• Effective immediately we will be deleting, without notice, any negative threads or posts that deal with the use of encryption and streaming of scanner audio.

    We've noticed a huge increase in rants and negative posts that revolve around agencies going to encryption due to the broadcasting of scanner audio on the internet. It's now worn out and continues to be the same recycled rants. These rants hijack the threads and derail the conversation. They no longer have a place anywhere on this forum other than in the designated threads in the Rants forum in the Tavern.

    If you violate these guidelines your post will be deleted without notice and an infraction will be issued. We are not against discussion of this issue. You just need to do it in the right place. For example:
    https://forums.radioreference.com/rants/224104-official-thread-live-audio-feeds-scanners-wait-encryption.html

Utah Comms eventually going P-25

Status
Not open for further replies.
Joined
Apr 4, 2015
Messages
8
Location
Utah
#1
So word has it in about a year or two the UCA systems will be switched out to P-25, now here is the pondering, will they go phase l or ll and do you think they will start rolling out Encrypted comms? Curious as to what other's thoughts are on this. I work on the county level and I hear chatter but nothing solid and I'm also a radio/scanner- enthusiast/hobbyist so for personal listening I'm also curious as to the direction the system will go.
 

radioman1044

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Jun 27, 2009
Messages
22
Location
Garden Valley Idaho
#2
So word has it in about a year or two the UCA systems will be switched out to P-25, now here is the pondering, will they go phase l or ll and do you think they will start rolling out Encrypted comms? Curious as to what other's thoughts are on this. I work on the county level and I hear chatter but nothing solid and I'm also a radio/scanner- enthusiast/hobbyist so for personal listening I'm also curious as to the direction the system will go.
I highly doubt it--- Cost to much and every news channel in the country uses scanners for there broadcasting.
Cheers
 
Joined
Dec 19, 2002
Messages
459
Location
Portsmouth, VA
#3
I don't live in Utah so I don't know much about the budgetary constraints......but living in a state which is rapidly migrating to encryption (probably close to 1/4 of the state now has encrypted LE)....money seems to be no object when departments want it. As far as the media is concerned...as long as they get a department issued radio, they won't utter a peep. I hope your state doesn't go this route but such is the country we live in now.

Eugene KG4AVE
 

allend

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Feb 1, 2012
Messages
1,149
Location
Long Beach, CA
#4
So word has it in about a year or two the UCA systems will be switched out to P-25, now here is the pondering, will they go phase l or ll and do you think they will start rolling out Encrypted comms? Curious as to what other's thoughts are on this. I work on the county level and I hear chatter but nothing solid and I'm also a radio/scanner- enthusiast/hobbyist so for personal listening I'm also curious as to the direction the system will go.
I would say since its a statewide agency most likely they will utilize their XTS 5000 radios which still work as their main work horse. As time passes they will eventually phase out to APX as to what they are already most likely doing.

So my bet is that they go Phase I and roll that direction. They can use their existing radios and also use APX radios. If they go Phase II TDMA then they are stuck replacing all of their mobile and HT radios.

As to encryption I bet anything is on the table moving forward in two years from now. Most likely and I can bet the farm on it that they will implement more encryption because this is the world we live in today with security and locking down systems. There is no way around it moving forward. Everybody is on-board with Encryption and that's the end of the story.
 

wbswetnam

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Oct 11, 2005
Messages
1,567
Location
DMR-istan
#6
As far as the media is concerned...as long as they get a department issued radio, they won't utter a peep.
Not even all media get privy to encrypted radios. In my town (Russellville, Arkansas) not even the local media are allowed to listen to police radio traffic. The police are free to issue sanitized press releases as they please about crime events in the community. Who's gonna know otherwise?
 
Joined
Dec 19, 2002
Messages
459
Location
Portsmouth, VA
#8
I know some media do not get issued radios and most, not all of the ones that don't complain loud and long. Again I say MOST. That's the point of the whole debate...."who's gonna know otherwise?" Nobody. You get your info through a huge, sanitized filter which covers up all manner of questionable activity.

Eugene
 
Joined
Jun 16, 2013
Messages
3,262
Location
Texas
#9
I would say since its a statewide agency most likely they will utilize their XTS 5000 radios which still work as their main work horse. As time passes they will eventually phase out to APX as to what they are already most likely doing.



So my bet is that they go Phase I and roll that direction. They can use their existing radios and also use APX radios. If they go Phase II TDMA then they are stuck replacing all of their mobile and HT radios.

That’s only if their existing radios are flashed for 9600 bps trunking. If they are only flashed for conventional or 3600 bps trunking they will have to be replaced as Motorola no longer sells flash upgrades for the Astro 25 line. Also, depot support for the Astro 25 line will stop in the next few months and Motorola will only continue to sell components for the radios until stock is depleted.

We are in the final days for manufacturer support on Astro 25 subscribers.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Joined
Mar 19, 2015
Messages
218
Location
Reno NV
#10
The new P25 will have to have New APX or Harris Radios to work. I say Harris because there is possibility they could win the contract for a state wide digital radio system
 
Joined
Sep 20, 2008
Messages
5,475
Location
In the 'patch
#11
The new P25 will have to have New APX or Harris Radios to work. I say Harris because there is possibility they could win the contract for a state wide digital radio system


Or Tait or Kenwood or BK/Relm. Harris and Motorola are not the only game in town for P25. They just happen to be the most expensive.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Joined
Aug 16, 2008
Messages
783
Location
In the land of make believe
#13
What makes you say that? Harris has not built a really good State system anywhere. Fl. has a system that is in the last phase of being replaced and it does not work as well as the NJ radio statewide systems. Ark, Alaska, Miss. Ct. are just a few who have gone with statewide systems using Motorola. Even in Fl. the bid for the P25 system has been given to Motorola with Harris protesting. BTW, how good was that OpenScam system in PA?
 

SCPD

Member
Joined
Feb 24, 2001
Messages
65,126
Location
Virginia
#14
If they use motorola and will use the apx line encryption is default in the radio with the apx line. It's whether someone wants to use it and has the necessary means to enable it.
 
Joined
Jun 16, 2013
Messages
3,262
Location
Texas
#15
If they use motorola and will use the apx line encryption is default in the radio with the apx line. It's whether someone wants to use it and has the necessary means to enable it.


Actually it’s not. The hardware module is part of the board (where it was an option on previous models). The radio still has to have be single/multi hardware flash option though in order to use encryption though. In reality, no different from the Astro 25 line.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Joined
Aug 16, 2008
Messages
783
Location
In the land of make believe
#16
Actually it’s not. The hardware module is part of the board (where it was an option on previous models). The radio still has to have be single/multi hardware flash option though in order to use encryption though. In reality, no different from the Astro 25 line.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Not true at all. ADP encryption is standard and is not key loaded. The computer programmer programs it while programming the codeplug. It still defeats the scanner listener.
Hardware encryption is an expensive option and requires a keyloader far more secure than ADP but we are not talking about Nuclear safety here only about barking dog calls and noisy neighbors.

If someone buys the 8000 APX and associated mobile you have all four bands.
 
Joined
Apr 4, 2015
Messages
8
Location
Utah
#17
Hey guys sorry for the delay in reply! love all the feedback! As far as radios go I know alot of agencies that are transitioning to the APX line for radios I know several agencies that have already but I also know alot of agencies that still are running XTS 2500/5000 radios and our agency believe it or not has XTS3000 which are flashed for 9600 and are doing the current 3600 but our mobiles are still MCS2000. Now there are a ton of agencies that are still using MTS/MCS2000 and alot of that switch is going to fall upon those agencies to invest in the newer radios. As far as encryption we have channels on the SZ system that are already encrypted so I assume that those will stay encrypted on the new system but as far as anyone adding more channels to be encrypted I really cant say that they will or wont to be honest I dont think that they will, maybe a few OPS or SWAT channels, but not their main COMS though(at least I hope not). So as far as I know having talked to someone directly from UCA they have bid out on the project to Motorola and Harris and they should have a answer in OCT-NOV as to who will win that bid and start constructing their new system. As far as the system itself, it will be phase 2 with backwards compatibility(phase 1) for the first 5 years til all users have APX model radios then it will be fully phase 2 only at that time, so in short in 5 to possibly 7 years UCA will be fully phase 2.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top