YAESU FT 7900 Question

[KR7CQ]

For those familiar with these radios....

I am a bit confused as to how a YAESU FT 7900 R/E is different from the standard 7900.

Also, can you tell me what model number I need to find the following features:

Extended transmit range (out of ham band), and N connector interface on the rear.

I am seeing many places selling these radios with all sorts of conflicting specs / model numbers.

Any direction on WHERE to buy the model I am looking for would be appreciated also.

 

[AK9R]

The "R" suffix is Yaesu's standard method of designating a radio as being for the U.S. market. Likewise, the "E" indicates European market.

If you are looking for a radio to transmit on the Land Mobile frequencies (as classified in Part 90), you should buy a Part 90 certified radio which the Yaesu FT-7900 is not.

 

[KR7CQ]

I already own two of them with SO239 connections, and am aware of the fact that they are not Part 90 radios. I just want to find a few more with N connectors if possible (personal preference). I have no intention of using them for out-of-band TX unless there is ever an emergency / disaster situation that calls for it. And in such a situation it would be legal to use on any band you had to use it on for life and death matters, with the caveat that no other means of communication was available to get the help needed. Perfectly legal. Other than the worst case scenario, I have zero use for Part 90 equipment.

 

[WB4CS]

I already own two of them with SO239 connections, and am aware of the fact that they are not Part 90 radios. I just want to find a few more with N connectors if possible (personal preference). I have no intention of using them for out-of-band TX unless there is ever an emergency / disaster situation that calls for it. And in such a situation it would be legal to use on any band you had to use it on for life and death matters, with the caveat that no other means of communication was available to get the help needed. Perfectly legal. Other than the worst case scenario, I have zero use for Part 90 equipment.

Who are you going to talk to out of band? Try talking to your local PD with your ham license and you'll probably find yourself with a fine, or revoked license, or confiscated equipment. It's happened before. But hey, it's your money and your license.

As for the N-Connector, I'm not aware of any radios that come with them. SO239 seems to be the standard.

It sounds like you're looking for a Motorola radio and don't know it.

 

[KR7CQ]

Sure you can use it out of band, but who are you going to talk to? Try talking to your local PD with your ham license and you'll probably find yourself with a fine. It's happened before. But hey, it's your money and your license.

First off, I could see situations where in a disaster that knocked out the cell phone system, people might be forced to use their bubble pack radios to ask for help. Or maybe one of them would have something I need. Or maybe they are using MURS, or business radios, or marine radios, etc. I have a pretty tall tower for my scanner and for my base, and can hear these types of signals from 10 miles plus right now. If need be, I could talk to them in a true emergency.

As far as talking to PD, it's not going to happen, as they are all P25 around here. Not to mention that a PD system is the last I would every think about keying up on. The most "risky" thing I could do would be to hit the Phoenix fire dispatch channel, and I am well aware of the fact that this would be a foolish and illegal thing to do unless there is as I said, no other means of communication, and lives were truly on the line, in which case there would be no fine, as Part 97 clearly allows for this. Whether it irritated them or not, if it were to go to court, it would be thrown out, assuming everything was legitimate on my end. It's federal law.

That said, if I had a family member(s) in need of emergency aid in a life or death situation with no other means of getting help, I really wouldn't be too concerned about a fine, or any other legal action really. I know you don't know me, but I don't break laws in any area of my life really, other than mild speeding. I follow the rules, but I also want every edge if the unthinkable ever happens. There is no downside to having extended TX while there are potential upsides (however unlikely that you would ever need it), and they come with no extra cost.

Now I will admit that it's bothersome that any guy on the street with a credit card can easily get a radio that will hit public safety repeaters. I do wish that only licensed amateurs were allowed to buy this equipment, but there is no practical way to stop what is happening. I have no doubt that a lot of unlicensed people are out there (including many doomsday preppers) buying $40 Baofengs and Wouxuns who may be tempted to do things that shouldn't be done.

As far as the Moto comment....I admire the quality, but don't care for the lack of "on-the-fly" flexibility in terms of programming.

 

[DaveNF2G]

There is a practical way to stop the out-of-band fetish that some hams seem to have. The FCC would have to get back into the regulatory business, though.

All they have to do is refuse to certify transceivers that can be modified to emit any out-of-band signals.

[EDIT] BTW, hams are governed by several parts of the FCC rules and federal laws, not just Part 97. It is a violation of federal regulations beyond Part 97 to program your personal transceiver to transmit on frequencies for which you are not licensed or authorized. There is no "in case of potential emergency" exception to that.

 

[KR7CQ]

There is a practical way to stop the out-of-band fetish that some hams seem to have. The FCC would have to get back into the regulatory business, though.

All they have to do is refuse to certify transceivers that can be modified to emit any out-of-band signals.

Apparently they aren't as concerned as the "radio police" on internet forums, and I doubt that licensed operators are the main people that anyone should worry about using these radios illegally.

Part 97 is very clear about out of band TX, and there is nothing wrong with owning LEGAL equipment that has the capability to do something legally, under the law (given that the conditions expressed in that rule are met).

And for people who don't like the law the way it is, or the way that the government handles certain issues, I say "then work to change things". Don't like a rule or law? Lobby to get it changed. Because until then you are going to have to live with the rules we have, whether you like them, or have complete disdain for them. I will do the same, as I take great pride in living an honest life.

 

[AK9R]

Part 97 is very clear about out of band TX, and there is nothing wrong with owning LEGAL equipment that has the capability to do something legally, under the law (given that the conditions expressed in that rule are met).

You are correct that Part 97 opens the door to transmitting out of band in case of an emergency if no other means of communications is available. Frankly, I think the cases of this happening are going to be rare. Yes, there may be places in the mountains of Arizona where a cell phone has no connectivity. But, when dealing with an emergency, I think you have to ask yourself whether it would be more appropriate to use amateur radio to ask someone to make an emergency phone call for you or to transmit out of band to talk to public safety personnel directly.

And, while it may be legal to own equipment modified for out of band transmit, you also have to ask yourself if it's prudent to do so. When I was first licensed, I was all about modifying my radios for out of band transmit. I had the "fetish" that Dave refers to. Then, my car was broken into and a modded handheld was stolen. That handheld had local law enforcement channels programmed into and it would transmit on those frequencies. I stopped modding my radios right then. I even paid Kenwood East Coast Service to reverse the mod on a radio I had purchased used. The liability of a modded radio falling into the wrong hands is just too great. Granted, many public safety agencies have gone to various trunked and/or digital systems and a modded ham radio isn't going to work on those systems. But, there are lots of agencies still using conventional radio systems.

Michael, you are free to do as you please within the law. However, your amateur radio license is four days old. The people you are calling the "radio police" are, in many cases, experienced amateur radio operators who are advising you to exercise caution. A word to the wise should be sufficient.

 

[KR7CQ]

You are correct that Part 97 opens the door to transmitting out of band in case of an emergency if no other means of communications is available. Frankly, I think the cases of this happening are going to be rare. Yes, there may be places in the mountains of Arizona where a cell phone has no connectivity. But, when dealing with an emergency, I think you have to ask yourself whether it would be more appropriate to use amateur radio to ask someone to make an emergency phone call for you or to transmit out of band to talk to public safety personnel directly.

And, while it may be legal to own equipment modified for out of band transmit, you also have to ask yourself if it's prudent to do so. When I was first licensed, I was all about modifying my radios for out of band transmit. I had the "fetish" that Dave refers to. Then, my car was broken into and a modded handheld was stolen. That handheld had local law enforcement channels programmed into and it would transmit on those frequencies. I stopped modding my radios right then. I even paid Kenwood East Coast Service to reverse the mod on a radio I had purchased used. The liability of a modded radio falling into the wrong hands is just too great. Granted, many public safety agencies have gone to various trunked and/or digital systems and a modded ham radio isn't going to work on those systems. But, there are lots of agencies still using conventional radio systems.

Michael, you are free to do as you please within the law. However, your amateur radio license is four days old. The people you are calling the "radio police" are, in many cases, experienced amateur radio operators who are advising you to exercise caution. A word to the wise should be sufficient.

I totally appreciate what you are saying on all counts.

I agree that I have a fraction of a percent of a chance of needing such a thing, but that could be said of homeowners insurance and firearms also, both of which I have. I would be willing to wager that many on here could say the same.

As far as the four days, yes. But a name search will show my previous licensing which is many years old (GMRS). Years back I got my GMRS license, constructed a base station complete with tower, and had handhelds for the family which were good for about 10-12 miles on average. We eliminated cell phones for several years, and I worked local repeaters as well. I have also been involved with CB, scanners, antenna building, etc., for 40+ years. I am also a project manager and system designer for a commercial satellite corporation and I design / oversee (and sometimes help install) some fairly complex systems for large facilities, and hold certifications for RF system design in my field. We also do microwave communications, and install several types of off-air antennas for our systems, mostly beams.

As far as the stolen equipment and worrying about people transmitting on public safety frequencies, I understand. I do however believe that anyone who puts those frequencies in their radio with no tone, on low power, and on the repeater output frequency would prevent virtually any chance of serious interference. That said, you make a valid point and it should be a consideration. A radio with such frequencies would be best treated as you would a firearm (properly secured at all times).

At any rate I respect the advice given and understand what is at stake with regard to this topic. I appreciate experienced hams who take their own time to educate new hams. I do understand why this topic could ruffle feathers. Believe me, I have heard PLENTY of people on the air here in Phoenix who need to go back and look at the rules, and some of the science behind what they are trying to do. Some of the simplex stuff in my area would have to be heard to be believed, but that's another story.

 

[zz0468]

You are correct that Part 97 opens the door to transmitting out of band in case of an emergency if no other means of communications is available.

God, I'd love it if we could just settle this one and for all.

"§ 97.403 Safety of life and protection of property. No provision of these rules prevents the use by an amateur station of any means of radiocommunication at its disposal to provide essential communication needs in connection with the immediate safety of human life and immediate protection of property when normal communication systems are not available."

"§ 90.427 Precautions against unauthorized operation. (b) Except for frequencies used in accordance with § 90.417, no person shall program into a transmitter frequencies for which the licensee using the transmitter is not authorized."

Above are two pertinent excerpts from FCC rules Part 97 and Part 90, respectively. In one, there exists a statement that nothing in the rules (Part 97 specifically) prevents an amateur from using whatever means necessary to save a life or property. In the other, is a specific prohibition against programming unauthorized frequencies into a radio.

These seemingly contradictory statements in the rules actually make the whole big picture a bit more clear. The FCC's intent is to prohibit unauthorized people from transmitting, or having transmit capability on frequencies that they are not specifically authorized for. At the same time, there's a common sense statement indicating that no one should die because of some anal retentive adherence to the rules.

To sum it all up, no, you can't pre-program your ham radios "just in case". But if someone is dying and you happen to come up on an unauthorized channel and manage to actually save a life, you're probably not going to get into much trouble.

 

[KR7CQ]

zz0468, that sounds like a very reasonable summation.

I agree that programming PS frequencies in is not good in general, and really not a good idea if the TX is tied to RX as it is with many radios. I personally wouldn't program PS frequencies into my unit for the obvious reasons, plus I know them (and their tones) all by memory, so if I really wanted to insert them in the event of the apocalypse arriving (humor), I could. On my Baofeng UV-5R+ I do program them in on RX, but set the TX frequencies to 2 meter calling, just in case the PTT gets hit by mistake (easy to do on that radio too).

 

[AK9R]

We've deviated from the original intent of this thread and I think we've covered the issues and considered the applicable rules.

That said, let's steer the conversation back to the subject of the Yaesu FT-7900.

 

[DaveNF2G]

I do however believe that anyone who puts those frequencies in their radio with no tone, on low power, and on the repeater output frequency would prevent virtually any chance of serious interference.

They would also prevent virtually any chance of communicating with anyone on those frequencies. What would be the point?

The programming itself would still be illegal, under provisions of federal regulations beyond Part 97.

 

[KR7CQ]

They would also prevent virtually any chance of communicating with anyone on those frequencies. What would be the point?

The programming itself would still be illegal, under provisions of federal regulations beyond Part 97.

Listening, would be the point. There a plenty of people who program their favorite PS frequencies into these radios to scan for listening purposes only. While I wouldn't program these frequencies in if any illegal TX could go out on them, on a radio like the FT-60R....there is little doubt that it's a common practice, and hardly something the FCC is going to know about unless some truly clueless person transmits on the input frequency (with tone), or transmits on the output frequency (with tone) while being near a unit doing car to car on it.

I do include PS frequencies in my Baofeng UV-5R programming as "RX only" (TX is in the ham band for each RX frequency - VHF Calling), and that is not illegal, since the radio is not programmed to transmit on frequencies for which it is not licensed.

At any rate, I do think this is the radio to have if you don't need other bands or cross-band. It's solid and easy to use, including on-the-fly.

 

[AK9R]

Guys, this is my second request to bring the out-of-band transmit issue to an end. The stated topic of the thread is Yaesu FT-7900 model numbers and modifications. If you want to talk about transmitting out-of-band with amateur radio gear, please take it elsewhere.

 

[hill]

Not going to find an FT7900 with N connectors, since they are only made with SO239.

 

[AK9R]

According to the FT-7900E Operating Manual that I downloaded from the Yaesu UK web site, the E version has an N connector.

http://212.69.194.238/files/FT-7900E_OM_ENG_EH016M210.pdf

But, you probably won't find the E version for sale in the U.S. by a U.S. dealer.

 

[N4KVE]

The 7900R which is sold in the USA uses a PL259 connecter for the antenna coax. However, the 7900E which is sold in Europe does use the N connecter for the coax. However, since the OP lives in the USA, he should use the "R" radio, as it will have the US bandplan coverage, & should he somehow find the "E" model on the internet, & have it sent to the USA, Yaesu USA will not warranty it, as it was never meant to be sold here, & Yaesu USA did not import it into this country. Same deal as going on a cruise to the Bahamas, & buying a Minolta camera there that's not sold in the USA. Have a problem with it & Minolta USA will laugh at you since they didn't import it. Any warranty work would have to be done by the Bahamian Minolta importer. So stick with the USA "R" model unless you plan to move to the UK.

 

[zz0468]

If you need an N connector on it, lop off the SO239, and put on an N connector.

 

[dmarion66]

As far as the connector issue is concerned, you could use a PL259/N adapter such as this:

PL-259 to N-type female adapter, 2-pack