Somebody else using school emergency TG

[RT48]

I work in a school and today I was in the main office helping a secretary with a computer problem. The school MARCS emergency radio is next to her desk. While I was talking to her suddenly I heard traffic on the radio.

I said, "That didn't sound school related." and she said, "We sometimes hear traffic from someone else but we don't know who it is".

The traffic took me by surprise and I had to think about what I heard. I seem to remember a woman (dispatcher?) mentioning Chardon Road and the numbers 741 and 745 (car numbers?).

I might take my scanner to work and camp on that TG and see if I can identify who that is.

Does the state assign TGs? How could someone else be on a TG assigned to Rocky River Schools?

 

[mmckenna]

Talk Groups are assigned by the system administrator. Since individual talk groups can be set up differently (priority, sites, etc.) it's not something you let the users do on the fly.

Someone who has a system key can certainly program the radio, or program the radio incorrectly.

There's a few reasons why you may be hearing things you don't think you should:
Improperly programmed radio on either end, yours or theirs.
Someone on the wrong talk group. Happens here occasionally. Someone not paying attention to the talk group that got selected.
System could be in a fail-soft type mode where it goes back to a conventional like behavior.
Some agency, dispatcher, officer might have decided they need a "special" channel and decided to grab a random one that wasn't use.
Radio may have been accidentally set to scan.

I'd lean towards someones radio is programmed incorrectly or just simple user error.

 

[n8vur]

I work in a school and today I was in the main office helping a secretary with a computer problem. The school MARCS emergency radio is next to her desk. While I was talking to her suddenly I heard traffic on the radio.

I said, "That didn't sound school related." and she said, "We sometimes hear traffic from someone else but we don't know who it is".

The traffic took me by surprise and I had to think about what I heard. I seem to remember a woman (dispatcher?) mentioning Chardon Road and the numbers 741 and 745 (car numbers?).

I might take my scanner to work and camp on that TG and see if I can identify who that is.

Does the state assign TGs? How could someone else be on a TG assigned to Rocky River Schools?

Is it possible the radio in the office is on the wrong TalkGroup? The only traffic on the RockyRiverCSD talkgroup in the past 48 hours was the weekly MARCS test. I noted St Thomas, St Christopher, Goldwood, RRHS, Kensington, RR BoE, Luthern West, and RRMS.

 

[n8vur]

Is it possible the radio in the office is on the wrong TalkGroup? The only traffic on the RockyRiverCSD talkgroup in the past 48 hours was the weekly MARCS test. I noted St Thomas, St Christopher, Goldwood, RRHS, Kensington, RR BoE, Luthern West, and RRMS.

Hillcrest North Dispatch uses "700" a lot and Chardon Rd runs right through there. So sure enough, at 08:33 this morning (while RR School District was paying attention to those radios for the weekly radio test)... I captured the following on TG 13541 Hillcrest NFD:

742: "742, 700."
700: "742"
742: "742, 771, enroute."
700: "Copy 742, 771 enroute to 25307 Chardon at 0831."

Call your radio service - that radio is not on the Rocky River City School District talkgroup. It's listening to Hillcrest North Fire Dispatch and that was Richmond Heights fire you were listening to. Or it is in scan - although I thought scan was a "no-no" for MARCS since it ties up tower channels when you roam.

 

[KK4JUG]

People chit-chat on CB channel 9, pilots do it on aircraft emergency channels.......

It happens all the time. It shouldn't but it does. I suspect the system administrator can find out who it is and also find a remedy.

On the other hand, emergencies only happen to others so let's not worry about it.

 

[lone77wulf]

Most times I've seen the "wrong" talkgroup being heard is cause by someone patching and forgetting to un-patch. MARCS has rules on patching certain talkgroups because of this, so no one accidentally patches a Northern Ohio TG to a Southern Ohio TG and tie up towers.

The other thing that I've only seen happen once, and it even took Motorola by surprise is if somehow a duplicate radio ID was assigned. Let's say the school's radio is Radio A, and Fire's is B. If radio A is sitting turned on all the time, and the user of Radio B changes their talkgroup, it will switch on both radios but only B will display the new talkgroup. If radio A is turned off then back on, it will show the new talkgroup when it reaffiliates with the system.

 

[phask]

I've seen several "key ups" on the wrong TG...

FWIW - I log MARCS 24/7 - the weird associations one see at times (may not, or may be audio) are crazy. Sometimes it looks like one radio changing to several differnt TG.

FWIW all are county schools are monitored by the SO and the main city (Zanesville) dispatch - per weekly tests . They also do and encrypted transmission.

 

[wa8pyr]

FWIW - I log MARCS 24/7 - the weird associations one see at times (may not, or may be audio) are crazy. Sometimes it looks like one radio changing to several differnt TG.

That would be someone "playing" with their radio to see what's in it and where things are. In my line of work we wholeheartedly encourage this, as it's a great way for the user to really become familiar with their radio (especially important these days when agencies have 1000-channel radios and look eagerly for any way possible to fill them all up).

As regards the original post, it's most likely one of three things:

1. Someone fat-fingered the talkgroup information when programming a radio. Happens more than I'd like to think about.

2. Someone is on the wrong channel. As far as I know the school emergency talkgroup is only supposed to be in the school's emergency radio, and in the radio at the dispatch center which monitors that school district, so this would be an oddity.

3. A patch between the school emergency talkgroup and another talkgroup. Why someone would patch the school emergency talkgroup to a normal operations talkgroup is a real head-scratcher; they were supposed to be for emergency alerting only.

 

[612345]

Hillcrest North Dispatch uses "700" a lot and Chardon Rd runs right through there. So sure enough, at 08:33 this morning (while RR School District was paying attention to those radios for the weekly radio test)... I captured the following on TG 13541 Hillcrest NFD:

742: "742, 700."
700: "742"
742: "742, 771, enroute."
700: "Copy 742, 771 enroute to 25307 Chardon at 0831."

Call your radio service - that radio is not on the Rocky River City School District talkgroup. It's listening to Hillcrest North Fire Dispatch and that was Richmond Heights fire you were listening to. Or it is in scan - although I thought scan was a "no-no" for MARCS since it ties up tower channels when you roam.

The Hillcrest North talk group (13541) has been in existence since 2009. The units monitored are Richmond Heights Fire Department. With '700' being dispatch.

 

[budevans]

The Hillcrest North talk group (13541) has been in existence since 2009. The units monitored are Richmond Heights Fire Department. With '700' being dispatch.

Rocky River Schools TG is listed as 13617.

 

[n8vur]

As regards the original post, it's most likely one of three things:

1. Someone fat-fingered the talkgroup information when programming a radio. Happens more than I'd like to think about.

2. Someone is on the wrong channel. As far as I know the school emergency talkgroup is only supposed to be in the school's emergency radio, and in the radio at the dispatch center which monitors that school district, so this would be an oddity.

3. A patch between the school emergency talkgroup and another talkgroup. Why someone would patch the school emergency talkgroup to a normal operations talkgroup is a real head-scratcher; they were supposed to be for emergency alerting only.

I think it is 1 or 2, personally. The recordings / control channel data of the Rocky River CSD that day show no evidence of anyone being patched on it. The ONLY traffic in that TG was the weekly radio tests. At the same time, there was no evidence of the RR CSD talkgroup traffic being patched to Hillcrest North FD Dispatch.

Probably number 1 - happens a lot, especially when you have a bunch of radios to get out to different agencies.

In any event, hopefully the original poster called their two-way shop and had the radio checked or switched back to the right zone/channel.

 

[RT48]

I went back to the main office and talked to the secretary today. She told me, "I got tired of hearing about 'Hillcrest' so I turned the power off and then back on. So far I haven't heard anything more. I did do the weekly radio test with RRPD this morning also."

Looking at the front panel display I see "XSC18EMG". Is that the TG?

 

[budevans]

I did do the weekly radio test with RRPD this morning also."

Looking at the front panel display I see "XSC18EMG". Is that the TG?

XSC18EMG is not a Talk Group. It is the Alpha Tag , a brief description, for the Talk Group.

"XSC" School,
"18" Cuyahoga County,
"EMG" Emergency.

The Talk Group that is listed for the Rocky River Schools in the MARCS-IP Database is, 13617.