Oneida County VHF P25 Trunking?

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#1
It appears that Oneida County is gearing towards a VHF P25 digital phase II trunking system. With a transition date to the new system to be around December 2018/ January 2019.

ULS Application - Public Safety Pool, Trunked - 0007104825 - ONEIDA, COUNTY OF

I find this odd since Oneida County falls under the Central NY Interoperable Communications Consortium, and the remaining counties in this consortium are all on UHF.

Defeats the purpose of interoperability, doesn't it?
 
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#2
Hope fully onieda will get smaller talk goups than onondaga has . So you can do more selective monitoring .
 
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#3
Unless they go toward harris or motorola equipment which is dual or all band since majority if not all phase 2 equipment is dual band or all band by harris and motorola now. So defeating interop unlikely.
 

Thunderknight

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#4
since majority if not all phase 2 equipment is dual band or all band by harris and motorola now.
Actually I'd say it's the other way around - lots of deployments of Phase 2 are not dual/multiband.

Motorola APX1000, APX4000, APX6000 are singe band Phase 2 capable.

Harris XG-15 and XG-75 are single band Phase 2 capable.

When deploying 100s or 1000s of radios, the price different between single band and multiband gets quite large :)
 
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#5
It's possible that Oneida looked at UHF first and there weren't enough frequencies available so they went with VHF. Also most of Oneida County is already using VHF thus agencies could begin purchasing new radios now that would work on the new system when it gets deployed.

Will be interesting to see if Rome and the Utica area will stay on their separate systems or possibly move to this new system.
 
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#6
A little more info on the system:

http://www.ocgov.net/oneida/sites/d...5-163 911ProgramProjectManagementServices.pdf

"...to enhance coverage and system performance within the county as well as
improving interoperability with neighboring counties and emergency response agencies."

"...including new hardware, infrastructure and subscriber units to cover the Cities of Rome and
Utica and the Town of New Hartford."

Improving interoperability with neighboring counties. That's a good one. The county to your north is UHF, county to your south is UHF, and the county to your west is UHF. And some fire departments that respond to both counties (example: Cleveland, West Leyden, city of Oneida, etc.) would need a VHF radio and UHF to cover each of the counties.

And as far as them purchasing new radios now that would work on the new system when it gets deployed....... Onondaga went from lowband & 800 to UHF. Oswego went from 800 to UHF. Cayuga went from lowband to UHF. Yes the transition may be a bit easier, but the whole concept and purpose is INTEROPERABILITY.
 
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kb2ztx

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#7
It's possible that Oneida looked at UHF first and there weren't enough frequencies available so they went with VHF.
That wouldn't surprise me at all being i spent over 2 years trying to get 1 UHF channel for SAR. I am still trying to get a second frequency but cannot seem to find any free. Most of the CNY counties have alot of UHF channels tied up. This is why all of CNY SAR teams are still basically on VHF primarily (that and finding free dual band radios are slim to none)
 
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#8
A little more info on the system:

http://www.ocgov.net/oneida/sites/d...5-163 911ProgramProjectManagementServices.pdf

"...to enhance coverage and system performance within the county as well as
improving interoperability with neighboring counties and emergency response agencies."

"...including new hardware, infrastructure and subscriber units to cover the Cities of Rome and
Utica and the Town of New Hartford."

Improving interoperability with neighboring counties. That's a good one. The county to your north is UHF, county to your south is UHF, and the county to your west is UHF. And some fire departments that respond to both counties (example: Cleveland, West Leyden, city of Oneida, etc.) would need a VHF radio and UHF to cover each of the counties.

And as far as them purchasing new radios now that would work on the new system when it gets deployed....... Onondaga went from lowband & 800 to UHF. Oswego went from 800 to UHF. Cayuga went from lowband to UHF. Yes the transition may be a bit easier, but the whole concept and purpose is INTEROPERABILITY.
I would think agencies that regularly run mutual aid into neighbouring counties would possibly get dual band radios. I know that's what they're doing in a few PA counties.
 

c0untyb0y

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#10
you mean VHF != UHF?

this is Oneida County, where sense makes none. CNYICC? never heard of her.

FACT: there will be two separate city trunking networks. $20 on that?
 
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#11
this is Oneida County, where sense makes none. CNYICC? never heard of her.

FACT: there will be two separate city trunking networks. $20 on that?
Are you saying that Rome will keep their NXDN NEXEDGE radios while Utica will maintain their EDACS 800MHz gear? That isn't how I read the RFP. But then again, your point is spot-on... this is Oneida County and interoperability is overrated.
 

c0untyb0y

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#12
Are you saying that Rome will keep their NXDN NEXEDGE radios while Utica will maintain their EDACS 800MHz gear? That isn't how I read the RFP. But then again, your point is spot-on... this is Oneida County and interoperability is overrated.
what I meant by the two systems each city will have remark:
Utica will have its own independent VHF trunk network. Rome will have its own independent VHF trunking network. the county powers to be need to realize that political boundaries (and egos) need to be disregarded when it comes to this project and build out ONE trunking network for the entire county. maybe at first it's just the cities who'll use it and then eventually migrate over the remaining agencies/users to the system. perhaps there were no UHF frequencies available for the county/consultant to utilize. shouldn't it matter though that the trunk network could still integrate with the CNYICC even if it's not in the same band plan?
that and there's only $7.5 million to spend, so whatever footprint they choose it'll probably be small, reuse a lot of existing infrastructure where applicable, etc.

stay tuned. (no pun intended!)
 
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#13
according to the bid the system states " infrastructure and subscriber units to cover the Cities of Rome,
Utica and the Town of New Hartford." so i wonder if there on the same system be on different banks like Syracuse fire is in Onondaga
 

DaveNF2G

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#14
this is Oneida County, where sense makes none. CNYICC? never heard of her.

FACT: there will be two separate city trunking networks. $20 on that?
I'll see your $20 and raise you the language in the RFP. Coverage of Utica and Rome is specified as a requirement. How does this support the continuation of separate systems?
 
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#15
what I meant by the two systems each city will have remark:
Utica will have its own independent VHF trunk network. Rome will have its own independent VHF trunking network. the county powers to be need to realize that political boundaries (and egos) need to be disregarded when it comes to this project and build out ONE trunking network for the entire county. maybe at first it's just the cities who'll use it and then eventually migrate over the remaining agencies/users to the system. perhaps there were no UHF frequencies available for the county/consultant to utilize. shouldn't it matter though that the trunk network could still integrate with the CNYICC even if it's not in the same band plan?
that and there's only $7.5 million to spend, so whatever footprint they choose it'll probably be small, reuse a lot of existing infrastructure where applicable, etc.

stay tuned. (no pun intended!)
Where did you obtain the funding ($7.5M) number from? Was this a line item from the Oneida County budget or some other source? The "slow growth plan" indicates the county has already obtained state funding, and will issue two municipal bonds to complete the funding. Just wondering what source you have.
 

c0untyb0y

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#16
I'll see your $20 and raise you the language in the RFP. Coverage of Utica and Rome is specified as a requirement. How does this support the continuation of separate systems?
That was past experience and history talking there. I know what the RFP claims to state and I really do hope it's only one system. Though now I feel much better after hearing the new guy at 911 talk about the coming changes in the works there. Very encouraging to hear there could be some good changes on the horizon. So maybe my cynicism is more like over reacting at this point. Time shall tell.
 

c0untyb0y

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#17
Where did you obtain the funding ($7.5M) number from? Was this a line item from the Oneida County budget or some other source? The "slow growth plan" indicates the county has already obtained state funding, and will issue two municipal bonds to complete the funding. Just wondering what source you have.
heard direct from Picente's mouth Saturday:
$3.5 million state grant
$4 million county funds

and there's this:
$7.5M communications upgrade will strengthen local law enforcement - News - Uticaod - Utica, NY
 

tbski

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#20
I'm on a couple working committees involved with the above build out...... It is progressing along. There is a timeline that has to be met per the grant specifications.
 
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