More STARS questions

[waynes]

I still have questions about STARS.

I scan all the control channels in one folder on my 436HP. This speeds things up and works across the state.

VSP: I hear Richmond consistently. Sometimes Appomattox and Chesapeake show up. Sometimes not. An occasional Fairfax, Culpeper or Salem, depending where I’m driving.

DGIF: I understand they encrypt and use terminals, but rarely I hear one side of a conversation.

ABC, DMV DCR: I never hear anything, except ABC and DMV talking to VSP dispatch. Never DCR.

Marine Police and Military Affairs: Rarely I hear a transmission or two (in Richmond).

Can someone who understands this better explain it to me, or is this normal. Thanks.

 

[W4UVV]

Unfortunately your posted comments have evolved to be more normal than exception in past years. A few comments which may be of interest:

DGIF: Original policy in 2000 using STARS for comms was their MDTs were to used only when circumstances required voice comms. However DGIF voice comms were common for some years after with the statewide dispatcher located in Richmond. When DGIF encrypted only occasional in the clear voice comms limited to coming on/going off duty were heard. I don't hear those anymore.

ABC: In past years infrequent in the clear voice comms were heard. However, you may remember the incident in Charlottesville that occurred when an ABC "sting" attempted to capture a suspect, who was a UVA student, who fled to her car thinking she was being kidnapped, assaulted or whatever. With 24/7 "breaking news" cycles, the story evolved to where the subject ABC agents and the agency itself were portrayed nationally in a very bad way. The state agency was sued and eventually resulted for a 6 figure payment to the victim. Subsequently, ABC voice comms totally disappeared, probably from a change in ABC radio comm policy.

DMV: In Div 1, on rare occasions a voice comm from one DMV agent to another requesting portable scales be brought to a designated location can be heard.

DCR: For years DCR voice comms were frequent and then nothing. Maybe they use MDTs or their own cellphones.

MRC: Normally because of affiliations to the selected Peninsula/Tidewater STARS sites, I can' hear them but like you rarely hear a MRC comm. I believe MRC comms as a rule typically are brief and not much on detail.

DMA: At one time about 5 years ago, on weekends I would hear DMA comms on occasion from, I assumed an Army Reserve activity in NOVA, Va. Beach or headquarters Langley/Ft. Eustis. Then no comms. Subsequently, a helicopter medical detachment was stationed at the Chesterfield AP. There is occasional activity involving usually a helicopter flying to another location. However a few years ago when the AF Reserve pilot ejected and landed in the mountains near Charlottesivlle, DMA helicopters from Chesterfield were active during the search effort.

DFP: Although not mentioned in your post, in my opinion, issuing STARS radios to these relatively few agency's individuals was a waste of taxpayer monies. The few comms I heard basically were chit-chat when driving to NOVA for whatever. My argument was using their cellphones and FRS radios would achieve the same purposes and not require a $5,000 each STARS radio for each DFP user. Of course, the DFP users were defended by their supporters, However, I remained unconvinced.

It looks like the current STARS voice comms situations most likely will not change.

John
W4UVV

 

[waynes]

Thanks.

I assume VSP Chesapeake and Appomattox come in and out as cars from those divisions come in and go out of the range of towers I can hear.

I'm hearing more DGIF marking on and off, but it's usually just one side of the conversation, not both.

More MRC traffic in the last couple of days heard in Richmond.

I'm looking at upgrading antennas for base station use. Better coax, better antennas. As high as I can get them.

Any other tricks for monitoring STARS on a 436HP are greatly appreciated!

 

[W4UVV]

------------------------------------
Wayne,

I have a recommendation not a STARS monitoring trick. 15+ years ago I monitored the STARS DVRS frequencies as a separate file to scan both at my base and when mobile. It worked fine and often was a faster way to receive hits when in the scan mode. FYI if mobile and you hear a DVRS low powered repeater output frequency comm, be alert as the source most likely is relatively close in your reception "neighborhood". If you get a hit on the input frequency STARS DVDRS hit, he/she probably is within your line of sight view...smile. In order to extend my mobile range reception years ago I installed two commercial grade cable tv RF pre-amps/12VDC inverter feeding a separate vhf and uhf antenna @ 5/8 wavelength each with mag mounts.

I monitor all DVRS frequencies which include non-VR frequencies previously assigned to a STARS user. I use my database frequency file for DVDRS frequencies/users. I agree mostly with but not 100% of the RR DB DVRS frequencies used/VR users database. DVRS audio sounds good on my 536 so you shouldn't have any problem with your 436.

Remember the "old" DVDRS are in the 764-765 mhz. range output and 794-795 mhz. range input. The "new" DVDRS are in the 769-770 mhz. range output and 799-800 mhz. input range. Both DVDRS range input/output repeater frequencies are low power.

I also differ with the RR DVDRS DB list format editing. I prefer to maintain the four separate frequency ranges as two separate file listings. The RR DVDRS DB list is one file merged with the new frequency/VR user displayed in the old DVDRS VR location which is fine. I just like my way better for my ease viewing/editing or whatever.

John
W4UVV

 

[W4UVV]

-------------------
Wayne,

I have a recommendation not a STARS monitoring trick. 15+ years ago I monitored the STARS DVRS frequencies as a separate file to scan both at my base and when mobile. It worked fine and often was a faster way to receive hits when in the scan mode. FYI if mobile and you hear a DVDRS low powered repeater output frequency comm, be alert as the source most likely is relatively close in your reception "neighborhood". If you get a hit on the input frequency STARS DVDRS hit, he/she probably is within your line of sight view...smile. In order to extend my mobile range reception years ago I installed two commercial grade cable tv RF pre-amps/12VDC inverter feeding a separate vhf and uhf antenna @ 5/8 wavelength each with mag mounts.

I monitor all DVDRS frequencies which include non-VR frequencies previously assigned to a STARS user. I use my database frequency file for DVDRS frequencies/users. I agree mostly with but not 100% of the RR DB DVRS frequencies used/VR users database. DVRS audio sounds good on my 536 so you shouldn't have any problem with your 436.

Remember the "old" DVDRS are in the 764-765 mhz. range output and 794-795 mhz. range input. The "new" DVDRS are in the 769-770 mhz. range output and 799-800 mhz. input range. Both DVDRS range input/output repeater frequencies are low power.

I also differ with the RR DVDRS DB list format editing. I prefer to maintain the four separate frequency ranges as two separate file listings. The RR DVDRS DB list is one file merged with the new frequency/VR user displayed in the old DVDRS VR location which is fine. I just like my way better for my ease viewing/editing or whatever.

John
W4UVV

 

[W4UVV]

Wayne,

I have a recommendation not a STARS monitoring trick. 15+ years ago I monitored the STARS DVRS frequencies as a separate file to scan both at my base and when mobile. It worked fine and often was a faster way to receive hits when in the scan mode. FYI if mobile and you hear a DVRS low powered repeater output frequency comm, be alert as the source most likely is relatively close in your reception "neighborhood". If you get a hit on the input frequency STARS DVDRS hit, he/she probably is within your line of sight view...smile. In order to extend my mobile range reception years ago I installed two commercial grade cable tv RF pre-amps/12VDC inverter feeding a separate vhf and uhf antenna @ 5/8 wavelength each with mag mounts.

I monitor all DVRS frequencies which include non-VR frequencies previously assigned to a STARS user. I use my database frequency file for DVDRS frequencies/users. I agree mostly with but not 100% of the RR DB DVRS frequencies used/VR users database. DVRS audio sounds good on my 536 so you shouldn't have any problem with your 436.

Remember the "old" DVDRS are in the 764-765 mhz. range output and 794-795 mhz. range input. The "new" DVDRS are in the 769-770 mhz. range output and 799-800 mhz. input range. Both DVDRS range input/output repeater frequencies are low power.

I also differ with the RR DVDRS DB list format editing. I prefer to maintain the four separate frequency ranges as two separate file listings. The RR DVDRS DB list is one file merged with the new frequency/VR user displayed in the old DVDRS VR location which is fine. I just like my way better for my ease viewing/editing or whatever.

John
W4UVV

 

[Ghstwolf62]

For DCR you might want to check their old analog freqs. I know Douthat out here uses their old analog freqs for the majority of comms and they also jump on Salem 2 VSP for emergency stuff and sometimes other things. They seem to have stopped using their DCR TG several years ago.

They donn't even use the old analog freqs for much as it seems other park ops use them most. Sometimes you hear LE units called but not a lot.

Still all in all very little comms ever seem to happen. Either they are as John said or they are on very low power simplex HTs. For instance I know school police out here are using that method.

 

[LeSueurC]

As a daily listener of the MRC, the transmissions aren’t short and no details. Yes mostly it is units going on and off duty, but I’ve heard them when they’re giving the dispatcher their patrol location and the type of boat and where they’ launching from. For example “ 615 to Operations, show myself and 614 launching out of Leeward Marina, 23 foot Contender, patrolling James River. “
Summertime is a good time to monitor them too. A couple years back there was an incident on the Eastern Shore where an oyster fishing boat capsized and they were trying to find them, it was a father son and a MRC unit found them and was giving coordinates and the condition of the 2 that were found, lots of information passed over

 

[W4UVV]

For the past 5 or 6 years both DGIF and DOF have been modifying older licenses or requesting new licenses ed for analog operation only mostly using the same old analog frequencies. There were some exceptions. This VITA licensing activity has lessened in the past six months. The reasons as to why the rush with several licenses activity sometimes for multiple weekly periods to the FCC for modifying/requesting new licenses are unknown to me.

But a reasonable leap of logical explanation could be partially sourced to contingency planning for a backup almost statewide radio system. Another reason might be that some STARS users have complained that the digital signals do not have the same signal coverage area as the old analog repeater signals had, especially in certain mountainous/valley areas. For Game Wardens and Forestry personnel who at times have to be on foot using a HT in thick terrain in remote areas, it was discovered early on that some STARS users, mostly in SW Va. had problems accessing the new STARS repeater sites. I recall the biggest problem area at that time was the Smith Mtn. Lake area which in some places was a STARS dead zone. Maybe it was a combination a number of concerns.

I recall either being told or read somewhere that some vhf analog repeater equipment presently is stored and available for the radio techs to connect if required. Common sense dictates there must have been RFPs issued for analog equipment to support all the new modified and new analog licenses. Otherwise what's the point? If so, then it was just a paper project.

John
W4UVV

 

[BlueMoon2]

So, I'm understanding that many of the STARS tower sites have changed over to P25 Phase 2. Is anyone hearing units on P25 Phase 2 yet? Appomattox units certainly are still being heard on P25 Phase 1.

 

[LeSueurC]

Probably just for future plans.

 

[IcomIcR20]

So, I'm understanding that many of the STARS tower sites have changed over to P25 Phase 2. Is anyone hearing units on P25 Phase 2 yet? Appomattox units certainly are still being heard on P25 Phase 1.

A lot of systems have added phase 2 to their license just for future insurance should they want to make the switch. I can personally attest that I have only heard phase I TGs on STARS, at least off of the Beamer Knob site.

 

[Ghstwolf62]

Well a couple interesting tidbits that I'm not sure how to put together but maybe someone with some more knowledge can figure them out.

Usually as I said earlier CR units for several years have been operating on their local VSP channel. So Douthat units for instance were on Salem 2 and CR units out in App division would be on VSP App channels.

Well last night during an operation the CR units were operating on DGIF 4. That is one thing. Don't pay much attention to DGIF usually so don't know if this has become normal but since I haven't heard them in some time on Salem 2 its possible.

Second thing was the unit numbers had changed greatly. CR units out here were usually 200 units with some 100 units thrown in now and then.

The units are now 900 units.

The 900 units were using radios previously used by the 100/200 units. For instance CR 931 was using the mobile and portable that has always belonged to CR 217. The other unit 932 was CR 137 before.

Finally and I'm not sure what if anything to make of this is that one of 900 units was a DGIF officer whose unit number is a 400 series unit.

So did he switch jobs or is DGIF doing CR now or something entirely different.

If CR is now using DGIF operating channels that could explain why they have disappeared on the air as DGIF are encrypted. Same if CR have been folded into the DGIF and DGIF is doing both jobs now.

Maybe someone who knows can put it all together if there is anything to put together that is.

 

[N4VKF]

Well a couple interesting tidbits that I'm not sure how to put together but maybe someone with some more knowledge can figure them out.

Usually as I said earlier CR units for several years have been operating on their local VSP channel. So Douthat units for instance were on Salem 2 and CR units out in App division would be on VSP App channels.

Well last night during an operation the CR units were operating on DGIF 4. That is one thing. Don't pay much attention to DGIF usually so don't know if this has become normal but since I haven't heard them in some time on Salem 2 its possible.

Second thing was the unit numbers had changed greatly. CR units out here were usually 200 units with some 100 units thrown in now and then.

The units are now 900 units.

The 900 units were using radios previously used by the 100/200 units. For instance CR 931 was using the mobile and portable that has always belonged to CR 217. The other unit 932 was CR 137 before.

Finally and I'm not sure what if anything to make of this is that one of 900 units was a DGIF officer whose unit number is a 400 series unit.

So did he switch jobs or is DGIF doing CR now or something entirely different.

If CR is now using DGIF operating channels that could explain why they have disappeared on the air as DGIF are encrypted. Same if CR have been folded into the DGIF and DGIF is doing both jobs now.

Maybe someone who knows can put it all together if there is anything to put together that is.

Cr is now being dispatched by dgif out of the Richmond dispatch center by dgif dispatcher

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[Ghstwolf62]

Thanks for the info that certainly explains where the CR units disappeared to.

 

[waynes]

What talk groups were you hearing? I'm hearing nothing like that in the Richmond area.

 

[N4VKF]

What talk groups were you hearing? I'm hearing nothing like that in the Richmond area.

I only get region5 encryption channel here

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[BlueMoon2]

So far, I’ve heard that fork mountain and Thornburg sites have been upgraded to p25 phase 2 capable. What other sites? Anybody know?


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[N4VKF]

Are all of the surveillance channels encrypted or can it be turned on and off? Catching encryption on Richmond 1A

 

[LeSueurC]

They’re probably selectable. I’ve caught unencrypted comms on the Chesapeake ones.