Very overwhelmed on Ham, Two way and walki talki

[HeeHawBR549]

Very new to all this and trying to make sense of it all, I hope someone can clear this whole mess up.
First off I just started looking into all this, I want a long range two way radio and from what I'm reading all the FRS radios are way to short range. I am in the city but not skyscraper big city so FRS ( walki talki ) are out.

My questions are
1. on the two way/ Ham... whats the difference or are they the same? Some amazon list them as Ham and others as Two Way.

2. The Ham license, does that apply to the radio used or the frequency transmitting on? in other words can I get the two way radio listed as ham and transmit on FRS frequency without a license and would it even work?

3.In looking at the baofeng ham and two ways what kind of range am I looking at anyway.

I would like a hand held radio with a 15 mile range across a low city (1 to 2 stories)

I hope my rambling makes sense

 

[avdrummerboy]

It sounds like you're looking into the pofung, baofeng, etc. radios so I'll answer with those radios in mind.

1. They are realistically the same thing, these companies are very much for profit companies, therefore they advertise to everyone they can, HAM radio ops, businesses, public safety, consumers, you name it they want a radio sold to them. So they transmit and receive on a pretty wide range, you just have to make sure to put in and use only frequencies you're authorized for- at least for transmitting. Receiving, you can receive on any frequency you wish.

2. In short, you do not need a ham license to own or buy a 'HAM' radio. However, to be authorized to transmit on ham frequencies, you do need a license. Same for business frequencies. Again, you can listen on anything you'd like. As to these radios, yes you can get them and put in FRS frequencies and use them as it is an unlicensed service, free for all to use.

3. This is the most tricky question of all, and one that many people ask hoping that there is an easy answer. The real answer is, it completely depends on many factors, including; ionospheric conditions, transmit power, antenna, line of sight distance and fading, etc. In short you'll get what you get and theres not a whole lot you can do about it in a simplex environment. 15 miles with obstacles and normal fading and noise is more of a dream than a reality unfortunately, but 1-2 is easy enough. Your best bet is to get a ham license and use a repeater.

 

[SCPD]

Simple fact is that with a portable radio and a rubber duck antenna you will not get 15 miles. Even in ideal conditions that might be a stretch. (I worked 5w rubber duck from top of a mountain (2500 ft) and got about ~10 miles without issue.)

If you're talking about two portable radios with the same configuration then you won't get 15 miles. You would need (2) mobile radios (35-50w) and proper antennas. With a simple roof-mounted antenna you shouldn't have any problems. As the other reply said, there a multitude of factors that determine what kind of signal you will end up with.

For a relatively flat city with no mountains or hills in the way then you would be fine.

My mobile reference would apply to vehicles as well as a base-station setup. Yes, you would need either a commercial license on a specific frequency or a HAM license on HAM frequencies.

PS. Just know that whatever method you use your conversation will not be private.

 

[nd5y]

I would like a hand held radio with a 15 mile range across a low city (1 to 2 stories)

So would everybody else but it is not physically possible.
Two hand held radios alone at ground level, without external antennas or without using a repeater, are not going to be able to communicate 15 miles in an urban environment with flat terrain.

How much money do you want to spend?
What do you intend to use the radios for? That makes a big difference in the type of license you need and the radio service and frequencies you would be able to use.
You might be able to lease some hand held radios from a service provider. Operating under their license and using their infrastructure and could give you way more than 15 mile range.

We also need to know what country you are in. All the answers so far are mainly applicable to the USA.

 

[trap5858]

With 2 meter ham working through a repeater you might get the range you are looking for. Keep in mind as others pointed out your communication will not be private. Also with HAM radio you may not use it for business purposes.

I suggest you search out a HAM radio club in your area and contact them- their members would be happy to point you in the right direction as well as train you for your ham license.

 

[BoxAlarm187]

Who are you trying to talk to on your radio...business, friends, ham radio operators, someone else?

 

[W8RMH]

There are private commercial companies which rent their radios and you use their repeaters and trunked systems in the "Industrial/Business Pool - Commercial, Trunked". You do not need a license as you operate under theirs.

Your location would help determine if any are available in your area. Most major cities have them. Look at the bottom of your county page in the database for private trunked systems.

 

[HeeHawBR549]

I am think about disaster situation I work on the other side of town and would want to communicate with my family.
You know Phones down, cell jammed up with other calls. The way I understand it with ham if it was a disaster ( life threatening ) than I could use it, key word Life threatening!

Ok so if I get the Murs will that cover whole family? and Ham is per person I understand.
I am still leaning on Ham as an option as long as I can get the 10-15 mile with the Hand held running 5 watt.

 

[BoxAlarm187]

You know Phones down, cell jammed up with other calls. The way I understand it with ham if it was a disaster ( life threatening ) than I could use it, key word Life threatening!

A disaster itself isn't life threatening. Scary, inconvenient, worrisome? Yes. But life threatening, no, unless of course, your life or a loved one's life is in immediate danger. Just being worried about them because phone lines are down wouldn't necessarily make it a life threatening.

Ham radio, if you're licensed, can be used for any type of permissible communications whether an emergency exists or not.

Ok so if I get the Murs will that cover whole family?

MURS is limited to 2W (very limited range), does not require a license, and can be used by just about anyone. https://www.fcc.gov/encyclopedia/multi-use-radio-service-murs-0

...Ham is per person I understand.

Yes, everyone operating on an amateur radio must have their own individual license.

I am still leaning on Ham as an option as long as I can get the 10-15 mile with the Hand held running 5 watt.

Won't happen, even with the best of conditions. 2 miles maybe, but not 10-15 miles - not without using a repeater in-between.

 

[jaspence]

Radio usage

The Baofeng and similar radios are not certified for FRS or MURS. Any frequency they use requires a FCC license of some kind. As has been said, a system using a repeater is the best choice for the distance you need. Even that may not be reliable in a true disaster if it does not use back up power or the tower is destroyed.

 

[paulears]

I'm surprised that nobody has described the differences between the choices.

Hams take a test, ranging from a basic check that they know how to operate without causing interference to other users - to one that requires a high degree of electronics and physics, and the ability to understand the equipment they use. In return the higher license classes get higher power and access to frequency bands that go further. Business radio users simply want to communicate. they don't need to understand how radios function, as long as they can turn them on and find the PTT button. Faced with a weak signal, the hams would know that changing location, antenna orientation, or simply the position they hold the radio can make a difference - business users expect it to simply work. The free radio systems are not just free in cost terms, they're free in what people do with them. Many folk buy them as presents for their kids who can wipe out the business users if they are close. There's no protection, and in many jurisdictions, you cannot legally attach external antennas, or use higher power. Some people use higher power radios on these free frequencies, and nobody really cares, or gets worried. Business radio where people pay has a little protection built in against idiots. Hams look after idiots themselves, having the ability to track them down and identify them. In the UK, the authorities simply don't have resources to police the airwaves, unless interference to essential services happens. Kids messing around on the free channels are ignored.

10 miles is just unrealistic to expect, without assistance from a repeater, as said above. Antenna height at least at one end is vital!