot of FMP24-CC shows you tuned to 463.7375 (the rest channel) and that it is dead center on 463.7375. The only frequency I questioned is 464.8875 (FCC record) vs your programming (464.875). So the screenshot really doesn't verify anything. However, you don't have to verify anything with me. I was simply trying to be helpful. I don't understand why you take offense at that. If you're right, you're right. If you're wrong, I wouldn't know it and you can still say you're right. It's a win-win for you either way.
 
Joined
Sep 18, 2018
Messages
373
Location
Oklahoma City,OK
#10
Awesome. I'm glad you are correct. Keep in mind though that your screenshot of FMP24-CC shows you tuned to 463.7375 (the rest channel) and that it is dead center on 463.7375. The only frequency I questioned is 464.8875 (FCC record) vs your programming (464.875). So the screenshot really doesn't verify anything. However, you don't have to verify anything with me. I was simply trying to be helpful. I don't understand why you take offense at that. If you're right, you're right. If you're wrong, I wouldn't know it and you can still say you're right. It's a win-win for you either way.
I would be happy to accept if I was wrong. I understand that a decode is possible if a little out of tune but thats not what is happening here. I know you want to make sure there is clear and convincing evidence of my findings. Things could have changed since that listing was made. I am wanting another Oklahoma City scanner enthusiast to chime and to help me verify. I don't know who it will be. That's why I haven't submitted an update because of the mismatch on frequency records. If someone else here can use my config and see it work that would bring up the public confidence. I am already confident but not wanting to touch RRDB submit form until other scanner enthusiasts check it out.

I added another image
 

mtindor

OH/WV DB Admin
Database Admin
Joined
Dec 5, 2006
Messages
7,348
Location
Carroll Co OH / EN90LN
#12
I would be happy to accept if I was wrong. I understand that a decode is possible if a little out of tune but thats not what is happening here. I know you want to make sure there is clear and convincing evidence of my findings. Things could have changed since that listing was made. I am wanting another Oklahoma City scanner enthusiast to chime and to help me verify. I don't know who it will be. That's why I haven't submitted an update because of the mismatch on frequency records. If someone else here can use my config and see it work that would bring up the public confidence. I am already confident but not wanting to touch RRDB submit form until other scanner enthusiasts check it out.

I added another image
I"m with wx5uif -- I'd submit it too. Being a database admin (but not in your area), I wanted to encourage you to submit it -- but at the same time that discrepency was nagging at me. You've put it to bed. It looks like 464.875 to me too. Thanks for the screenshots. You're submission would fix a bunch of false LCN data already in the DB (they probably added channels to the system at some point and changed LCNs along the way) and would add another freq. I'm sure your submission would be appreciated by those who can monitor the system, and it would be appreciated by many others including myself who just like to see accurate information in the DB.
 
Joined
Sep 18, 2018
Messages
373
Location
Oklahoma City,OK
#13
I"m with wx5uif -- I'd submit it too. Being a database admin (but not in your area), I wanted to encourage you to submit it -- but at the same time that discrepency was nagging at me. You've put it to bed. It looks like 464.875 to me too. Thanks for the screenshots. You're submission would fix a bunch of false LCN data already in the DB (they probably added channels to the system at some point and changed LCNs along the way) and would add another freq. I'm sure your submission would be appreciated by those who can monitor the system, and it would be appreciated by many others including myself who just like to see accurate information in the DB.
I was thinking the same and thats part of the fun with the hobby. the challenge of making sure everything works lol! Thanks to you and wx5uif.
I completed and sent the submit form. Took me a while to make sure that list was right having to type each frequency twice in LCN pairs. and channels. whew!
 

dave3825

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Feb 17, 2003
Messages
2,451
Location
New York
#14
To me, his first screenshot looks dead on. The second looks slightly to the right, and not centered. Not trying to get into a pissing match, just saying how it looks to me.

Anyway, I could be wrong, but I think when the cc says there is a call on channel whatever, dsd tells fmp to tune to that freq associated with that channel number.

So for kicks, I just loaded a con+ system and changed a freq in the freq file (channel 7 & 8) from (478.48750 megahertz) - (1.25 kilohertz) = 478.48625 megahertz and it runs fine, even tho the freq is wrong and not dead on, it works fine.

I would bet if he changed the freq he has, 464.875 to 1.25khz higher, 464.8875 it would work perfectly fine.. At least it does with Con+.


freq off.JPG
 
Joined
Sep 18, 2018
Messages
373
Location
Oklahoma City,OK
#15
To me, his first screenshot looks dead on. The second looks slightly to the right, and not centered. Not trying to get into a pissing match, just saying how it looks to me.

Anyway, I could be wrong, but I think when the cc says there is a call on channel whatever, dsd tells fmp to tune to that freq associated with that channel number.

So for kicks, I just loaded a con+ system and changed a freq in the freq file (channel 7 & 8) from (478.48750 megahertz) - (1.25 kilohertz) = 478.48625 megahertz and it runs fine, even tho the freq is wrong and not dead on, it works fine.

I would bet if he changed the freq he has, 464.875 to 1.25khz higher, 464.8875 it would work perfectly fine.. At least it does with Con+.


View attachment 68852
Looks dead because it was around the 5am hour when Hobby Lobby is starting the work day. It is dead center on 464.8750 . I been watching 464.8875 and nothing ever happens there at all. See second image on post #8 My RTL-SDR is dead on frequency at ppm 0.5 correction and not auto centered (-a switch).

However you are correct but that is not what is happening here. Hobby Lobby, like many other businesses do switch up frequencies outside their published FCC frequencies. We got to be flexible in this hobby when it comes to assigned frequencies and commercial entities.

Sometimes I think maybe that one repeater is off frequency. The mobiles are close enough to still receive it.
 
Last edited:

dave3825

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Feb 17, 2003
Messages
2,451
Location
New York
#16
I been watching 464.8875 and nothing ever happens there at all
Just curious, where are you watching that freq with? What do you have? I have 4 nooelec dongles and 4 different scanners. Tho the 436 is the only one that does digital. But it always helped to watch cc in sdr with DSDPlus and run the rest of the license freqs thru the scanner to get channel numbers. Aslo have run 2 instances of sdr to achieve the same end result.

Again, just curious. Taking my little guy for a walk Brb
 
Joined
Sep 18, 2018
Messages
373
Location
Oklahoma City,OK
#17
Just curious, where are you watching that freq with? What do you have? I have 4 nooelec dongles and 4 different scanners. Tho the 436 is the only one that does digital. But it always helped to watch cc in sdr with DSDPlus and run the rest of the license freqs thru the scanner to get channel numbers. Aslo have run 2 instances of sdr to achieve the same end result.

Again, just curious. Taking my little guy for a walk Brb
I am not investigating it further. I found what I found. I am 100 percent confident in my findings. There is nothing left to investigate, Thanks for your input. Have a good day.
 
Joined
Sep 18, 2018
Messages
373
Location
Oklahoma City,OK
#18
I"m with wx5uif -- I'd submit it too. Being a database admin (but not in your area), I wanted to encourage you to submit it -- but at the same time that discrepency was nagging at me. You've put it to bed. It looks like 464.875 to me too. Thanks for the screenshots. You're submission would fix a bunch of false LCN data already in the DB (they probably added channels to the system at some point and changed LCNs along the way) and would add another freq. I'm sure your submission would be appreciated by those who can monitor the system, and it would be appreciated by many others including myself who just like to see accurate information in the DB.
The RRDB SSID has been updated. https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?siteId=18695
@mtindor You had a big role too because I read a post you helped someone else with trying to locate missing frequencies some time ago that's how I figured out how to find missing frequencies. Mostly trial and error but paid off big time. I can't remember which post it was.

Thank you @fast2okc Now people can monitor it without missing tidbits. :D
 
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