PA Statewide P25 Phase 2 System

u2brent · Mar 16, 2019

BM82557 said:
Just guessing but I'm not sure that 1.95 is in Cumberland or Fulton counties. I can barely pickup 1.48 that is in Fulton county and 1.51 is in southern Franklin county. At my location the received signal for 1.95 is stronger than the signal for 1.51.

View attachment 69591 View attachment 69592

Left screen grab is 1.51 , right screen grab is 1.95

Maybe,

ADAM690 - Gettysburg, PA (Adams)

39.82675, -77.25608

BM82557 · Mar 16, 2019

mtindor said:
That's 1.51 on your left? 1.51 is 159.2175 / 158.7975 Blain (Perry Co) and it doesn't look like you are tuned to either of those frequencies on the left.

Oops!! Still asleep when I wrote that! Meant to say site 1.50 which is FRAN02. CC is 159.1875 which I had in the first screen grab. Sorry for the confusion.

magiclightman · Mar 16, 2019

TG 10161 on 858.6375 coming off Pocopson (CHES31), assuming its PSP troop J (avondale barracks). It has the big E on it so can't confirm.

rrbum · Mar 16, 2019

Does anyone else find it odd that DELA64 (Newtown Square) is not appearing as an offline neighbor to any of the surrounding sites, be it VHF or 800? As of this post the coverage in the troop k Media barracks area seems lacking, especially along the I-95 corridor from Delaware state line to Philadelphia airport. The strongest signal in the Media area is from the Devault VHF transmitter.
Time will tell. Looks like they are going to try and cover the whole area with only 30 watts of 800 megs out of Newtown Square.
Seems awfully iffy for handheld reception inside of buildings and/or down in the hollows.

HM1529 · Mar 16, 2019

rrbum said:
Does anyone else find it odd that DELA64 (Newtown Square) is not appearing as an offline neighbor to any of the surrounding sites, be it VHF or 800? As of this post the coverage in the troop k Media barracks area seems lacking, especially along the I-95 corridor from Delaware state line to Philadelphia airport. The strongest signal in the Media area is from the Devault VHF transmitter.
Time will tell. Looks like they are going to try and cover the whole area with only 30 watts of 800 megs out of Newtown Square.
Seems awfully iffy for handheld reception inside of buildings and/or down in the hollows.

Standard equipment for PSP includes vehicular repeaters. The system is designed for mobile coverage. The vehicular repeaters provide the portable coverage. While the existing outdoor portable coverage is quite good on the new system, that is not the targeted coverage for the tower infrastructure.

Delco should get some coverage from the Devault VHF and 800, Posopson 800, Newtown Square 800, Philly VHF (and maybe 800?). I was curious about the Newtown Square VHF and whether it would become active. Time will tell, I suppose.

Besides Newtown Square, the Port Clinton FELHC is also not in the mix, yet, although Troop L is scheduled to migrate after J, K, and M, I believe.

u2brent · Mar 16, 2019

joeydambrosio12 said:
TG 10161 on 858.6375 coming off Pocopson (CHES31), assuming its PSP troop J (avondale barracks). It has the big E on it so can't confirm.

You can find all that and more here...

https://wiki.radioreference.com/ind...o_Network_(PA-STARNet)_PSP_Talkgroup_Template

u2brent · Mar 16, 2019

rrbum said:
Does anyone else find it odd that DELA64 (Newtown Square) is not appearing as an offline neighbor to any of the surrounding sites, be it VHF or 800? As of this post the coverage in the troop k Media barracks area seems lacking, especially along the I-95 corridor from Delaware state line to Philadelphia airport. The strongest signal in the Media area is from the Devault VHF transmitter.
Time will tell. Looks like they are going to try and cover the whole area with only 30 watts of 800 megs out of Newtown Square.
Seems awfully iffy for handheld reception inside of buildings and/or down in the hollows.

Patience. Patience..
https://wiki.radioreference.com/ind..._Radio_Network_(PA-STARNet)_P25_Site_Research

Delco is still using Openscabs....

Watch for these TG's on the new system..

K1 Philadelphia (Philadelphia) - 10163
K2 Media (Delaware) - 10164
K3 Skippack (Montgomery) - 10165
L1 Reading (Berks) - 10167
L2 Jonestown (Lebanon) - 10168
L3 Frackville (Schuylkill) - 10169
L4 Hamburg (Berks) - 10170
L7 Schuylkill Haven (Schuylkill) - 10171
M1 Bethlehem (Lehigh/Northampton) - 10173
M2 Dublin (Bucks) - 10174
M3 Trevose (Bucks) - 10175
M5 Fogelsville (Lehigh) - 10176
M6 Belfast (Northampton) - 10177

They're quickly cleaning up loose ends in Central PA... before heading east...

I wanna know what the next RFSS will be??? 2?

GTR8000 · Mar 16, 2019

u2brent said:
I wanna know what the next RFSS will be??? 2?

Logically, yes, it would be 2.

Note that an ASTRO 25 M3 Core has a capacity of 150 sites (a simulcast cell counts as a single site) per zone (RFSS). Within that zone there is a total limit of 1,000 channels across all 150 sites. So far, the PSP is nowhere near that limit. I believe there are roughly 70 confirmed sites in the database, with no site having more than 4 channels.

EDIT: Just crunched the numbers. So far 225 channels across 72 sites have been confirmed in the RRDB. That's 78 sites and 775 channels to go before they need to worry about creating an additional zone!

u2brent · Mar 16, 2019

GTR8000 said:
Logically, yes, it would be 2.

Note that an ASTRO 25 M3 Core has a capacity of 150 sites (a simulcast cell counts as a single site) per zone (RFSS). Within that zone there is a total limit of 1,000 channels across all 150 sites. So far, the PSP is nowhere near that limit. I believe there are roughly 70 confirmed sites in the database, with no site having more than 4 channels.

EDIT: Just crunched the numbers. So far 225 channels across 72 sites have been confirmed in the RRDB. That's 78 sites and 775 channels to go before they need to worry about creating an additional zone!

Thanks!

What happens after Site ID 1.99 (and all before it are used/reserved)?? 1.100?

I have not seen a RL example in the DB...

u2brent · Mar 16, 2019

P25, BEE00.942, 1.1 "WARR17 Garland/Warren"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.2 "WARR34 Kinzua Dam/Warren"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.3 "?"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.4 "DAUP01 Ellendale/Dauphin"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.5 "BUTL01 Hilliards/Butler"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.6 "CRAW01 Townville/Crawford"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.7 "CRAW37 Cussewago/Crawford"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.8 "FORE07 Guitonville/Forest"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.9 "VENA12 Seneca/Venango"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.10 "MERC31 Findley Twp/Mercer"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.11 "ERIE80 Erie/Erie"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.12 "ERIE80 800 Erie/Erie"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.13 "ERIE82 800 Corry/Erie"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.14 "ERIE92 800 Edinboro/Erie"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.15 "ERIE93 800 North East/Erie"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.16 "ERIE40 Presque Isle/Erie"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.17 "ERIE84 450 PSU Behrend/Erie"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.18 "DAUP37 800 Wiconisco/Dauphin"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.19 "LAWR06 Grindstone/Lawrence"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.20 "BUTL03 Woodbine/Butler"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.21 "BEAV01 Darlington/Beaver"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.22 "ARMS32 Blanket Hill/Armstrong"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.23 "CLAR05 Limestone/Clarion"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.24 "FAYE01 Fairchance/Fayette"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.25 "GREE08 Nettle Hill/Greene"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.26 "ALLE28 800 Wexford/Allegheny"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.27 "ALLE41 800 Tarentum/Allegheny"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.28 "ALLE67 800 Sewickley Heights/Allegheny"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.29 "ALLE601 800 Oakdale/Allegheny"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.30 "ALLE25 800 W Mifflin/Allegheny"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.31 "ALLE21 800 Penn Hills/Allegheny"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.32 "ALLE59 800 Pittsburgh/Allegheny"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.33 "WASH03 Claysville/Washington"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.34 "WASH49 Scenery Hill/Washington"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.35 "CAMB02 Johnstown/Cambria"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.36 "WEST30 Derry/Westmoreland"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.37 "INDI01 Clymer/Indiana"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.38 "INDI07 Rossiter/Indiana"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.39 "SOME02 Bald Knob/Somerset"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.40 "SOME06 Negro Mtn/Somerset"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.41 "BEDF02 Chaneysville/Bedford"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.42 "CENT04 Tyrone/Blair"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.43 "CENT16 Bellefonte/Centre"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.44 "MIFF40 Belleville/Mifflin"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.45 "CLIN41 Lock Haven/Clinton"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.46 "SNYD02 Beavertown/Snyder"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.47 "HUNT04 Mt Union/Huntingdon"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.48 "FULT01 Wells Tannery/Fulton"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.49 "FRAN01 Upper Strasburg/Franklin"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.50 "FRAN02 South Mountain/Franklin"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.51 "PERR01 Blain/Perry"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.52 "DAUP73 800 State Capitol/Dauphin"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.53 "DAUP01 800 Ellendale/Dauphin"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.54 "YORK01 800 Reeser's Summit/York"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.55 "YORK35 800 Hanover/York"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.56 "YORK34 800 Red Lion/York"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.57 "YORK89 800 Gatchellville/York"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.58 "YORK16 Andersontown/York"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.59 "CUMB04 800 Biglerville/Adams?"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.60 "WARR35A/37 Warren Simulcast"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.61 "ALLE21/41/59/BEAV02/05/WEST03 Allegheny Region Simulcast"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.62 "HUNT01 Loop Lookout/Huntingdon"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.63 "MIFF35 Lewistown/Mifflin"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.64 "LANC01 Cornwall/Lancaster"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.65 "LANC33 Truce/Lancaster"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.66 "FAYE60 Connellsville/Fayette"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.67 "BUCK33 800 Buckingham/Bucks?"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.68 "CHES31 800 Pocopson/Chester"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.69 "CHES96 800 Oxford/Chester"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.70 "CHES02 Devault/Chester"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.71 "SCHU03 Keffers/Schuylkill"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.72 "SCHU33 Mahnoy/Schuylkill?"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.73 "LEBA74 800 Fort Indiantown/Lebanon"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.74 "DELA64 800 Newtown Square/Delaware?"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.75 "CHES02 800 Devault/Chester"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.76 "CHES01 800 Morgantown/Chester"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.77 "BEDF13 Blue Knob/Bedford"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.78 "BERK04 Port Clinton/Berks?"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.79 "CHES33 Hibernia/Chester"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.80 "LEHI05 Center Valley/Lehigh?"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.81 "MONY02 800 Willow Grove/Montgomery"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.82 "MONY02 Willow Grove/Montgomery"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.83 "PHIL02 800 Belmont/Philadelphia"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.84 "DELA64 Newtown Square/Delaware?"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.85 "LEHI06 Bowmanstown/Lehigh?"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.86 "MONY50 Graterford/Montgomery?"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.87 "MONY50 800 Graterford/Montgomery?"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.88 "LEHI01 800 Emmaus/Lehigh?"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.89 "BUCK33 Buckingham/Bucks"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.90 "DAUP17 800 Technology Park/Dauphin"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.91 "PHIL02 Belmont/Philadelphia"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.92 "ERIE82 Corry/Erie"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.93 "CARB01 Albrightville/Carbon?"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.94 "FULT40 Tuscarora Mtn/Fulton?"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.95 "CUMB02 Mount Holly Springs/Cumberland?"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.96 "LACK53 Archbald/Lackawanna?"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.97 "LUZE04 Shickshinny/Luzerne?"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.98 "COLU01 Catawissa/Columbia?"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.99 "COLU02 Millville/Columbia?"
P25, BEE00.942, 1.100 "WAYN31 Indian Orchard/Wayne?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.1 "WAYN33 Orson/Wayne?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.2 "WYOM30 Mehoopany/Wyoming?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.3 "SUSQ06 New Milford/Susquehanna?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.4 "BRAD31 Canton/Bradford?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.5 "LYCO02 Waterville/Lycoming?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.6 "LYCO15 Bodines/Lycoming?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.7 "TIOG03 Westfield/Tioga?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.8 "TIOG06 Mansfield/Tioga?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.9 "TIOG42 Wellsboro/Tioga?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.10 "CLEA03 Penfield/Clearfield?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.11 "CLEA15 Rockton/Clearfield?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.12 "POTT12 Denton Hill/Potter?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.13 "POTT41 Austin/Potter?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.14 "MCKE11 Rew/Mckean?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.15 "MCKE90 Kane/Mckean?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.16 "CAME33 Driftwood/Cameron?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.17 "CLIN02 Renova/Clinton?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.18 "POTT10 Hebron/Potter?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.19 "BRAD41 Wyalusing/Bradford?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.20 "CAME05 Truman/Cameron?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.21 "CAMB01 Colver/Cambria?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.22 "CLEA07 Falls Creek/Clearfield?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.23 "ERIE84 Lawrence Park/Erie?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.24 "JEFF02 Lake City/Jefferson?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.25 "YORK94 Shrewsbury/York?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.26 "LANC63/65 800 Lancaster/Lancaster?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.27 "LANC?? 800 Millersville/Lancaster?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.28 "CHES66 Landenburg/Chester?"
P25, BEE00.942, 2.29 "?"

GTR8000 · Mar 16, 2019

u2brent said:
Thanks!

What happens after Site ID 1.99 (and all before it are used/reserved)?? 1.100? I have not seen a RL example in the DB...

Last time I checked, I believe the range was 1-64 HEX (1-100 DEC) for Site ID. I'm not sure if that was increased in the most recent system releases. That would seem to contradict the limit of 150 sites per zone, of course. Perhaps I've got my wires crossed and that 150 site limit doesn't apply to trunked sites. Admittedly it's been a while since I've brushed up on that stuff, let me see what I can dig up.

GTR8000 · Mar 16, 2019

I'm finding slightly conflicting information, so I'm going to revise my previous post and call it 100 sites per zone, going with the more conservative number.

u2brent · Mar 16, 2019

I guess we'll just wait and see what happens..

dlnorth · Mar 16, 2019

u2brent said:
Maybe,

ADAM690 - Gettysburg, PA (Adams)

39.82675, -77.25608

I'm going with CUMB04. The primary TGID's in use are PSP Chambersburg, PSP Gettysburg, and PSP Carlisle...I believe. Assuming those TGID's are all accurate, CUMB04 would be a site that would handle traffic from all three barracks. Another clue that leads me to lean very heavily toward CUMB04 is that this site can be received with four or five bars of signal strength using a stock antenna, indoors, from central Franklin County. I don't see that being the case if this site was further east or north. I'm not far from CUMB04, so I can run up there and see how strong the signal is with the antenna removed.

u2brent · Mar 16, 2019

dlnorth said:
I'm going with CUMB04. The primary TGID's in use are PSP Chambersburg, PSP Gettysburg, and PSP Carlisle...I believe. Assuming those TGID's are all accurate, CUMB04 would be a site that would handle traffic from all three barracks. Another clue that leads me to lean very heavily toward CUMB04 is that this site can be received with four or five bars of signal strength using a stock antenna, indoors, from central Franklin County. I don't see that being the case if this site was further east or north. I'm not far from CUMB04, so I can run up there and see how strong the signal is with the antenna removed.

Awesome

EMT1301 · Mar 16, 2019

GTR8000 said:
I'm finding slightly conflicting information, so I'm going to revise my previous post and call it 100 sites per zone, going with the more conservative number.

This is directly from the Motorola official documentation (MN003325A01-A, Master Site Infrastructure Reference Guide). This is for release 7.17, but I can't imagine the specifications have increased much in the newest release.

GTR8000 · Mar 17, 2019

EMT1301 said:
This is directly from the Motorola official documentation (MN003325A01-A, Master Site Infrastructure Reference Guide). This is for release 7.17, but I can't imagine the specifications have increased much in the newest release.

Yep, I have access to the ASTRO 25 documentation also, and the same info is provided in the MN005384A01-A Master Site Infrastructure Reference Guide for System Release 7.18

The uncertainty came from the Provisioning Manager User Guide, which shows different Site ID limits based on the site type.

In any event, since we've basically derailed this thread talking about site numbering, let's button it up with an example of an ASTRO 25 system in the RRDB that has site numbers that go all the way up to 150 as I originally stated.

https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=7996

GTR8000 · Mar 17, 2019

They updated the Fact Sheet a week and a half ago. They barely even mention the OpenSky system anymore lol

https://www.psp.pa.gov/About Us/Documents/PA-STARNet_Fact_Sheet_2019-03-06.pdf

dlnorth · Mar 17, 2019

u2brent said:
Awesome

I followed up on 171.6875 today. I checked ADAM40 first, since I was in that area, and had a very weak signal on the east side of the mountain. The signal got stronger as I drove west, and I had 4 or 5 bars once I got on the west side of the mountain, near Caledonia State Park. I removed the antenna from my scanner and had no reception at all. I then drove up to CUMB04 and had 5 bars when I parked about 1/4 mile away from the tower. I removed the antenna from my scanner and had still had 3-4 bars on the signal meter.

BM82557 · Mar 18, 2019

dlnorth said:
I followed up on 171.6875 today. I checked ADAM40 first, since I was in that area, and had a very weak signal on the east side of the mountain. The signal got stronger as I drove west, and I had 4 or 5 bars once I got on the west side of the mountain, near Caledonia State Park. I removed the antenna from my scanner and had no reception at all. I then drove up to CUMB04 and had 5 bars when I parked about 1/4 mile away from the tower. I removed the antenna from my scanner and had still had 3-4 bars on the signal meter.

That's pretty conclusive, thanks for the roadtrip. Observed neighbor info for sites 1.49 and 1.50 has been submitted this morning.

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