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The gun issue

poltergeisty

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#21
I didn't blame the left in my opening. I blamed Congress and how they are a catalyst to how society forms. But by in large, it is indeed the left that has created bill after bill and talks out their butt all the time about guns. From federal, to state on down to local politics.
 
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#22
Not really. The police regard someone with a knife as deadly within 25ft and will often shoot them when they get closer than 25ft. I can point you to many videos of police testing where a cop with a holstered gun is basically dead from knife wounds from someone 25ft away where the cop can't get the gun out in time when the knife guy decides to attack. Knives can be more deadly than guns.

You can easily outrun crazy people with knives, bats, hammers, etc .
 
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#23
Not really. The police regard someone with a knife as deadly within 25ft and will often shoot them when they get closer than 25ft. I can point you to many videos of police testing where a cop with a holstered gun is basically dead from knife wounds from someone 25ft away where the cop can't get the gun out in time when the knife guy decides to attack. Knives can be more deadly than guns.
Good point, the police are shooting folks at 25 feet for brandishing a cellphone. I guess if you consume a lot of donuts its tough to run away. Seriously, the average person is going to retreat from some crazy fruitcake with a knife, while the police will engage them.

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#24
Do you not know about how the bad guy sues the good guy that used a gun on him? Or how the bad guy's family sued the good guy with a gun?

You're overly simplifying the problem. Besides, creating a forced insurance on those that own guns legally doesn't entice the bad guy to get asinine insurance.
If you are the good guy, you are going to be hapoy that your mandatory insurance protects you, you would be sued anyway because you have shiny stuff the bad guy wanted.

As far as a payout , most insurance does not cover criminal acts, or acts of war. It will cover attorneys fees .

Let's get back on topic.

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#25
I didn't blame the left in my opening. I blamed Congress and how they are a catalyst to how society forms.
We elect them, not the other way around. Congress reflects the society that elected them. The blame lies with us.

But by in large, it is indeed the left that has created bill after bill and talks out their butt all the time about guns.
Historically, it's because the right won't engage and participate in any meaningful way about guns. Anytime there's a major incident where people express the sentiment that they're tired of burying their dead children, all that comes from the right is "don't take my guns". You want to fix it? Then engage. Participate. Find a solution.
 
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#26
Solution from the Left.

Restrict gun ownership, register owners and guns. Keep guns out of hands of felons and mentally imbalanced.

Solution from the Right.

More guns. Arm everybody. Guns in emergency pull boxes on every street corner. Free guns in cereal boxes and church raffles.


Solution from the Middle

Get that gun out of my house, office, face,

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#27
Solution from the Left.

Restrict gun ownership, register owners and guns. Keep guns out of hands of felons and mentally imbalanced.
But none of these are solutions. You know why, because it's not the gun that's the problem. Many of the recent shootings have been carried out with already LEGAL gun ownership. What are you going to do about the underground market? I watched a interview with a Detroit underground gun dealer, with his face and voice masked, said that in that area if someone wants any type of weapon, full auto, Uzi's, whatever... he'd have it in their hands in less than 2 hours. Mind you these things take place in the country's most strict gun states. When are we going to do something about this besides going after the average tax paying citizen that legally owns his weapons that are NEVER going to hurt anyone?

Democrap policies on gun violence are worth about as much as a soiled piece of toilet paper about to get flushed down the toilet.

Solution from the Right.

More guns. Arm everybody. Guns in emergency pull boxes on every street corner. Free guns in cereal boxes and church raffles.
This is nothing more further from the truth. You can thank more gun sales and ownership by your twisted view of how to solve the problem, actually.

What you fail to understand is the amount of things that are prevented from a armed citizen. Lives are saved everyday without even firing a shot. What do you think is going to happen to these instances when the good guy with a gun has his rights of defense stripped? You'll hear about that death, or shooting on the news.

If you don't believe me, just grab a copy of the American Rifleman magazine or online version and read the armed citizen section. These are ALL true stories you NEVER hear or see in the media. This is just a small taste of what goes on every month in this country regarding armed citizen's.

What we need to do is go after mental health in this country. You can ignore it all you want, but the problem starts here. Starting with the pharmaceutical company's being a big contributor IMO.
 
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#28
You know why, because it's not the gun that's the problem. Many of the recent shootings have been carried out with already LEGAL gun ownership.
As I've stated before, the problem is simple. It's good guys with guns becoming bad guys with guns, and it's guns in the possession of good guys winding up in the possession of bad guys.

It's two relatively simply stated problems. Fix it.

What are you going to do about the underground market? I watched a interview with a Detroit underground gun dealer, with his face and voice masked, said that in that area if someone wants any type of weapon, full auto, Uzi's, whatever... he'd have it in their hands in less than 2 hours.
For starters, I would identify THAT guy as a bad guy with guns. If he's willing to share what he has with anybody, then he's part of the problem.

Mind you these things take place in the country's most strict gun states.
I just heard a story on the radio (so, no link to share) where some study found out that most mass shootings are taking place in states that have relatively lax gun laws. So, some inference could be made that stricter access to guns helps reduce gun violence in some way.

When are we going to do something about this besides going after the average tax paying citizen that legally owns his weapons that are NEVER going to hurt anyone?
I don't know about the next guy, but I have zero concern about someone like that. He can have whatever sort of gun his little heart desires, so far as I'm concerned because, by definition, he's NEVER going to hurt anyone.

I guess the question is, does someone like that actually exist?

Democrap policies on gun violence are worth about as much as a soiled piece of toilet paper about to get flushed down the toilet.
And Republican efforts to solve gun violence are non-existent. Is it better to have tried and failed, or to never have tried at all? That's a philosophical question for the ages.

What you fail to understand is the amount of things that are prevented from a armed citizen. Lives are saved everyday without even firing a shot. What do you think is going to happen to these instances when the good guy with a gun has his rights of defense stripped? You'll hear about that death, or shooting on the news.
Anecdotally, quite the opposite would appear to be true. More innocents are injured and killed with guns than saved by them. But that's besides the point. It seems there are enough literal constitutionalists in Congress and the 50 states that overturning the 2nd Amendment is highly unlikely. I don't care for guns, and I would oppose that with every fiber of my being.

What I WOULD do is suggest that people such as yourself change your focus. Instead of fighting something that is unlikely to happen, a total ban on all guns, direct your energy and help find solutions to the actual problems, which are quite simply good guys with guns becoming bad guys with guns, and guns in the possession of good guys winding up in the possession of bad guys.

FIX. IT.

If you don't believe me, just grab a copy of the American Rifleman magazine or online version and read the armed citizen section. These are ALL true stories you NEVER hear or see in the media.
Ummm... American Rifleman magazine IS the media.

What we need to do is go after mental health in this country. You can ignore it all you want, but the problem starts here. Starting with the pharmaceutical company's being a big contributor IMO.
Ok. Good idea. Both of these problems have roots in Republican political policy. Republicans traditionally oppose federal funding for medical and mental heath care. So-called "big-pharma" is a direct result of laissez faire capitalism, which is not always good for the general population, only the guys with the most money.

Both issues can be fixed, but require a departure from normal Republican dogma. Simplified, you people need to make a decision... Which is more important, your guns or your money. We've already established that people are third.
 
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#29
As I've stated before, the problem is simple. It's good guys with guns becoming bad guys with guns, and it's guns in the possession of good guys winding up in the possession of bad guys.

It's two relatively simply stated problems. Fix it.
It's a Mental health problem. Why don't we ALL fix it. If the gun is taken away and that said person is mentally disturbed, do you think the buck stops there?

Remember, You OWN it.



For starters, I would identify THAT guy as a bad guy with guns. If he's willing to share what he has with anybody, then he's part of the problem.
My point is it doesn't matter if it's a good guy, bad guy or a internet warrior like you. The weapons are available to satisfy whatever mental state one has and WILL satisfy death by gun if so desired. If you identify it, FIX IT.



I just heard a story on the radio (so, no link to share) where some study found out that most mass shootings are taking place in states that have relatively lax gun laws. So, some inference could be made that stricter access to guns helps reduce gun violence in some way.
Look at the overall death by guns. Chicago is worse than Afghanistan. Everyone with a half a brain knows this.



I don't know about the next guy, but I have zero concern about someone like that. He can have whatever sort of gun his little heart desires, so far as I'm concerned because, by definition, he's NEVER going to hurt anyone.
This will probably be a deleted post edit. If this is the case, start leaning more right because this will for sure piss off you Libtards. Actually, they DO want to do EXACTLY this. Anyone with a half a brain knows this.



And Republican efforts to solve gun violence are non-existent. Is it better to have tried and failed, or to never have tried at all? That's a philosophical question for the ages
.
Is it better to strip the 2nd amendment to "try"? You tell me?

Anecdotally, quite the opposite would appear to be true. More innocents are injured and killed with guns than saved by them. But that's besides the point. It seems there are enough literal constitutionalists in Congress and the 50 states that overturning the 2nd Amendment is highly unlikely. I don't care for guns, and I would oppose that with every fiber of my being.

What I WOULD do is suggest that people such as yourself change your focus. Instead of fighting something that is unlikely to happen, a total ban on all guns, direct your energy and help find solutions to the actual problems, which are quite simply good guys with guns becoming bad guys with guns, and guns in the possession of good guys winding up in the possession of bad guys.

FIX. IT.
If you don't want the 2nd amendment to be violated, than start acting like it. Condemn it, but I see none of that. Plenty of your far left buddies here would want nothing more than to get rid of ALL guns. If you don't believe in this, grow some balls and set them straight on how you feel, not sit here and only say it to you opposition.



Ummm... American Rifleman magazine IS the media.
It isn't main steam media. Clearly you probably couldn't tell me a single thing about it.



Ok. Good idea. Both of these problems have roots in Republican political policy. Republicans traditionally oppose federal funding for medical and mental heath care. So-called "big-pharma" is a direct result of laissez faire capitalism, which is not always good for the general population, only the guys with the most money.

Both issues can be fixed, but require a departure from normal Republican dogma. Simplified, you people need to make a decision... Which is more important, your guns or your money. We've already established that people are third.
The first thing you need to do is stop blaming Republicans. Your party is nothing but a constant fight to retain the bill of rights and freedom and it keeps getting worse as the months go by. Have you actually ever stopped and looked at your party represents? It isn't good..
 
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#30
It's a Mental health problem. Why don't we ALL fix it.
Great idea. Will you support federally funded mental health care?

If the gun is taken away and that said person is mentally disturbed, do you think the buck stops there?
No, but it helps stabilize the immediate situation.

Look at the overall death by guns. Chicago is worse than Afghanistan. Everyone with a half a brain knows this.
But I'm not talking about Afghanistan.

This will probably be a deleted post edit. If this is the case, start leaning more right because this will for sure piss off you Libtards. Actually, they DO want to do EXACTLY this. Anyone with a half a brain knows this.
Here I am, a liberal, stating in plain English that I don't care what sort of gun a good guy has, and that I don't want to touch the second amendment, and you're sitting here telling me otherwise? WTF? Can you f**cking read?

Is it better to strip the 2nd amendment to "try"? You tell me?
I'd like to think that I've made my opinion on this quite clear.

If you don't want the 2nd amendment to be violated, than start acting like it.
I think I just did. Where were you?

Condemn it, but I see none of that. Plenty of your far left buddies here would want nothing more than to get rid of ALL guns.
Far left? Who would that be?

If you don't believe in this, grow some balls and set them straight on how you feel, not sit here and only say it to you opposition.
I'd like to see you sit here and advocate for federally funded mental health care to the guys on the right, here, who don't want their tax money to be used to help anyone else.

It isn't main steam media. Clearly you probably couldn't tell me a single thing about it.
I didn't try to tell you anything about it. I don't know... American Rifleman seens pretty mainstream to me. I see it at newstands, it's not a fringe publication. It's not Fox News or CNN, but I've seen it on the tables in waiting rooms before. I certainly see NRA stickers everywhere. Are you telling me it's a fringe organization? If so, then why do Republicans give so much credence to the NRA agenda?

The first thing you need to do is stop blaming Republicans.
No. That's where to start. It's Republicans who typically stand in the way of rational discussions about gun violence. It's Republicans who oppose funding for human services that could mitigate violence. It's Republicans who oppose regulating industry, favoring profit over human welfare.

Your party is nothing but a constant fight...
I'm not a member of any political party.

Have you actually ever stopped and looked at your party represents? It isn't good..
But if I was a member of a political party, it would probably be Democrat. They seem to care more about people. Republicans seem to care more about guns and money. I tend to be a bit too altruistic to ever be a Republican.
 
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#31
(snip)
What we need to do is go after mental health in this country. You can ignore it all you want, but the problem starts here. Starting with the pharmaceutical company's being a big contributor IMO.
Well yes there is that prozac and then there is that hoplophilia that is going around.
 

poltergeisty

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#32
We elect them, not the other way around. Congress reflects the society that elected them. The blame lies with us.

Yeah, no doubt. It's why Obozo got two terms and how the House is full of idiots. I guess the Senate is too.


Anytime there's a major incident where people express the sentiment

Any time this happens I see a call to grab the gun without any real thought and they all speak of emotion rather than logic and common sense. It's easy to go after the gun, isn't it? Requires no real thought. Just take the thing away and all our troubles are solved. Nothing could be farther from the truth.


Again, it's a society issue.
 

poltergeisty

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#34
That one is easy. More people liked him than anyone the Republicans had to offer, in spite of his funny name.

No. It was because people bought into that hope and change crap. When the pillars onstage came down, and Obozo exited stage left, Trump set the GDP to it's best yet, unemployment to its lowest in decades and he really is doing more for blacks than Obozo ever did.
 
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#35
No. It was because people bought into that hope and change crap.
Isn't that exactly what you're doing with Trump? People vote for a particular candidate for their own reasons, and in the end, it ALL translates to liking one politician over another. In Obama's case, more people liked him than not. He won. In Trump's case, 3 million fewer people liked him, but an anomaly in the electoral college allowed him the win.

You derisively say they bought into "hope and change" as if that's a bad thing. And you bought into "build the wall" and "lock her up".

Trump's supporters aren't holding any moral high ground here.

When the pillars onstage came down, and Obozo exited stage left...
What pillars came down? Obama had his two terms, and departed the White House with a healthy economy. What, exactly, are you talking about?

Trump set the GDP to it's best yet, unemployment to its lowest in decades and he really is doing more for blacks than Obozo ever did.
Obama inherited an economy that was the worst since the Great Depression. By the time he left it was doing as well as it ever had. Trump inherited that economy, and by the end of December, after less than two years in office had slowed it's momentum to the point that the gains made since his inauguration have been zeroed out.

Buf he hates the same people you do, so it's ok. That seems to be the new definition of winning.
 

poltergeisty

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#36
Isn't that exactly what you're doing with Trump?

*shakes head* I guess you didn't even read what I said. Low unemployment, high GDP, etc.



What pillars came down? Obama had his two terms, and departed the White House with a healthy economy. What, exactly, are you talking about?

The pilars he had on his stage. And a healthy economy? You must me joking. At the end of Obozo's term the economy was dismal. You trully do have TDS, Scarecrow.

Obama inherited an economy that was the worst since the Great Depression. By the time he left it was doing as well as it ever had.

So by this logic, and since you feel Trump is such a bad guy, the economy would be going to hell, no?

Truth is, Obozo did jack squat! Trump came in and reduced massive amounts of job killing regulations and lowered taxes which in turn boosted the economy and the stock market. Obozo raised taxes and created asinine regulations. That's a fact.

And let me add to the fact that Obozo inherited a bad economy becasue his own damn party failed to regulate the GSEs and so the "bubble burst."
 
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#37
*shakes head* I guess you didn't even read what I said. Low unemployment, high GDP, etc.






The pilars he had on his stage. And a healthy economy? You must me joking. At the end of Obozo's term the economy was dismal. You trully do have TDS, Scarecrow.




So by this logic, and since you feel Trump is such a bad guy, the economy would be going to hell, no?

Truth is, Obozo did jack squat! Trump came in and reduced massive amounts of job killing regulations and lowered taxes which in turn boosted the economy and the stock market. Obozo raised taxes and created asinine regulations. That's a fact.

And let me add to the fact that Obozo inherited a bad economy becasue his own damn party failed to regulate the GSEs and so the "bubble burst."
You truly are completely delusional.


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#40
I'll just leave this here. I look forward to the brain dead responses. Never mind that fact this is now off topic.

(Snip some Derp about Obama)
Yeah, no doubt. It's why Obozo got two terms and how the House is full of idiots. I guess the Senate is too.

snip.
Gee I wonder how that happens?

Whenever the "Right" get pushed in a corner they have to blame Obama or the Clintons for something totally unrelated. Hey guess what Obama didn't take away all your guns like you thought he would. Lets not forget he had to bail out the bank mess GW Bush left on the table, not to forget the wars and he wrangled in that Osama Bin Laudin guy that GWB misplaced (because he loves the Saudi's).
 
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