How does IFERN work?

[rcpwisc]

Hi everyone:

Had a really big fire last evening about 15 miles north of where I am ... cattle, hay stock, farm machinery all lost. Very sad. There were lots of different agencies paged out to help with the fire. Dispatchers were telling agencies to switch to IFERN for fire com.

I have IFERN, IFERN2 and all the IFERN fireground channels programmed in to my GRE-600, and I didn't get one single transmission ... I could hear agencies radio back to their dispatch centers on their own fire com channels telling them they were on the scene, and those came through nice & clear, so I don't think distance was an issue. I'm wondering if I have something programmed in wrong ... ?

When WISCOM is up and fully functional, will this system eventually replace IFERN/WISPERN/WIOP and other interagency communications systems?

Thanks a lot for any help you can give.

 

[cpd38]

I could be wrong, but I think IFERN basically works like a simplex car to car type frequency so you'll only hear it if you're in the immediate vicinity.

 

[rcpwisc]

Ah ... that could be. I never thought of that...

 

[R8000]

IFERN is a simplex system.

There's a huge write up on how it's supposed to be used on the WI MABAS website. The details on it will make you go cross eyed.

When I installed IFERN on dispatch consoles, dispatchers will ask me how it's used. I tell them to talk to their boss because there's soo many policies and procedures dispatch has to go through to use it, it's almost too restricted. There was no way I was going to touch that with a 10 foot pole !

Have a look for the documents on the WI MABAS website. By doing that you are going directly to the source. There is a section for radio communications.

Sadly, some counties didn't read this as they misuse IFERN a lot.

 

[FFPM571]

Its very simple. all Dispatch agencies in a MABAS division should monitor IFERN. A designated dispatch for the MABAS division hanldes the request for a MABAS alarm that is most likley called into them over the IFERN frequency. The designated division dispatch then cross references the MABAS box card and sets off the tones. They read off who is due on the box. The local agencies monitoring IFERN get the radio alert and then dispatch the individual departments. The indvidual departments responding units go enroute to the MABAS box over IFERN. Command on the scene monitors IFERN to know who is responding and communicates with the division dispatch. Units put themselves on the scene on IFERN and are given assignments when they arrive. Also Divisions can calll other divisions over IFERN.

 

[70cutlass442]

/\ What he said... If you ever get a chance, try to monitor IFERN in the northern Illinois area. Here in Waukesha county, there is a patch that is always open for receive on the 800MHz trunked system. On any given day you can hear IFERN come alive from northern IL propagation and to hear how seamless and how flaunt the dispatchers are when using it is pretty cool. When used properly, its a great asset. It is suppose to be used for limited coordination I.E enroute, on scene, where is staging, ect. NEVER for fire ground traffic. We use this a lot since IFERN is VHF, everyone knows its VHF, and you can at least get to staging where they will take care of other communication needs if you need too. I will say it is frustrating however when Racine county can't answer MABAS after they requested it... all comes back to training and SOPs.

 

[CrabbyMilton]

Cutlass is right on target with this and there is also a patch on the Milwaukee County system as well. At the risk of blasting some, there are many departments in IL. that use the IFERN system almost perfectly where the dispatcher sounds "old school" and it's easy to take. Contrast that with a handlful in some areas of WI. that stammer and some even giggle over the network. I know that some outstate departments never used this system before but you'd think they would train and practice so that they don't come on the air and sound like a teenager playing with an FRS.

 

[ToDaMax]

My favorite subject. I think MABAS is a wonderful asset and definate, by far, my favorite thing to listen to. With the simulcasted IFERN Channel are all the fireground channels (Red,White,Blue,Gold,Black,Grey) but can only be heard when you are on literally top of the scene. Southern Suburbs of Milwaukee transmit over IFERN for local Mutual-Aid, Non-MABAS incidents (usually for ALS Intercepts and Working Stills), so you will hear them over IFERN. IFERN Patches are normally seen on TRS.

Contrast that with a handlful in some areas of WI. that stammer and some even giggle over the network. I know that some outstate departments never used this system before but you'd think they would train and practice so that they don't come on the air and sound like a teenager playing with an FRS.

If anyone was listening to a Mass Casualy Incident Training Excercise in Cedarburg earlier in June (I belive the 6th), that is a prime example of a dispatcher who is a clueless studderbox.

 

[CrabbyMilton]

I remember that one in Cedarburg. That dispatcher was alomost painful to listen to but hopefully(with good reason) will improve.I'm glad Wauwatosa is I believe the main MABAS "clearing house" for Milwaukee County. They have some of the smoothest dispatchers that never seem to fumble and stumble. One of the male dispatchers( I think I know his name but will not disclose) has been there at least 20 years and is always calm sounding on both the fire and police side of things.

 

[ToDaMax]

I remember that one in Cedarburg. That dispatcher was alomost painful to listen to but hopefully(with good reason) will improve.

Its sad to say, thats her best. I wont go into details, but trust me when I say she isn't going to get any better than that. (You should hear some of her other page outs)

 

[sfd119]

IFERN isn't used in NW Wisconsin. We have it all in our radios but we stick to our County Wide tac channel or City Wide tac channel. Multi-agency may require use to use FG Blue but that's it.

 

[70cutlass442]

/\ MABAS will get there eventually. Will take a while for the po dunk departments to get use to it. We still have guys who think its easier to piece meal resources together... which in some cases is true. but its very easy to deplete a regions resources with one large scale incident... then who covers the rest of the area for other incidents?

 

[ToDaMax]

So far this is the spread of MABAS in Wisconsin

MABAS Wisconsin - Active Divisions

I believe northwestern Wisconsin will see MABAS very soon

 

[FFPM571]

I find it intresting that there are counties that are not part of MABAS still. With all the talk of sharing resources and interoperatiblity that some have not joined yet

 

[sfd119]

Well, it's the old mentality of we don't need help. Up here, if an agency is out on an incident, they'll request mutual aid from the next department closest for what they need. Multiple departments will go depending on the scene's IC.

As for station coverage, it's rare another call will come in when your department is on scene or out with a mutual aid. Generally, a department will only send half of it's equipment to a scene with the other half "on standby" in case something happens. They'll request mutual aid from another jurisdiction if they are still short resources.

There are a few department that want to do MABAS but many do not because we all handle mutual aid quite well on our own.

 

[ToDaMax]

There are a few department that want to do MABAS but many do not because we all handle mutual aid quite well on our own.

Like the saying goes, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it".

 

[70cutlass442]

Well, it's the old mentality of we don't need help. Up here, if an agency is out on an incident, they'll request mutual aid from the next department closest for what they need. Multiple departments will go depending on the scene's IC.

As for station coverage, it's rare another call will come in when your department is on scene or out with a mutual aid. Generally, a department will only send half of it's equipment to a scene with the other half "on standby" in case something happens. They'll request mutual aid from another jurisdiction if they are still short resources.

There are a few department that want to do MABAS but many do not because we all handle mutual aid quite well on our own.

I agree and disagree with you at the same time. I guess without knowing anything about your dept. I can't pass judgement. I work at a somewhat rural dept (1300-1400 calls a year) We stay busy to say the least, but not a big time city by any means. Lets say you guys get a structure fire in the middle of the day.. will you have a big enough turnout from your own dept? You say you mutual aid well, but what if all of your surrounding depts are helping on one fireground, and someone wrecks their car on the other end of town... do you now have to pull a resource from even further away, thus increasing response time? We do automatic mutual aid which works great. but there is still the back filling of apparatus that we no longer need to think of with MABAS. Its not fun to tax a corner of the county of everything, then catch another major incident!

 

[sfd119]

I agree and disagree with you at the same time. I guess without knowing anything about your dept. I can't pass judgement. I work at a somewhat rural dept (1300-1400 calls a year) We stay busy to say the least, but not a big time city by any means. Lets say you guys get a structure fire in the middle of the day.. will you have a big enough turnout from your own dept? You say you mutual aid well, but what if all of your surrounding depts are helping on one fireground, and someone wrecks their car on the other end of town... do you now have to pull a resource from even further away, thus increasing response time? We do automatic mutual aid which works great. but there is still the back filling of apparatus that we no longer need to think of with MABAS. Its not fun to tax a corner of the county of everything, then catch another major incident!

We have a good turn out at all of our calls.

We can pull a resource from far away or request a neighboring department. It's unlikely that we have two incidents at once. Our departments are layed out quite well within the county...most departments are 10 minutes away from each other so it's not a problem to get other agencies rolling.