I can't get my 796D to work in Burlington County!!

[davesdaughter]

:roll:

Please don't laugh at my lack of knowledge...Being a newbie, I desperately need help!! I tried my best but the scanner still won't work. This is what I did so far....
In Bank 1 only, I entered the system frequencies that are listed on this site for Burlington County (North, NWest, NCentral, NEast, West and East). Being that they had no Control Channels listed, I also entered the primary and secondary control channels listed in groups 1, 2 and 7 as well as site 3, 5 and 6. So basically, when I entered all of this info, it took up channels 1 through 64 on Bank 1. I understand this is ok since they are all on the same trunking system.

Then in the trunk column of the software, I set it to 'yes'. In the talk ID section, I entered the 10 Police Talkgroups and the 3 Talkgroups (in the format 16112), thereby using 13 talkgroup id's.

Then I selected "motorola type2/apco 25 uhf" as my trunking system and selected trunk bank "on", activity id "off".

Lastly I entered the 3 base, spacing and offset settings.

From what I understand this is all I should have needed to do but when I press scan, I was only picking up "Northwest". When I turned the activity id to "on" I only pickup "NorthCentral".

Prior to Sunday, I never touched a scanner in my LIFE, so please feel free to talk down. Any help would be GREATLY appreciated. I called uniden, but they were no help. They said everything sounds right, however, they had me add the Control Channels (prior to that I received static).

Can anyone PLEASE help! Why won't my scanner work and which regions should I be picking up? THANK YOU SOOOO MUCH!!![

Ps. I can email the *.ssn file from the software provided if you'd rather see what I did.

/b]

 

[burlcoradio]

Here is where to start:

Make sure all 64 channels are set to MOT or equivelant mode to designate them as system frequencies of the trunking system. They should not be set to FM.

Next, make sure that the extended table that you have entered is being selected by that bank. It should be set to 'extended' and not set to 'normal'.

I hope this is helpful.

Paul

 

[davesdaughter]

796 burlington

Ok, I have the mode set to "NFM", but I'm not following you on the extended table. I don't see extended table anywhere.

 

[burlcoradio]

I wish I could be more help to you but I do not have a BC796D radio. The suggestions from my previous post were based on problems that I have seen encountered on a Radio Shack PRO-96.

There are other members here that are using a 796D to monitor Burlington County and they report that it works great... so don't give up !

The extended table I mentioned may be referred to as a multi offset/base table on the 796D (of which there are three total for Burlington County). You did say that you entered them but have you enabled them? Check out the bottom of this post:

http://www.radioreference.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=16809

This table must be properly entered into your radio and the bank must be set to use that table in order to receive all of the trunked talkgroups.

Paul

 

[fmon]

Pauls method with th Pro-96 is also using Win96. For your 796, I will give you the procedures for the 785, which should be the same. Assuming you have the correct freqs entered and the data for your system is correct in RR.
In the selected bank Press
Menu
2
2
E
1
1
4
E
500.3250
E
12.5
E
380
E
E
502.4250
E
12.5
E
530
E
E
506.4750
E
12.5
E
559
E
SCAN

If you do not have ID's programmed, Press and hold TRUNK, you sould now be in ID SEARCH.

 

[davesdaughter]

I had the base, offset and spacing entered. I noticed that the ones listed on BCFirechiefs.org were inconsistent from Radioreference.com, but have since learned that the ones on radio reference are accurate.

I started playing around last night and put only the pemberton region (NE) in on Bank 2. I entered the 13 talk id's listed in the Philly ebook as well as the base/offset/spacing entries. It worked great!

So then I decided to enter the remaining regions (still inputing the 3 b/o/s entries as well as the 10 talk groups), and now I hear nothing.

I should be able to enter all of Burlington in 1 bank, correct? I am not entering state police since they are a different trunking system, but I did enter N, NE, NW, NC, N & E all on one bank and now I hear nothing. It was late so I didn't play around too much and I'm hoping that it was just a dead time period. Please confirm if it is ok to put all in one bank and if in doing so, I should do something else "special". Thanks guys! I truly appreciate your help!!!

 

[ericcarlson]

I should be able to enter all of Burlington in 1 bank, correct? I am not entering state police since they are a different trunking system, but I did enter N, NE, NW, NC, N & E all on one bank and now I hear nothing.

Each site/zone must be programmed as a separate system in a separate bank. Also keep in mind that you may not be within reception range of all the sites in the system.

-Eric

 

[davesdaughter]

Distance definately isn't the issue since I live virtually on the cusp of North Central, Northeast and Northwest.

However, so even though all of Burlington County operates on the same Motorola Type2/P25 UHF as well as on the same talk groups and the same base/offset/spacing, I must put each of the 8 regions in a separate bank? Because each region only has about 10 frequencies and I'll pretty much use up all of my talk banks on 1 county. Is this what you are saying? Sorry to be dense!

Thanks!

 

[ericcarlson]

However, so even though all of Burlington County operates on the same Motorola Type2/P25 UHF as well as on the same talk groups and the same base/offset/spacing, I must put each of the 8 regions in a separate bank? Because each region only has about 10 frequencies and I'll pretty much use up all of my talk banks on 1 county. Is this what you are saying?

Yes, if you want to monitor more than one site at a time. If you only want to scan one site at a time, then you could use one bank if you lock out the frequencies for the sites that you are not interested in.

In order for a talkgroup to be heard on a given site, there must be a radio on, tuned to that talkgroup and affiliated with (in range of) the given site. In general, all talkgroups will not be broadcast on all sites at all times. The system is setup using multiple sites which makes it similar to a cellular phone system; radio users can roam on the system and talkgroups are only broadcast from the sites where they are needed.

-Eric

 

[davesdaughter]

I'm not following you. Too many generalizations for me (sorry!). I think what you are saying is that if I want to scan the North Region and the Northeast region at the same time, I must put North in Bank 1 and Northeast in bank 2. The only way to put more than one region on one bank is to lock out all but one region within the bank?

But I'm still not following the "why" of your response. For simplicity sake, let's say my talkgroups are A through F. Are you saying that even though it is A through F for all 8 regions, each bank can only scan the first region in the bank over and over?? That it will never search A through F in the second, third, fourth region? How does it know it is a different region?

 

[davesdaughter]

If so, how does it know when the frequencies are then a 2nd, 3rd, 4th region so as NOT to scan them. Everything is identical for each region, so I'm not sure I follow.

Thanks!!

 

[ericcarlson]

I think what you are saying is that if I want to scan the North Region and the Northeast region at the same time, I must put North in Bank 1 and Northeast in bank 2.

Yes.

The only way to put more than one region on one bank is to lock out all but one region within the bank?

You can only monitor one site per bank. All I was saying is that if you program all the frequencies in one bank, you can lock out all but one site's frequencies and monitor that site. To monitor another site, you would lock out all the frequencies except for the other site.

But I'm still not following the "why" of your response. For simplicity sake, let's say my talkgroups are A through F. Are you saying that even though it is A through F for all 8 regions, each bank can only scan the first region in the bank over and over?? That it will never search A through F in the second, third, fourth region? How does it know it is a different region?

All the sites are a part of one system. There is one system controller (computer) that keeps track of all the talkgroups on the system. Just because a talkgroup is intended for use in the northwest area does not mean that talkgroup will only show up on the northwest site. If a radio on the system (not a scanner) is monitoring a "northwest" talkgroup but the site that the radio happens to be physically closest to is the southeast site, then the southeast site will carry traffic for the talkgroup (in addition to any other sites with affiliated radios monitoring that talkgroup). A talkgroup will be broadcast on 1 or more sites depending on which sites are needed to provide coverage to radios (not scanners) monitoring that talkgroup. A scanner does not "affiliate" with the system; it just passively monitors what is going on.

Generally speaking, a talkgroup "X" intended for use in the northwest area should always show up on the northwest site. However, that same talkgroup "X" will also show up at the same time on as many other sites as necessary to provide coverage to all radios monitoring the talkgroup.

Since you never know which sites a particular talkgroup may be broadcast on, most people prefer to monitor as many sites as they can receive.

-Eric

 

[davesdaughter]

Eric,
THANK YOU! That makes much more sense. So if I have one bank with North and Northeast Regions....even though talk group 11111 is used for both regions it is not physically possible for it to send 1 talk group id to 2 different regions in the same bank, yes?

I think you are talking to me about control channels....that 11111 will hit a NE control channel or 111111 will hit a N control channel, whichever is closer and send me that frequency transmission only....unless I had them in different banks, yes?

I think the fog is slightly lifting!

 

[davesdaughter]

Part of my confusion is that I keep calling them Regions, but others call them sites and other things. I confused site with trunking system, so when I was told only one site per bank, I thought I was doing so.

The user manual does not explain banks and monitoring sites very clearly. Someone told me that Burlington is a multi site and this is why each must be separate. I'll look into what a multi site is another day (I'm GUESSING the sharing of talkgroups over various sites?)

Thank you again! How did you learn all of this? Any reading you can direct me to?

 

[ericcarlson]

The user manual does not explain banks and monitoring sites very clearly. Someone told me that Burlington is a multi site and this is why each must be separate. I'll look into what a multi site is another day (I'm GUESSING the sharing of talkgroups over various sites?)

You're on the right path. The Burlington County system is a networked system, meaning there are multiple sites with different frequencies all connected together. There is one central controller (computer) that knows about all the radios on the system and determines what talkgroups are broadcast on what sites to provide coverage to these radios.

Thank you again! How did you learn all of this? Any reading you can direct me to?

I've been into trunked scanning for awhile so it's all familar to me. This page has more explanation of how Motorola SmartZone systems work:
http://www.freqofnature.com/SmartZone101.html

-Eric

 

[davesdaughter]

smartzone

Thank you! I printed out and read the article. I have a strong feeling that uniden didn't realize that I am was working with a smartzone system when I called because they told me it was ok to put all of the sites in bank 1 since they were all the same trunking system.

I have now entered all sites (1 through 8), each in its own bank. I entered the 3 base/offset/spacing combo's in each of the 8 banks. I am using the Philadelphia ebook for the frequency info, so they list 12 police talkgroups and 6 fire/ems talkgroups...I list those same 18 talkgroups in each of the 8 banks, correct? Then on page 8 of the Burlington County ebook it lists County mobile-to-mobile frequencies (10 freqs listed) and County Conventional Repeater Frequencies. (3 listed). Do I enter them in a separate bank or can I tack them on to one of the other 8 sites/banks?

Thanks!!!

 

[ericcarlson]

You can put conventional frequencies in unused channels in any of the banks.

-Eric

 

[fmon]

Re: smartzone

I have now entered all sites (1 through 8), each in its own bank.

davesdaughter

RRDatabase only list Control Channels for sites 3, 5 and 6. Do you hear any Control Channels on sites 201 through 206?

Edit: I miss read your above, thinking you used 8 banks.

 

[davesdaughter]

eric,

Thank you! I am now hearing much more on the scanner. I put the conventionals in bank 1 along with site 01. I should be using the same exact talkgroups (police/ems/fire/etc) over and over in each of the 8 banks (ie sites), correct?


Frank,

Yes, I meant to type that I had sites 01 through 08 in banks 01 through 08. Eric gave me a bit of an education on Smartzones. Burlington operates with Smartzone technology. Per the link Eric references above..."With todays scanners, you can only scan the talkgroups of one Smartzone site at a time." "A simulcast subsystem...is one Smartzone site." So I now have each site in its own bank and I'm picking up more than one site now.

I ordered the Philadelphia ebook and it lists control channels for all 8 sites. These are the control channel capable frequencies listed by ebook:

Site 01 507.6000, 507.5000, 507.3250
Site 02 508.4000, 507.9250, 507.4250
Site 03 508.4750, 508.4250, 508.1500
Site 04 508.6500, 508.575, 508.5250
Site 05 507.7000, 508.5000 (future), 507.3750, 507.2750
Site 06 502.6750, 502.5750
Site 07 502.5500, 501.7500
Site 08 501.6500, 500.8000

They also list control channels for site 9 and 10 (warren grove and sweetwater), however, I believe those sites are not up yet due to permit issues.

The ebook also listed a few additional talkgroups. I am still trying to confirm, however, if I put ALL of the talkgroups (ems/fire/police) in each of the banks for each of the sites. I think yes.

 

[ericcarlson]

Thank you! I am now hearing much more on the scanner. I put the conventionals in bank 1 along with site 01. I should be using the same exact talkgroups (police/ems/fire/etc) over and over in each of the 8 banks (ie sites), correct?

Yes.

-Eric