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The Uniden Tavern - For general chit-chat and non-technical discussion specific to Uniden and does not fall within the above forum topics. This is not the forum to get technical advice from.

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  #41 (permalink)  
Old 05-20-2017, 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by DJ11DLN View Post
One of the most common car-to-base calls I hear is words to the effect of, "Dispatch, is the CAD up? I can't get mine to work." Maybe FirstNet will fix this.
The agency I worked for, any time that happened it was an issue with the individual's CAD (Panasonic Toughbook). It was either to OS that had locked up (Win7) or the CAD software (Motorola PremierOne). Occasionally it was a hardware issue. Some of the older laptops had only 2gig of RAM.
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Old 05-20-2017, 3:49 PM
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Actually, the more common practice has been for the news companies to purchase their own radios, and have the agency agree to program up to monitor the system.
Better that all the news stations have to purchase all of their own radios/receivers for their news making purpose rather than for them to have our states & Federal Agencies handing them out to them for free on a Silver platter at the taxpayer's cost just so that the news stations can keep up with the bad, ugly & negative news stories going on for their daily news broadcasts.

However, for the news stations around the world that want & need the encrypted communications to be heard and received by them for their news stories & news coverage, they would most likely have to purchase the illegal to the public & really expensive AOR government receivers or some other form of government use only radios/receivers which you have to provide a Federal or government licence in order to even purchase one. That right there would say that the news station being non federal & non government run, could not buy the radios or receivers to properly receive & decrypt the encrypted radio communications legally. That means that our states & Federal Agencies in America would in fact have to help them all out & purchase these new communications radios & receivers for the news station around the world legally with their Federal licenses in tact while all at the taxpayer's cost ranging anywhere from $900 to $14,000 for a single government use only grade AOR Receiver that would most likely let the news stations hear, receive & decrypt the encrypted communications so that they can still be aware of what is going on & happening daily & hourly around us for their coverage needs also known as NEWS!! It is all just totally ridiculous in my opinion.
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Old 05-20-2017, 4:46 PM
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Originally Posted by CorwinScansNM View Post
Better that all the news stations have to purchase all of their own radios/receivers for their news making purpose rather than for them to have our states & Federal Agencies handing them out to them for free on a Silver platter at the taxpayer's cost just so that the news stations can keep up with the bad, ugly & negative news stories going on for their daily news broadcasts.

However, for the news stations around the world that want & need the encrypted communications to be heard and received by them for their news stories & news coverage, they would most likely have to purchase the illegal to the public & really expensive AOR government receivers or some other form of government use only radios/receivers which you have to provide a Federal or government licence in order to even purchase one. That right there would say that the news station being non federal & non government run, could not buy the radios or receivers to properly receive & decrypt the encrypted radio communications legally. That means that our states & Federal Agencies in America would in fact have to help them all out & purchase these new communications radios & receivers for the news station around the world legally with their Federal licenses in tact while all at the taxpayer's cost ranging anywhere from $900 to $14,000 for a single government use only grade AOR Receiver that would most likely let the news stations hear, receive & decrypt the encrypted communications so that they can still be aware of what is going on & happening daily & hourly around us for their coverage needs also known as NEWS!! It is all just totally ridiculous in my opinion.
Lets not get carried away with the notion that a fancy AOR receiver can decrypt a transmission made by a Public safety agency. Unless you have the encryption key, you will spend many months with some high grade, high speed main frame computers trying to come up with the encryption key needed to decode the voice transmissions. By that time the information would be old and not of any use.

I would suggest that you take a look on the internet and find out what it really takes to break an AES 256 transmission.
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  #44 (permalink)  
Old 05-20-2017, 4:50 PM
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Originally Posted by CorwinScansNM View Post
Better that all the news stations have to purchase all of their own radios/receivers for their news making purpose rather than for them to have our states & Federal Agencies handing them out to them for free on a Silver platter at the taxpayer's cost just so that the news stations can keep up with the bad, ugly & negative news stories going on for their daily news broadcasts.

However, for the news stations around the world that want & need the encrypted communications to be heard and received by them for their news stories & news coverage, they would most likely have to purchase the illegal to the public & really expensive AOR government receivers or some other form of government use only radios/receivers which you have to provide a Federal or government licence in order to even purchase one. That right there would say that the news station being non federal & non government run, could not buy the radios or receivers to properly receive & decrypt the encrypted radio communications legally. That means that our states & Federal Agencies in America would in fact have to help them all out & purchase these new communications radios & receivers for the news station around the world legally with their Federal licenses in tact while all at the taxpayer's cost ranging anywhere from $900 to $14,000 for a single government use only grade AOR Receiver that would most likely let the news stations hear, receive & decrypt the encrypted communications so that they can still be aware of what is going on & happening daily & hourly around us for their coverage needs also known as NEWS!! It is all just totally ridiculous in my opinion.
There's an awful lot of speculation and "what ifs" in all that.
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Old 05-20-2017, 5:52 PM
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I have one of the "high end" AOR receivers, unlocked, etc.

It will NOT decrypt encrypted traffic. The only thing it does is allow you to receive the cellular frequencies. Since there isn't any analog cellular anymore, it doesn't do any good.

The agencies that give/sell/rent/lease the radios that the news agencies use are set up to not allow transmitting.
They'll be loaded with the encryption keys ONLY if the agency wants them to hear the traffic. If the agency changes it's mind, all they have to do is rekey all the radios -except- the ones the news agencies have.

As has been said, without the encryption keys, you're screwed. Even if you had all the hardware and processing capability to break AES256, the agency can simply rekey the radios and you'd have to start all over again from zero.
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Old 05-20-2017, 6:19 PM
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The whole point of AES256 is that breaking the key requires billions of years, even with the fastest known (or theoretically feasible) supercomputers.
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Old 05-20-2017, 6:51 PM
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There's an awful lot of speculation and "what ifs" in all that.
Plus as awful lot of run on sentence
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Old 05-21-2017, 12:08 AM
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Originally Posted by CorwinScansNM View Post
Better that all the news stations have to purchase all of their own radios/receivers for their news making purpose rather than for them to have our states & Federal Agencies handing them out to them for free on a Silver platter at the taxpayer's cost just so that the news stations can keep up with the bad, ugly & negative news stories going on for their daily news broadcasts.

However, for the news stations around the world that want & need the encrypted communications to be heard and received by them for their news stories & news coverage, they would most likely have to purchase the illegal to the public & really expensive AOR government receivers or some other form of government use only radios/receivers which you have to provide a Federal or government licence in order to even purchase one. That right there would say that the news station being non federal & non government run, could not buy the radios or receivers to properly receive & decrypt the encrypted radio communications legally. That means that our states & Federal Agencies in America would in fact have to help them all out & purchase these new communications radios & receivers for the news station around the world legally with their Federal licenses in tact while all at the taxpayer's cost ranging anywhere from $900 to $14,000 for a single government use only grade AOR Receiver that would most likely let the news stations hear, receive & decrypt the encrypted communications so that they can still be aware of what is going on & happening daily & hourly around us for their coverage needs also known as NEWS!! It is all just totally ridiculous in my opinion.

Man, this gives me a headache to even try to read.

If they want to hear the encrypted comms, they ask the agency for permission, the agency agrees to certain talkgroups access, and programs the radios that the news agency purchases. It happens all the time.

Your paranoia is, well, misplaced.

And the AOR reciever will not decrypt encrytion. Try again. Even a service monitor is not going to be able to - save one that is able to be keyed with the agency keys that they control
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Old 05-21-2017, 12:10 AM
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Originally Posted by buddrousa View Post
News flash AT&T is on strike now if that happens then all PUBLIC SERVICE would have no support and may fail.
AT&T has handled strikes before just fine, and they will again. This so-called strike affects only 14% of the company, and will affect very few employees in the end as it is only a 3 day strike over the weekend.
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Old 05-21-2017, 1:34 PM
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This is a c&P from another site but it is interesting to see.

The systems I work with has all the encryption keys rotated frequently. We dont announce it. Special operations are all rekeyed at the start of the operation for additional security. For those trying to break encryption the number of possible keys are large. With the keys being changed you never know if you miss the change and the new key was in the keys you have already passed.

For our regular services (local law enforcement included) all the comms are sent in the clear. We are very scanner friendly. We want those extra eyes and ears on the streets. We want our citizens to know whats happening in their neighborhood. We used to have a regular blog of daily incidents delayed by a day. The girl doing them has gone on maternity and we dont have a summer student yet.

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C&P
10:45am Tuesday May XX - 2 car property accident at Washington Rd and Hamony St. No injuries. Charges layed for failure to stop at stop sign.

10:47am Tuesday May XX - Shoplifter call at the 7-11 at Herchel and Fxxxxxx. No arrest no weapons. Known suspect Female White 5' 7in seen wearing Blue hoodie, blue jeans and distinctive bright purple dual string hand bag.

etc
We are funded by you the tax payer and we have found that having this type of an open relationship with the general public has huge benefits not only in incident control and solution but in reduced stress for the personnel involved. Perhaps this is something other departments may want to consider.
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  #51 (permalink)  
Old 05-23-2017, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by gary123 View Post
For our regular services (local law enforcement included) all the comms are sent in the clear. We are very scanner friendly. We want those extra eyes and ears on the streets. We want our citizens to know whats happening in their neighborhood. We used to have a regular blog of daily incidents delayed by a day.

We are funded by you the tax payer and we have found that having this type of an open relationship with the general public has huge benefits not only in incident control and solution but in reduced stress for the personnel involved. Perhaps this is something other departments may want to consider.
Now that is what I call a respectful community of public safety agencies who are far & few between these days anywhere in the US & who still care about being scanner friendly to their areas/communities when they don't feel that their encrypted communications are needed. That's what I call awesome & respectful for them to be & think that way unlike most of the public safety agencies in & around us now!! I myself like know & be as aware as possible when something is going on down the road from my home or close to my neighborhood for safety reasons & for my safety as well. I have always been that way which is why I've always owned scanners & upgraded my public safety scanners to this day. That may be ending soon for all of us due to stubborn, 100% encrypted radio communications coming soon everywhere in the USA. I do feel that we deserve & should be able to still hear & receive some of our local public safety agencies in unencrypted communications mode on our scanners/receivers when appropriate & not 100% encrypted communications at use all of the time.

Yes, encrypted communications by our Federal & public safety agencies do need to be used at times & should for certain investigations, homicides, arrests, planned drug busts etc. but not for everything & every dispatch call that comes in!!

Last edited by CorwinScansNM; 05-23-2017 at 12:59 PM..
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  #52 (permalink)  
Old Yesterday, 4:56 PM
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As for LTE, yes, encryption is part of it, always will be. Its not intended for public consumption. If you think it is, then think about your own cellular phone use, and how you would feel if everyone within a few miles could easily listen in on all your phone calls, all your web surfing, read all your e-mails, read all your text messages and rummage through the personal photos on your phone.
Expecting public safety agencies to open up all their internal and private communications to hobby listeners is like expecting your neighbors to let you break into their house whenever you want and rummage through all their belongings, just because you might find something interesting.
Ha ha, federal, state, county, even local investigators do that to citizens on a daily basis.

Ever heard of a "Stingray" device before?
Did you know that Emails a year old don't even need a warrant before the cops can snoop in on it?
How about you leave your phone unlocked and get arrested, and guess what happens?
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Old Yesterday, 6:55 PM
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Ha ha, federal, state, county, even local investigators do that to citizens on a daily basis.

Ever heard of a "Stingray" device before?
Did you know that Emails a year old don't even need a warrant before the cops can snoop in on it?
How about you leave your phone unlocked and get arrested, and guess what happens?
Yawn

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Old Yesterday, 10:07 PM
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Gloom and Doom yes has been there since the 70's which I agree but scanner manufacturers can't make scanners to de-crypt encrypted comms. It's impossible and its a federal law and a federal crime.

Do I agree with absolutely NO but its the way it is. Yeah trunking came out and the scanner makers figured it out. Yes EDACS came out with trunking and scanner makers figured it out. And so on.

But when it comes to finding a way thru encryption its the end of the road. Not sure why people are missing the point. Departments go this route to keep scanner listeners out. It's crappy because we are not the problem. It's illegal immigration with bad hombres doing bad crimes.

Encryption of public safety has pretty much been around for roughly 15 to 20 years give or take. Have scanner manufacturers figured it out or made a scanner to de-crypt????????????????????????

NOPE and never will. So my point being is that this is the road block and will always be
You don't need Scanner Manufacturers to make a decryption scanner Google it you can decrypt it yourself. Personally I don't care what the Police do around here, nor do I care what they are doing at Site R that is the only encryption in this area. I have well over 200 channels that I can listen to I don't need it keeping me up at night because it's talking nonstop.

Encryption is there to keep PRIVATE communications PRIVATE nuff said.

Oh almost forgot there are scanners that can decrypt encrypted communications but you need a letterhead from your Police Chief to get one and a badge plus I thing they range in price from $2,500 to $5,000 Dollars.
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  #55 (permalink)  
Old Yesterday, 10:39 PM
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Oh almost forgot there are scanners that can decrypt encrypted communications but you need a letterhead from your Police Chief to get one and a badge plus I thing they range in price from $2,500 to $5,000 Dollars.
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Old Yesterday, 10:52 PM
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Oh almost forgot there are scanners that can decrypt encrypted communications but you need a letterhead from your Police Chief to get one and a badge plus I thing they range in price from $2,500 to $5,000 Dollars.
I believe you have a police radio in mind, not a scanner, and the operative word there is "police." Google won't help you, either. You might learn about the technology but you won't decode it.
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