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  #201 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2005, 2:05 PM
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I just got the 97 and 2051, Love them both, Actually I like the 2051 better. But that is because I just HATE GRE products. Uniden allows for ID scrolling Group Priority, the Close Call works where as SS-II dosn't. The Blue Back lite looks so late-night-eye-friendly and 6000 channel capacity...WoW! but, I wonder if there are glitches that would eventually create a B and C modle in the next 6 months. simular to the 96D possibly not being up-gradable when 800Mhz. is re-banded. Y'all say it comes with software? any issues with that?
it looks solid, but, at $520.00 I am wondering how logical it really is. OK so it recieves P-25 and Digital Moto, is it Narrow/Wide 900 friendly and does it incorporate the features of proper LCN assignment for LTR like the 97 displays.

I would guess it would be worth it to me if Texas DPS region-1 ever implemented digital emissions. but what I and so many other want to hear isn't available on a scanner nor ever will be. i.e.; ProVoice, Multi-Net and Passport.

Any clues as to whether or not a Mobile version will be produced?

Thanks
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  #202 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2005, 2:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Voyager
And you've TRIED setting the DELAY to zero? You never really answered that one. It's called an ID DELAY and it defaults to 2500 (I think). I know for a fact that it doesn't default to 0. If yours isn't 0, it's delaying returning to the control channel and it's doing EXACTLY WHAT YOU TOLD IT TO DO. That's called operator error, not a bug.
You are still clued out. It has nothing to do with delay. Do you know how the delay feature works on a trunked radio/trunk tracker? It doesn't sit on the voice channel waiting for a reply... It holds the talkgroup in memory, and filters data from the control channel for any replies on that same talkgroup, until the delay period has expired. While waiting for talkgroup activity from the talkgroup which is being held (delay), it sits on the control channel.

The problem is, the PRO96 isn't switching back to the control channel as fast as it should be, at th end of a voice communication. I haven't noted this problem on analog, it's strictly a digital talkgroup issue.

Stop being so damn ignorant with your replies and pay attention when you read.
  #203 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2005, 2:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by loumaag
However, I am a little concerned that the VHF is not quite as good as either my 796 or my Pro-96. I will do somemore testing but on first iimpressions, it does not hear quite as well when signal strength is way down.
Once I get mine next week, I'll be testing and comparing reception and sensitivity to other radios (especially on VHF) before I play with any 'bells and whistles'. I'll probably even hook up test equipment at work to see what I get.

If the reception is not satisfactory, or at least better than the BC246T and BC296D, this might be the last Uniden scanner I buy until they get their act together on the reception issues.

It seems to me that Uniden likes to "optimized" their radios to the 800MHz band or something, since there's barely any complains about reception on those bands. It might not help matters if the people involved in creating these radios live in big cities where most Public Safety is in those bands and if the majority of the beta testers that we're picked, had plenty, if not mostly 800MHz systems.

Well, Uniden, guess what, not everyone lives the 800MHz "big city" life.

Now that more and more big and statewide systems coming out are on the VHF/UHF bands, they need to pay attention to those bands.

Like I said before, a radio could have all the bells and whistles in the world but if it doesn't receive the transmissions you want, what's the point?
  #204 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2005, 2:21 PM
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What Exactly is Fire Tone Out on the 396T?
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  #205 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2005, 2:22 PM
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For what it's worth, I see no reception problems on VHF High/Low..UHF seems to be ok to, but don't listen to much of it anymore..
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  #206 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2005, 2:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scanner_freak
For what it's worth, I see no reception problems on VHF High/Low..UHF seems to be ok to, but don't listen to much of it anymore..
And that proves my point again, listening to a single VHF/UHF frequency occasionally to see if it's received or not is VERY different than spending 95% of your time listening to the same frequency band in question where you can better judge the performance. Especially when you have another radio side by side.

We need more people whose monitoring primary target is the VHF/UHF bands (whether is Public Safety or something else) to chime in. I personally, even know where many of the dead spots in my area are for the VHF freqs I monitor.
  #207 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2005, 2:49 PM
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I know that this scanner solves the audio problem for multiple sites or @ least I think that it does. Now the question is, can you program in the Control Frequencies for more than one site into the same bank? You know, like with the Pro-96?

Alos I take it that this scanner will track I - Calls on Moto
and EDACS TRSs. Thanks.
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  #208 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2005, 3:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JerryNone
Now the question is, can you program in the Control Frequencies for more than one site into the same bank? You know, like with the Pro-96?
Oh NO!!!!! We have had several heated discussions about this on the Yahoo group. To put it simply NO.
Paul O. did chime in and said that for a future model they're likely to implement something like that BUT better!

Anyway, you can always put them in different systems and assign them the same QK and so on...

Quote:
Alos I take it that this scanner will track I - Calls on Moto
and EDACS TRSs. Thanks.
I'm pretty sure it does, the more specific question is: Does it track I-Calls on 9600 systems? I'm also sure it doesn't.
The next question would be: Will I-Calls on 9600 systems be implemented in future firmware updates or at least on future models?
  #209 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2005, 3:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kikito
We need more people whose monitoring primary target is the VHF/UHF bands (whether is Public Safety or something else) to chime in. I personally, even know where many of the dead spots in my area are for the VHF freqs I monitor.

Here is my scanner listening breakdown:

VHF High-80%

VHF Low- 4%

UHF-1%

800 MHz-15%

As you can see, The majority of what I listen to is VHF High and I know where the dead spots are out here as well. I do not see any difference in reception than on my pro-96..It's just not there...
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  #210 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2005, 3:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kikito
Quote:
Originally Posted by scanner_freak
For what it's worth, I see no reception problems on VHF High/Low..UHF seems to be ok to, but don't listen to much of it anymore..
And that proves my point again, listening to a single VHF/UHF frequency occasionally to see if it's received or not is VERY different than spending 95% of your time listening to the same frequency band in question where you can better judge the performance. Especially when you have another radio side by side.

We need more people whose monitoring primary target is the VHF/UHF bands (whether is Public Safety or something else) to chime in. I personally, even know where many of the dead spots in my area are for the VHF freqs I monitor.
Simple thing when buying the first of a new radio. Plug in your IFR Service monitor and check the sensitivity in each band. It is either good or poor. Then, keep it or send it back.

One thing I found really quickly, and I suspect most others have also, Trunck Tracking Factory Flex antennas suck, for virtually all bands, but definately for VHF. Find something better.
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  #211 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2005, 3:46 PM
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I have to disagree with you guys on Uniden scanners and the VHF bands. As I see it it's like this.

I didn't buy the 396T to primarilly monitor VHF (conventional). I bought it to monitor trunked systems (specifially P25 systems).

I think this is true of most people. In most areas (except my beloved SD, AK and a handful of others) the tunked systems are UHF. (300 MHz to 3 GHz). Specifically 400, 800 and 900 MHz.

If you just want to monitor VHF conventional systems you can get a good scanner (like the PRO-83) for one-tenth of the price that will do that for you. ("Signal Stalker" on my PRO-83 is VERY sensitive on VHF High freqs and, if you catch it on sale, the price is almost "a wash" compaired to the BCD396T. Why not get both? )

The physics dictate what the radio (any radio) can do. It simply CANNOT do "DC to daylight" perfectly. It's like a Swiss Army knife. It's an OK knife (but not great), it's a terrible screwdriver and an even worse pair of scissors. BUT - it does everything and you're much more likely to have it with you than a box full of the tools it contains.

I think Uniden has done a FANTASTIC job of engineering here. You'll always be able to find (monobanders and other) radios that will outperform it on certain portions of the RF spectrum - but you won't find anything else out there right now that does everything that it can do.
The BCD396T is certaily a step forward - if not a leap.


I finally received some traffic on MIL-AIR today (a Navy P3 landing at HAAF in Savannah). The signal was loud and clear. I also REALLY appreciate P25 Trunked coverage on the new 380 MHz military band. Oh yeah...and APCO 25 Close Call (though I have yet to test this) ..... and no Canadian pre-sets!

73!

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  #212 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2005, 3:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scanner_freak
As you can see, The majority of what I listen to is VHF High and I know where the dead spots are out here as well. I do not see any difference in reception than on my pro-96..It's just not there...
Thanks scan_freak, your previous message didn't sound like that was the case. That's good to know, so far it looks like a toss, whether someone gets good reception on the VHF bands or not.
  #213 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2005, 3:54 PM
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Posting error, please delete.

Thanks!
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  #214 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2005, 4:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buttsrob
I have to disagree with you guys on Uniden scanners and the VHF bands but, as I see it, it's like this.

I didn't buy the 396T to monitor VHF. I bought it to monitor trunked systems (specifially P25 systems).
I think this is true of most people. In most areas (except my beloved SD, AK and a handful of others) the tunked systems are UHF. (300 MHz to 3 GHz). Specifically 400, 800 and 900 MHz
That's the problem, the VHF I'm talking about in my area is becoming a huge Statewide P25 9600 VHF TRUNKED system and so are many many more around the nation, from anywhere between the 138 to 174MHz band.

That proves another point, Trunked and/or P25 systems are NOT limited to just the 800MHz band like many people seem to think.

Again, the amount of VHF/UHF systems keep increasing every year.

Besides, a scanner of this caliper AND price should be a good performer for conventional and trunked just like GRE's.

If you don't have good reception on a conventional frequency, what makes you think it'll be good trunking on the same band? After the control channel sends the scanner to a frequency for the talkgroup you're listening to, for the duration of the activity you're virtually in conventional mode basically. Think about it....
  #215 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2005, 4:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buttsrob
I think this is true of most people. In most areas (except my beloved SD, AK and a handful of others) the tunked systems are UHF. (300 MHz to 3 GHz). Specifically 400, 800 and 900 MHz.
I had to reply separately to this part just for the emphasis.

No, trunked systems in the VHF band keep increasing every year, especially when 99% of them will be P25 and very wide area (statewide basically). There's a lot more in the works on VHF than you think.

Just like you said above, good coverage on some scanners is 400, 800 and 900. Well, it should be revised to be 138 to 174MHz, 400, 700 and 800 since that's where most of the Public Safety comms take place. In conventional AND trunked.
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  #216 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2005, 4:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kikito
That proves another point, Trunked and/or P25 systems are NOT limited to just the 800MHz band like many people seem to think.

Again, the amount of VHF/UHF systems keep increasing every year.

Besides, a scanner of this caliper AND price should be a good performer for conventional and trunked just like GRE's.

If you don't have good reception on a conventional frequency, what makes you think it'll be good trunking on the same band? After the control channel sends the scanner to a frequency for the talkgroup you're listening to, for the duration of the activity you're virtually in conventional mode basically. Think about it....

True, they probably are increasing...but there still aren't many out there.

I agree with your logic at the end of your last post kikito...but I personally have had no trouble monitoring my local VHF conventional public safety channels OR 800 MHz trunked systems 25 miles away with the 396T. You are absolutely correct though that our expectations should be high here.

A word of advice for anyone out there. If you have reception problems (especially on VHF) with this scanner - try a different antenna. A simple 2m/70cm magmount works wonders! The duck sux.



RMB
  #217 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2005, 4:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kikito
No, trunked systems in the VHF band keep increasing every year, especially when 99% of them will be P25 and very wide area (statewide basically). There's a lot more in the works on VHF than you think.

Just like you said above, good coverage on some scanners is 400, 800 and 900. Well, it should be revised to be 138 to 174MHz, 400, 700 and 800 since that's where most of the Public Safety comms take place. In conventional AND trunked.
I didn't know that there were that many in the works. But it certainly makes sense for Statewide coverage - especially in the more sparsly-populated states. Thanks for the info.

It should be interesting when we get a bunch of these out there and there's a tropo opening. DXing trunked systems with a BCD396T.

73!

RMB
  #218 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2005, 4:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epfdtracktrunker
What Exactly is Fire Tone Out on the 396T?
Read the other 396 thread:

http://www.radioreference.com/module...ic&t=17995

It should answer just about any of your 396 questions.

Joe M.
  #219 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2005, 4:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaun
Quote:
Originally Posted by Voyager
And you've TRIED setting the DELAY to zero? You never really answered that one. It's called an ID DELAY and it defaults to 2500 (I think). I know for a fact that it doesn't default to 0. If yours isn't 0, it's delaying returning to the control channel and it's doing EXACTLY WHAT YOU TOLD IT TO DO. That's called operator error, not a bug.
You are still clued out. It has nothing to do with delay. Do you know how the delay feature works on a trunked radio/trunk tracker? It doesn't sit on the voice channel waiting for a reply... It holds the talkgroup in memory, and filters data from the control channel for any replies on that same talkgroup, until the delay period has expired. While waiting for talkgroup activity from the talkgroup which is being held (delay), it sits on the control channel.

The problem is, the PRO96 isn't switching back to the control channel as fast as it should be, at th end of a voice communication. I haven't noted this problem on analog, it's strictly a digital talkgroup issue.

Stop being so damn ignorant with your replies and pay attention when you read.
The fact that it sits on the CC is irrelevant. You said it: it "filters data from the control channel for any replies on that same talkgroup, until the delay period has expired". If the TG delay is set to 0, it waits 0 seconds before looking for the next active TG.

MY PRO-96 set to 0 delay switches TGs as fast as the person stops talking. Maybe you should pay for attention to my replies.

No matter, it still sounds like operator error - whether you like that answer or not.

If you want to discuss this part of the thread further, post it in the PRO-96 forum. This part of the thread does not belong here. I would have posted my reply there, but you wouldn't know to look for it there.

Joe M.
  #220 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2005, 4:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scanner_freak
For what it's worth, I see no reception problems on VHF High/Low..UHF seems to be ok to, but don't listen to much of it anymore..
I just made some quick checks against my old PRO-43. VHF is about 5 to 6 dbm better than the BC396 (see attached photo .164uv vs .285 @ 12db sinad, as is 800 mhz. LO VHF is about he same, mil air band seems to be a little down also on the BC396. The BC396 is good don't get me wrong, it's just not as good as some others. But as pointed out, it is a swiss army knife and can't do everything perfect.
 

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