AR-DV10 Internal images and tests

[G7HID]

Its a bit like What HiFi claiming different HDMI Cables give different qualities of picture, as soon as they published that there was no point in reading any of the drivel they printed or wrote on their website.

Independent reviews backed up with technical info are the ones to read, anything where money is involved is likely to be biased.

What he said....

Mike

 

[TMac20]

How many people have issues with their DV10

Trying to put together a bigger list of users that have either returned their DV10 and why or continue to have issues and are not able to return for refund. Some users have been in touch directly and is appreciated.

 

[mrkelso]

Trying to put together a bigger list of users that have either returned their DV10 and why or continue to have issues and are not able to return for refund. Some users have been in touch directly and is appreciated.

Add me to the list

 

[hardsuit]

So, still ongoing problems with AOR-DV10 ? Will AOR ever fix the DV10 to make it work ad Advertised ?guess I will be buying a ICOM IC-R30 to use until the Release of the WH TRX-100 .

 

[woodpecker]

Trying to put together a bigger list of users that have either returned their DV10 and why or continue to have issues and are not able to return for refund. Some users have been in touch directly and is appreciated.

All DV10s have the same frequency error / drift problem, if its tuned to a stable unmodulated carrier in SSB mode and the audio output monitored with a sound card you can see the pathetic attempt to keep it on frequency as the frequency jumps and wobbles by as much +/- 50Hz as it drifts, you can hear the warble.

We decompiled the firmware to see what was going on, these formula are used:-

PLL_REF = (CPU Temp - C1) x ((C4 - C3) / (C2 - C1)) + C3
OFFSET = (CPU Temp - C1) x ((C4 - C3) / (C2 - C1)) + C3

CPU Temp comes from the RX63 internal sensor, calculated from hex into 0.1 deg C steps. C1 is the start of the temperature block which are 5 or 10 degree blocks, ie 300 is 30 degrees C. C2 is the end of the temperature block ie 350 for 35 degrees C. C3 and C4 are the PLL_REF and Offset constants at the start and end of the temperature block.

All the formula does is takes the values for PLL_REF and OFFSET AOR have GUESSED will put the DV10 on frequency at the beginning and end of each block, the difference is calculated (C4 - C3) then divided by the number of 0.1 degree steps in the block (C2 - C1), 50 for a 5 degree block or 100 for a 10 degree block. The adjustment value is then added to the PLL_REF and OFFSET temp block start value.

The result is that every few milliseconds PLL_REF and OFFSET are jumped around by as much as +/- 50Hz.

First problem, CPU temp is extracted from the internal sensor in the RX63, this temperature is not the temperature of the XCO so depending whether the backlight is on or off and power connected or disconnected the XCO heats up differently from the CPU, the 2 temperatures do not track the same way.

Second problem, the 2 sets of constants in C3 and C4 are way off on my DV10 which means they probably all drift with different gradients.

Third problem, the adjustment values are added on top of the DV10 base PLL_REF and base OFFSET, comparing 3 radios all have had different base values, 1 by a value 16000 lower than another.

Fourth problem, even if this was an acceptable method (which its not) the adjustment should be much less frequent to avoid the continuous warbling.

Fifth problem, the cpu core temp wobbles up and down but the XCO always drifts the same way.

Their botched fix must have taken about 30 minutes, clearly no time or engineering thought went into it, instead they decided to continue to add more useless features.

None of AORs products can now be trusted, they refuse to accept there is any problem despite it being proven, the only way AOR could ever be trusted is to admit the problem, recall and fix their faulty rubbish. At this point they continue their arrogrant ignorant stance and continue to try and sell the DV10 with its many defects.

 

[Julienroberts]

DV10 does have some issues for sure , but I also believe firmware will correct issues after all it is a SDR. Unit period

 

[mrkelso]

DV10 does have some issues for sure , but I also believe firmware will correct issues after all it is a SDR. Unit period

Maybe, if we ever see any more updates.

 

[grosminet]

Maybe Nxdn 9600 for christmas and manual setting modes (6k 12k) for digital modes

 

[mrkelso]

Maybe Nxdn 9600 for christmas and manual setting modes (6k 12k) for digital modes

I doubt it very much.

 

[oceans777]

How many people have issues with their DV10

Trying to put together a bigger list of users that have either returned their DV10 and why or continue to have issues and are not able to return for refund. Some users have been in touch directly and is appreciated.

We had two of the $799 US DV-10’s at firmware 1810A over Nov, early Dec and both had to be returned for refunds. First arrived without the paper manual or microcard but with telescoping and the rubber antenna. It immediately had disturbing internal noise on audio that was popping and crackling on all frequencies so badly that we assumed it was a defect, CPU/backlight related. Testing P-25 Type 1 and DMR seemed to confirm this as we had a few initial DMR decode then after 10 minutes, none would. No P-25 ever decoded to audio, either missed it completely despite the signal strength clearly moving up showing plenty of signal (on active frequencies being decoded by IC-R30’s) or it only managed a second of garbled voice. This was using the same 23 P-25 frequencies that the Icom IC-R30’s (x2) both easily decode to voice all day using the factory telescoping antennas. Returned the DV-10 as defective. The retailer said it was the first complaint they’d heard of for the DV-10 and no problems at all returning it. Also said they’d sold quite a few.
Second DV-10 was slightly better and included manual, generic 8 GB microcard with no telescoping, only rubber antenna. Still constant crackling and popping on every frequency and band we tried. The only pause in this was changing to the alkaline battery pack with new Duracell’s, crackling stopped for a few minutes then returned. We tried every way we could think of to spoon feed P-25 Type 1 working on four other radios that only do Type 1 same spec at every level to the DV-10, we got three just barely decoded to voice at 12 AM using an 800 MHz Yagi and Stridsberg 800MHz multicouper, same frequencies/system at 9AM would not decode again nor any P25. Again the IC-R30’s decoded the same instantly with clear audio.
DMR/NXDN worked randomly, the next day we’d get nothing, DMR and NXDN were correctly at 6.25 and on AUT1 or manual digital modes made no difference. NSQ, Auto squelch etc made no difference except it simply missed them unless we forced squelch open, then we’d get garbled bursts or warble noise occasionally. We repeatedly confirmed not encrypted or incompatible modes. Noted the crackling noise was worse in digital modes and especially harsh if RF Gain was enabled over AGC.

We did not test DSTAR although dPMR did decode once in AUT1 mode. VHF air was never quite equal to IC-R30‘s and always present was the crackling noise.
On HF 80 and 40 meters, oceanic aero, VOLMETs, GCHFS reception, HF was only readable on an AOR LA400 Loop but still many buried in noise on stations coming in very clearly on the AR8200 MK3 and IC-R30’s which all performed well on Par EF-SWL Endfedz and the active Wellbrook 1530LNP Loop. The DV-10 was predictably overwhelmed by the Wellbrook and even Par, with attenuation and Par broadcast filter. The IC-R30’s were fine on both with only ATT 1 of three possible attenuation settings, but mostly not needed at all.

Interestingly we never had to retune or correct drift to keep clear voice on HF even after 3 hours, this was the case over all 6 mornings/evenings we monitored using 2 IC-R8600’s to find signals for the DV-10. Returned for refund, again the retailer had no issue with it and again said it was baffling.

The DV1 with its dayglo display almost smaller than my APC UPS screen size is weird but works and grows on you - the two DV-10’s only consistencies were rapidly draining batteries and the noise issues.

I continue using my other AOR 5000’s and hope they remain a strong business because they’ve been great over decades to me. AOR advised us Yeasu is the warranty support place for US blocked DV-10’s. We did not contact Yeasu because of a short return window and no reason to believe they can be repaired or resolved for our needs.

 

[oceans777]

Also the serial numbers on the units we tested were AA670xxx.

 

[c0ne]

Thanks for sharing your findings, most of them sound familiar

 

[woodpecker]

Testing P-25 Type 1 and DMR seemed to confirm this as we had a few initial DMR decode then after 10 minutes, none would.

The initial decode, then nothing decoded, is likely due to the frequency having drifted too far.

The retailer said it was the first complaint they’d heard of for the DV-10

They all say that, they lie, the one with no manual and card had probably already been returned by someone else.

Until AOR admit the problem and fix it (it can't be fixed in firmware) there is no point in buying a DV10 no matter what discount is being offered.

 

[c0ne]

DV10 does have some issues for sure , but I also believe firmware will correct issues after all it is a SDR. Unit period

So basically you say, that regardless any hardware/design flaws a software defined radio always can be fixed by firmware because its a software defined radio?? With all respect, this is clearly not a comment backed-up by knowledge Don't you think that if AOR could fix these problems, they would be fixed by now? Try addressing some of the issues to AOR and see how AOR welcomes them

 

[grosminet]

ARO FRance /Prosic refused the return of my ARDV10 . Too late

 

[G7HID]

Quelle surprise....

Mike

 

[woodpecker]

ARO FRance /Prosic refused the return of my ARDV10 . Too late

How did you pay?

If you used Paypal or a card charge it back as not fit for purpose as features printed in the manual still do not exist or work properly.

 

[c0ne]

AOR DV10 backlight interference

When the back-light is turned on, you can see the interference on the S-meter and it drops when the back-light goes off again. poorly shielded

 

[SigIntel8600]

This is great info. Thanks for the awesome review.

We had two of the $799 US DV-10’s at firmware 1810A over Nov, early Dec and both had to be returned for refunds. First arrived without the paper manual or microcard but with telescoping and the rubber antenna. It immediately had disturbing internal noise on audio that was popping and crackling on all frequencies so badly that we assumed it was a defect, CPU/backlight related. Testing P-25 Type 1 and DMR seemed to confirm this as we had a few initial DMR decode then after 10 minutes, none would. No P-25 ever decoded to audio, either missed it completely despite the signal strength clearly moving up showing plenty of signal (on active frequencies being decoded by IC-R30’s) or it only managed a second of garbled voice. This was using the same 23 P-25 frequencies that the Icom IC-R30’s (x2) both easily decode to voice all day using the factory telescoping antennas. Returned the DV-10 as defective. The retailer said it was the first complaint they’d heard of for the DV-10 and no problems at all returning it. Also said they’d sold quite a few.
Second DV-10 was slightly better and included manual, generic 8 GB microcard with no telescoping, only rubber antenna. Still constant crackling and popping on every frequency and band we tried. The only pause in this was changing to the alkaline battery pack with new Duracell’s, crackling stopped for a few minutes then returned. We tried every way we could think of to spoon feed P-25 Type 1 working on four other radios that only do Type 1 same spec at every level to the DV-10, we got three just barely decoded to voice at 12 AM using an 800 MHz Yagi and Stridsberg 800MHz multicouper, same frequencies/system at 9AM would not decode again nor any P25. Again the IC-R30’s decoded the same instantly with clear audio.
DMR/NXDN worked randomly, the next day we’d get nothing, DMR and NXDN were correctly at 6.25 and on AUT1 or manual digital modes made no difference. NSQ, Auto squelch etc made no difference except it simply missed them unless we forced squelch open, then we’d get garbled bursts or warble noise occasionally. We repeatedly confirmed not encrypted or incompatible modes. Noted the crackling noise was worse in digital modes and especially harsh if RF Gain was enabled over AGC.

We did not test DSTAR although dPMR did decode once in AUT1 mode. VHF air was never quite equal to IC-R30‘s and always present was the crackling noise.
On HF 80 and 40 meters, oceanic aero, VOLMETs, GCHFS reception, HF was only readable on an AOR LA400 Loop but still many buried in noise on stations coming in very clearly on the AR8200 MK3 and IC-R30’s which all performed well on Par EF-SWL Endfedz and the active Wellbrook 1530LNP Loop. The DV-10 was predictably overwhelmed by the Wellbrook and even Par, with attenuation and Par broadcast filter. The IC-R30’s were fine on both with only ATT 1 of three possible attenuation settings, but mostly not needed at all.

Interestingly we never had to retune or correct drift to keep clear voice on HF even after 3 hours, this was the case over all 6 mornings/evenings we monitored using 2 IC-R8600’s to find signals for the DV-10. Returned for refund, again the retailer had no issue with it and again said it was baffling.

The DV1 with its dayglo display almost smaller than my APC UPS screen size is weird but works and grows on you - the two DV-10’s only consistencies were rapidly draining batteries and the noise issues.

I continue using my other AOR 5000’s and hope they remain a strong business because they’ve been great over decades to me. AOR advised us Yeasu is the warranty support place for US blocked DV-10’s. We did not contact Yeasu because of a short return window and no reason to believe they can be repaired or resolved for our needs.