I have not heard any transmissions from Manistee city fire at all. When they call on the radio I can hear the dispatcher responding but not the transmissions from medic 5
@Thunderbolt
@Thunderbolt
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Manistee City Fire
- Thread starter Brettame5
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Manistee City Fire is on the MPSCS. Most or all MMR EMS units (who is the EMS provider in Manistee) is entirely MPSCS based. Most rural departments in the county are still on VHF with MDC1200 on their radios.
MDC1200 is a signaling protocol that is used for radio identification. For example, If I were to key up my radio, it would send a data burst at the beginning of my transmission while I heard a ‘push to talk’ tone that would signal to all other radios on the channel that mine was transmitting and would either show up as my unit number or name.
I believe MMR is the medic stationed at City Fire.
I believe MMR is the medic stationed at City Fire.
MMR has Bravo 304, sometimes 2 being Bravo 301, out of Manistee hospital and Alpha 302 out of Maple Grove fire station. City Fire has its own ambulance (Medic 5). There is also a BLS ambulance that Norman Twp. Vol. Fire runs when possible (145A)
ffemtjg
Member
Brettame5
Couple of questions;
When you say you hear the Dispatcher, is this on a VHF channel or on MPSCS?
I suspect that you are hearing them on VHF based on your description earlier. They may have the VHF channel connected to an MPSCS talk group to rebroadcast the Dispatcher side of the conversation.
Which tower site do you have your scanner listening to?
Since there isn't a simulcast site in the county, you will only hear them if there is a radio affiliated on the talk group they are using is on the tower site you are listening to.
You are also correct on the Medic. Manistee City fire went from non-transporting BLS service to transporting Paramedic service in about 2009 timeframe.
You may also not be hearing them because they are using an MDT in Medic 5. The last time I was up to visit, they had a tablet in the cab and may using it as a data terminal to advise dispatch on status.
Couple of questions;
When you say you hear the Dispatcher, is this on a VHF channel or on MPSCS?
I suspect that you are hearing them on VHF based on your description earlier. They may have the VHF channel connected to an MPSCS talk group to rebroadcast the Dispatcher side of the conversation.
Which tower site do you have your scanner listening to?
Since there isn't a simulcast site in the county, you will only hear them if there is a radio affiliated on the talk group they are using is on the tower site you are listening to.
You are also correct on the Medic. Manistee City fire went from non-transporting BLS service to transporting Paramedic service in about 2009 timeframe.
You may also not be hearing them because they are using an MDT in Medic 5. The last time I was up to visit, they had a tablet in the cab and may using it as a data terminal to advise dispatch on status.
Manistee county primarily uses VHF for operations in the rural parts of the county and MPSCS for select departments and Mutual Aid. They are simulcast from VHF to MPSCS but MPSCS does not simulcast to VHF.
Last summer, I was able to hear Medic units from the city and MMR on VHF, but upon listening recently I can't hear them anymore and their VHF RIDs are not showing up on my CID list any longer.
Last summer, I was able to hear Medic units from the city and MMR on VHF, but upon listening recently I can't hear them anymore and their VHF RIDs are not showing up on my CID list any longer.
The dispatcher dispatches on 151.445 (Fire 1). 51E911 on the MPSCS is the EMS dispatch and everything the dispatcher and only the dispatcher says on either can be heard on the other.
The idea of them having an MDT is not far-fetched but after tones go out I can hear the dispatcher responding to Medic 5. Ex " Clear, Medic 5 Enroute, 22:07". It's not just for that. Anything Medic 5 says I cant hear but dispatch responds to. This includes all city fire units. It has crossed my mind that City Fire could be encrypted on their end but that wouldn't make sense and is a longshot
ffemtjg
Member
First, I assume that your Fire 1 frequency is a typo. That should be 154.445MHz
Second, the Dispatcher is most likely simulcasting on those channels that you mention. I suspect that this is in addition to whatever talk group that the units are actually responding to the Dispatcher on. IE, the Dispatcher could be transmitting across VHF, 51E911, and 51F911 all at the same time via their console, which is pretty common. The units in the field, City Fire and MMR could be talking on 51F911 and if your scanner is stopped on either VHF or 51E911 you wouldn't hear them. As nvanw27 mentioned, the MPSCS talk groups don't crossover to the VHF side.
I doubt that the field units are encrypted, not saying that they couldn't be but doubtful.
Couple of suggestions;
1: Switch to search mode the next time you know that they are on a run. You may find a new talkgroup that they are using or that you may have one programmed incorrectly in your scanner, etc.
2: Since I don't know how you have your scanner set up, ie which tower site or sites that you are listening to, I would suggest running talk group searches on both the Onekama and Freesoil towers. Given that City Fire mostly operates in a valley between the 2 sites, they could be affiliating with either site depending on where they are in the city.
Second, the Dispatcher is most likely simulcasting on those channels that you mention. I suspect that this is in addition to whatever talk group that the units are actually responding to the Dispatcher on. IE, the Dispatcher could be transmitting across VHF, 51E911, and 51F911 all at the same time via their console, which is pretty common. The units in the field, City Fire and MMR could be talking on 51F911 and if your scanner is stopped on either VHF or 51E911 you wouldn't hear them. As nvanw27 mentioned, the MPSCS talk groups don't crossover to the VHF side.
I doubt that the field units are encrypted, not saying that they couldn't be but doubtful.
Couple of suggestions;
1: Switch to search mode the next time you know that they are on a run. You may find a new talkgroup that they are using or that you may have one programmed incorrectly in your scanner, etc.
2: Since I don't know how you have your scanner set up, ie which tower site or sites that you are listening to, I would suggest running talk group searches on both the Onekama and Freesoil towers. Given that City Fire mostly operates in a valley between the 2 sites, they could be affiliating with either site depending on where they are in the city.
ffemtjg
Member
So I've been listening to the Broadcastify Manistee County Fire and EMS feed today. I have been hearing Medic 5 on the feed. I am hearing what I presume is an MDC1200 identifier at the end of each their transmissions, so they may be using the VHF side. The feed doesn't provide alpha tags, so I don't know what the feed provider has the channels labeled as. I am hearing a difference in receive quality between when a north county unit talks to dispatch and when Medic 5 talks. I don't know where the feed receiver is located either.
I also noticed on the Manistee County database page that the VHF system has two repeaters/transmitters. I'm not sure of how they are utilizing these. Sometimes they use receive comparators to determine which transmitter to use. They could also be using different PL tones for each site and the database listing for the VHF may be out of date. Clare County, Michigan used to do this with their VHF dispatch system. Same frequencies for both repeater sites in the North and South ends of the county, but used different PL tones for each site. They then had separate channels in the radios for north and south.
If you live in the north end of the county, you may not be picking up the VHF transmissions from that south tower. Hence you may not be able to hear City Fire. I just heard a dispatch for Bear Lake and MMR. It sounds like they may be repeating both the tones and the dispatch information on both VHF towers. One comes in quite weak signal wise and then the second one comes through stronger.
I also noticed on the Manistee County database page that the VHF system has two repeaters/transmitters. I'm not sure of how they are utilizing these. Sometimes they use receive comparators to determine which transmitter to use. They could also be using different PL tones for each site and the database listing for the VHF may be out of date. Clare County, Michigan used to do this with their VHF dispatch system. Same frequencies for both repeater sites in the North and South ends of the county, but used different PL tones for each site. They then had separate channels in the radios for north and south.
If you live in the north end of the county, you may not be picking up the VHF transmissions from that south tower. Hence you may not be able to hear City Fire. I just heard a dispatch for Bear Lake and MMR. It sounds like they may be repeating both the tones and the dispatch information on both VHF towers. One comes in quite weak signal wise and then the second one comes through stronger.
Both transmitters seem to dispatch the same thing... sometimes. There are certain department tone-outs that will hit the Northern tower first and then go through the second one. None go through the Southern and then the Northern. There are only a few departments that do this and it happens on both of my radios - a UV5R with no PL Tones entered and a Kenwood TK-2180 that has PL tones set up. I wonder if @ffemtjg is on to something here.
Clare county is no longer set up in that fashion. When they transferred over to the MPSCS, they began simulcasting the same thing with the same PL Tones on each site. Some departments are still on VHF and others (Mainly near Isabella County) use MPSCS. Their emergency warning system is confirmed to be on 800 along with Clare FD and Lincoln Township.
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