Something more....

[fuzzymoto]

OK So I've listened to all sorts of stuff on my BR330T from .1 to 1300 Mhz.
I'm curious what else is out there. I see everyone talking about Yaesu and Icom radios but what am I missing? I checked out the Icomm IC-R5,the Yaesi VR0120D, the yeasu VR500 and the AOR 8200 MRII.....but I'm not sure what I'm missing. Is it better range? SSB? Do they work like a scanner? Can I scan a range of frequencies like a scanner? Can I lockout freqs like a scanner? What do they do better and what do they do WORSE??

I see some are USA models and some are not. What are the differences? Will a non-US even plug into my outlets.

Bottom line is I want to play more but I'm not sure what these radios or others like them offer? Any insight here???

 

[Voyager]

OK So I've listened to all sorts of stuff on my BR330T from .1 to 1300 Mhz.
I'm curious what else is out there. I see everyone talking about Yaesu and Icom radios but what am I missing? I checked out the Icomm IC-R5,the Yaesi VR0120D, the yeasu VR500 and the AOR 8200 MRII.....but I'm not sure what I'm missing. Is it better range? SSB? Do they work like a scanner? Can I scan a range of frequencies like a scanner? Can I lockout freqs like a scanner? What do they do better and what do they do WORSE??

I see some are USA models and some are not. What are the differences? Will a non-US even plug into my outlets.

Bottom line is I want to play more but I'm not sure what these radios or others like them offer? Any insight here???

What else is out there? Loaded question! There is SSB activity you're not hearing - mostly on HF (below 30 MHz) but some VHF and UHF stuff out there, too. You're 'missing' a couple ham bands above 1.3 GHz, but that's about it for the high end. Even thos ham bands are sparsely used. Most everything else 'up there' is microwave point-to-point link and you won't pick them up unless you're very close to the path between the sites.

Usually the difference between USA and non-USA models is the Cellular band. Sometimes there are other bandplan differences - such as the 72 MHz-ish band for Australia.

Most scanners take a DC voltage input and are supplied with an AC adapter appropriate for the country of destination. For the most part, you can get a USA adapter for about any scanner at Radio Shack.

Joe M.

 

[hotdjdave]

Computer Controlled Receivers; Other Communications Gadgets

If you are into computers and scanning, you might want to check out some wide-band computer controlled receivers (scanners). It is a scanner/receiver that you connect to your computer and your computer becomes the scanner. You can set up your on scan and search ranges and record info and received communications on you hard drive. You can use audio applications that allow you to filter out noise, or do other manipulations to the audio source. There is usually a number of software applications to suit your needs or the OEM software that comes with the receiver can be used. True computer controlled receivers brings a whole new dynamic to scanning!

Icom has a new one, the PCR-1500 (and the R-1500 - same model, but with a detachable remote control head). It covers 0.01 to 3299.999MHz in AM, FM and WFM modes and also covers 0.495 to 1300MHz in SSB and CW modes.

Here are some places that sell the iCOM IC-PCR/R-1500:
http://www.grove-ent.com/page131.html
http://www.hamradio.com/cgi-bin/uncgi/ase?ITEM=R-1500&model=Model
https://ssl.isovelihotel.com/~cezzi...t=US&session=5c02292a5391872d7a4056a4efcbdfcf (bander.com is an overseas company that sells “unblocked models”)


Here are some other computer controlled receivers (note: some are just PCI cards you add to your computer - no box necessary):
http://www.grove-ent.com/wrwidefreq.html
http://www.strongsignals.net/access/content/compctrl.html
http://www.optoelectronics.com/optocom.htm
http://www.optoelectronics.com/faq.htm#OptocomFAQListing (answers questions to above link)


Here is another company, Optoelectronics, which sells some neat communications receiving devices ("tools"): http://www.optoelectronics.com/


Hope this helps. :wink:

 

[fuzzymoto]

Very interesting. I'll check out the PC control. I'm not sure I want to be linked to the computer if I take the new toy on the road.

So what sorts of communications are on SSB?

Do these (Icomm IC-R5,the Yaesi VR0120D, the yeasu VR500 and the AOR 8200 MKII) work like a normal scanner where you can search ranges of channels, lockout noisy frequencies, save frequencies to different banks, specify priority channels...??

 

[hotdjdave]

If you don't have a scanner that decodes digital APCO-25 (P25) and you live in an area, visit an area, or want to listen to agencies that uses APCO-25, then you are missing out also.

I live in Los Angeles. For two years, I couldn't hear the LAPD because they upgraded to digital. Since I got my Uniden BCD-396T, I can now hear the LAPD again and any other agency using digital.

 

[fuzzymoto]

So far I have no digital in my area or any of the areas I visit regularly.

So what sorts of communications are on SSB?

Do these (Icomm IC-R5,the Yaesi VR0120D, the yeasu VR500 and the AOR 8200 MKII) work like a normal scanner where you can search ranges of channels, lockout noisy frequencies, save frequencies to different banks, specify priority channels...??

 

[kibbins]

What is on SSB?

 

[nd5y]

Almost all voice communication on MF/HF bands (2 - 30 MHz) is SSB. Aircraft, marine, government, military, hams, and other stuff.
The only non-ham SSB on VHF and UHF is in the 220 - 222 MHz band which is not used very much most places.

 

[fuzzymoto]

I wonder if any of that is even in my area? Any way to tell short of listening on a SSB radio??

 

[amusement]

Most SSB broadcasts are limited within the range of upper and lower side bands of a carrier. In short, you probably can't here much using a conventional FM or AM receiver.

I purchased an inexpensive Degen model DE1103 (under $70 USD)to listen to broadcasts under 22 mhz. It has both FM and AM SSB receving capability.


edit: grammer/spelling corrections

 

[N_Jay]

I wonder if any of that is even in my area? Any way to tell short of listening on a SSB radio??

Add a BFO to an AM receiver.

 

[hotdjdave]

SSB (USB and LSB)

SSB (Single Side Band) has two sideband shifts: USB (Upper Side Band) and LSB (Lower Side Band).

See this Wikipedia link for explanation: http://encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com/Single-sideband+modulation


My iCOM IC-R1000 is capable of SSB. It is a computer controlled receiver. Just so you know, you need a significant antenna or long wire outside your home to pick up lower band frequencies, particularly in the range for SSB. You may pick up some transmissions, but a proper antenna is highly suggested.

For the most part you will hear is CB type communications, foreign radio transmissions, and HAM radio, similar to SW and MW radio (short wave and medium wave).

 

[KC4ZEX]

Very little of the communications you will hear is CB. Their are several ham bands 160 meters at 1.8 to 2.0 mhz. 75 meters at 3.5 to 4.0 mhz . 40 meters at 7.0 to 7.3 mhz. 20 meters 14.025 to 14.350. 17 meters 18.068 to 18.168 mhz. 15 meters 21.025 to 21.450mhz 12 meters 24.890 to 24 990 mhz. 10 meters 28.000 to 29.700mhz. plus a couple more digital bands and 60 meters at 5 mhz. These are people in your state neighboring states across the country and all over the world. In the utility bands between these bands are Lots of comercial aircraft freq's listen to New York HF control talking to planes going everywhere in and out of the country plus San Francisco and Gander Newfoundland doing the same. Some military com. on several freq's like 8.992 11.175 and many others. Coast Guard on several freq's Last year after Katrina lots of traffic out of New Orleans area. All on ssb. Plus all the big broadcasters on AM shortwave BBC, VOA, Cuba, Canada, Russia, Japan, and others. Shortwave doesn't do well scanning as their is a certain amount of background noise all the time. But most newer receivers have memories you can store your favorite freq's and go from one to another as interest changes. 20 to 50 ft of wire for your antenna does great. This is just a quick sampling.

 

[n4voxgill]

All Coast Guard and USAF long distance flights use HF SSB, single side band. Most military transmissions are in USB, upper side band. You can pretty well hear the base stations over most of the United States and can hear the airplanes from hundreds of miles away. You can pick up navy ships and coastal marine stations.

World Utility Network, WUN on yahoo groups has many listings every day of stations heard. Even the famous spy number stations from overseas.

FEMA and Homeland Security have many nets on HF and also conduct many exercises. The various military units also conduct exercises in addition to their normal communications. If the coming increase in sun spot activity gets as bad as they are predicting, the government and military will be forced to use HF. Predictions are that even satellites will be pushed out of position. It also means that on HF you will hear stations from thousands of miles away. The last really good sunspot activity had even CB signals at 5 watts going thousands of miles.

I don't understand why Uniden didn't put SSB capability on the 330. It would have made it the only handheld that does trunked and SSB.

I have several HF radios that I use in my shack to receive HF. I have one 90 foot Carolina Windom wire antenna and two Sommers all band verticle antennas.

I also have an AOR AR8200 MK3 handheld. It covers from .1 to 3 GHz. Very little to hear in the top two GHz. It covers all of the public safety frequencies but it is not a scanner and will not trunk track. But for conventional it blows all of the scanners away. The sound quality is unbelievable with the receivers. They do what they do well. It just means that for trunked systems you would have to also use a scanner.

 

[fuzzymoto]

Thank you all. These were the explanations I was looking to hear.

I have done some research but I'm never quite sure of what exactly HF even is? I assume it is a range of frequencies below or above what my 330T gets. I do understand SSB (upper and lower) because of my old modified CB but how does a scanner scan both upper and lower at the same time or do I have to pick one or the other when I scan??

I have no idea what a BFO is or if my BR330T is an AM radio (I know it receives in AM). I also have no idea why Uniden didn't add SSB....that would have made for a unique scanner.

Sounds like there "may" be somthing worth listening to, although I will confess the Ham guys that I listen to get boring in about 10-seconds. If it is mostly this sort of talking, whether local or global it's probably not for me. If there are air and military that I may get in Pennsylvania then I would be interested. I'll have to look more into the antenna since I'd want this receiver as not only a radio to listen to "something more" but also as a backup to listen to local police/fire like I use mt 330T for. I'd guess that the small 2nd antenna I have on the roof would not work well for the "something more" and a long wire antenna would not work well for 150-160Mhz that my local police/fire are on.

I'm not a real fan of listening to the Ham guys talk about their radio setups and I doubt I'd be a fan of regual worldwide radio programs.

I don't have any digital or trunk tracking in my area. I've read a little bit more about the various Yaesu and ICom and they sound like they may be a little difficult to use as just a normal scanner (no numeric keys, no simple lockout function). Correct me if I'm wrong on that one. The AOR's look nice and seem to be a little more of what I'm used to but very expensive. Here's what I want to do maybe someone can aim me toward a radio brand/model. My favorite thing is "searching". On my BR330T I set it to search the entire .1 to 1300Mhz range. I lockout birdies so it is relatively noise free. Then when it stops on something I look it up, try to figure out what it is, and add it to my dynamic memory if it is not there already. This is what I enjoy. Would one of these radios (AOR, ICom, Yaesu) work well for this without being terribly complex??????

Seems to me like this would be fun with the larger range these radios offer but only if it can scan ranges, lockout frequencies and save frequencies in some organized manner.

Thanks again.....I'm still confused with a lot of questions (as you can see) but I'm very interested in hearing something more!

 

[N_Jay]

Scanning works well with channelized systems. like VHF and above.
(VHF starts at 30 MHz)
Scanning is just not an effective way to find signals on non-channelized bands like most of HF.
(HF is 30 MHz and below) (OK, really just 3 to 30 MHz)
The signals in this band are often not significantly stronger than the noise, and there are noise sources that are often stronger than typical signals. This makes the concept of stopping to see if a signal is there (scanning) a difficult proposition.

 

[Voyager]

Thank you all. These were the explanations I was looking to hear.

I have done some research but I'm never quite sure of what exactly HF even is? I assume it is a range of frequencies below or above what my 330T gets. I do understand SSB (upper and lower) because of my old modified CB but how does a scanner scan both upper and lower at the same time or do I have to pick one or the other when I scan??

I have no idea what a BFO is or if my BR330T is an AM radio (I know it receives in AM). I also have no idea why Uniden didn't add SSB....that would have made for a unique scanner.

Let's see if this quotes correctly:

(original table didn't quote well, so here is another: )
OK, this one didn't quote well either. Just look at the 3-letter designation, the 1 or 2-digit ITU band (1-12), then the frequency range.

Band ITU Frequency
Name Band Range
---- ---- --------------
ELF 1 3-30 Hz
SLF 2 30-300 Hz
ULF 3 300-3000 Hz
VLF 4 3 - 30 KHz
LF 5 30 - 300 KHz
MF 6 300 - 3000 KHz
HF 7 3 - 30 MHz
VHF 8 30 - 300 MHz
UHF 9 300 - 3000 MHz
SHF 10 3 - 30 GHz
EHF 11 30 - 300 GHz
(IR) 12 300 - 3000 GHz

For example, ELF would be between 3 Hz and 30 Hz. Etc. As you can see, HF is between 3 and 30 MHz.

The scanner would scan the mode you choose (USB or LSB) - similar to the way you choose between AM and FM. Scanning a SSB signal is not easy since there is no carrier to detect. That is likely why Uniden didn't include it.

A BFO is a Beat Frequency Oscillator - in simple terms, it's used to 'tune in' a SSB signal so the voices don't sound bassy or tinny.

Yes, you can receive AM radio - it's between 530 kHz and 1.8 MHz.

Joe M.

 

[fuzzymoto]

Thanks Joe....very helpful. I guess like scanning it's hard to say what one might hear in Pennsylvania on any of the above radio bands without actually buying the radio and putting up an antenna.

Am I correct that an antenna that would work well for these new bands and for SSB would not work well for the 150-160 police stuff that I'd like this radio to act as a backup for?...or would at least be a compromise.

Anyone have any radio recommendations based on my description in post # 15 above of what I'd like to do?

 

[Voyager]

Thanks Joe....very helpful. I guess like scanning it's hard to say what one might hear in Pennsylvania on any of the above radio bands without actually buying the radio and putting up an antenna.

Am I correct that an antenna that would work well for these new bands and for SSB would not work well for the 150-160 police stuff that I'd like this radio to act as a backup for?...or would at least be a compromise.

Anyone have any radio recommendations based on my description in post # 15 above of what I'd like to do?

In general, the mode makes no difference on the performance of an antenna. Although most SSB ham communications uses horizonally polarized antennas while most AM/FM uses vertically polarized antennas.

For HF communications, you will want an antenna such as a dipole or a multi-band vertical. The dipole is cheap to build. For example, for a 7 MHz dipole which will work fairly well on the HF bands for receiving, you want two pieces of wire about 33 feet long. Connect each wire to your coax - one to the center and the other to the shield - and run the wire in opposite directions getting it as high off the ground as you can. Your feedline can be about any length and just about any wire type - even RG-58, as the loss at HF frequencies is very low. This will give you a good antenna for basic HF reception. And no, it doesn't work all that well for VHF/UHF.

Joe M.

 

[Al42]

And on another note, "in Pennsylvania" really doesn't apply in this case. The range on some of these bands makes "near you" the planet Earth, since it's not uncommon to hear stations in South Africa, Asia, the Pacific, etc., from the east coast of the US, every day.

12-16 MHz during daylight hours, 3-9 MHz during darkness will give you the most range.

There's software you can run, much of it free that, if you feed the earphone jack of the scanner to your sound card, will decode teletype (news services), fax, all sorts of digital signals. You'll need some sort of oscillator, signal generator, BFO or SSB-capable receiver to receive most of them, but you can build a BFO for a couple of dollars. It's just an oscillator at the lowest IF frequency of the scanner. If it's not very stable you won't hear (or decode) for very long without retuning, but you'll see whether you're interested in that sort of reception.

It's a hobby - experiment.