Richmond/Chesterfield/Henrico Rebanding?

trainman111 · #1 (**permalink**) 01-25-2013, 4:30 PM

Over the past week or so, I've noticed that my PSR-500 is not decoding talkgroups correctly. I've been picking up Richmond DPU, Chesterfield Fire and RPD all on RAA Primary. I've spoken with another PSR-500 user and he's experiencing the same thing. It's happening on various Henrico and Chesterfield talkgroups as well. Right now I've got the scanner held on RFD Tac 2 and I'm picking different departments from all 3 localities. Is this a product of rebanding, or is something else going on?

jehm1212 · #2 (**permalink**) 01-25-2013, 8:26 PM

The regional TRS is currently in the rebanding process.

ka3jjz · #3 (**permalink**) 01-25-2013, 8:56 PM

But that has absolutely nothing to do with the talkgroups, although it's entirely possible that the system is being shuffled and reallocated as a result of rebanding. Rebanding affects frequencies - it's the system administrators that would make the decision to remap the talkgroups in the system. They're 2 independent actions...

Mike

trainman111 · #4 (**permalink**) 01-25-2013, 9:52 PM

Right, I knew that the talkgroups shouldn't normally be affected which is why I was a little confused. Thanks for the confirmation jhem. Any idea on a timeline perhaps in regards to completion? Hopefully once it's finished there won't be too much investigative work involved in order to get things accurate in the DB again.

DrWhoVa · #5 (**permalink**) 01-26-2013, 10:16 PM

Rebanding is a nightmare on dispatch centers too. Oh, loads of fun. Been there done that...

I'm just surprised they waited this long to reband to be honest.

trainman111 · #6 (**permalink**) 01-27-2013, 1:32 AM

It seems to me that they're doing it in sections. I heard a VCUPD Supervisor advise officers a couple of weeks back to turn in their radios for rebanding. I also have a friend who works for RAA as an EMT and a dispatcher and no one there has heard anything regarding rebanding. Seems like it's going to be quite the process given all the users.

carolinatoughguy · #7 (**permalink**) 01-30-2013, 5:42 PM

I hope some of y'all will post the new frequencies on here when it happens so we can all still be kept in the loop.

K4RBT · #8 (**permalink**) 02-07-2013, 7:58 PM

I was informed by a retired firefighter from Henrico County that the county has started re-banding. He heard Station 8's equipment and portables called to the radio shop for re-banding. We are both looking to find the re-band frequencies as we both will have to reprogram our scanners. I asked him to go by the radio shop to see if they will give them out.

Odd that it is refereed to as the Richmond system when Henrico owns, operates and houses the site controller. Everything, all the way to Colonial Heights, goes back to Henrico County.

Fred
K4RBT

ka3jjz · #9 (**permalink**) 02-07-2013, 8:14 PM

Unless they go way off the board (always possible), the new frequencies will be 15 Mhz less than the current 866, 867 and 868 Mhz ones. No big secret there. It's well documented in the rebanding wiki, along with links for most scanners for how to do rebanding, as they're slightly different from distributor to distributor (some need a firmware fix, along with the table...).

Due to the fact that some of these frequencies have a 0 in the 4th decimal, you will need a custom table to make this system work on the Henrico site (same thing is true in Richmond). The Chesterfield site won't need a custom table, although adding one isn't going to hurt much.

HTH...Mike

K4RBT · #10 (**permalink**) 02-08-2013, 3:23 PM

What concerned me is that they waited so long to start, past the point where they can just go to the 15MHz down. I understand if they waited too long, the FCC was going to open the frequencies for others to use. I guess this is what happens when the system is so large and has different entities having to get their act together.

Richmond is not doing very well financially, I am not sure about Chesterfield and Colonial Heights. Henrico County had already budgeted for the rebanding so they were good to go.

I am going to go ahead and calculate for the 15 MHz down and set it up in the Butel software. I just wish I could figure out why my two computers keep forgetting I have a registered copy of ARC500.

Fred
K4RBT

BoxAlarm187 · #11 (**permalink**) 02-14-2013, 4:37 PM

I happened to be at work on the day the techs stopped to reprogram our portables and mobiles. The project is still several weeks from completion according to them....

John · #12 (**permalink**) 03-04-2013, 5:26 AM

Has anyone confirmed the new control channel frequencies? I know they are supposed to be 15MHz down but I would like to make sure before I reprogram my scanner for a trip there this weekend.

John

trainman111 · #13 (**permalink**) 03-04-2013, 10:00 PM

I'm pretty sure that the info in the database is still valid. I haven't heard of any new control channels as of yet.

K4RBT · #14 (**permalink**) 03-20-2013, 11:04 PM

The delay was caused by the phone company not freeing up the frequencies necessary for rebanding to take place.

gcgrotz · #15 (**permalink**) 03-21-2013, 7:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by K4RBT

The delay was caused by the phone company not freeing up the frequencies necessary for rebanding to take place.

Just a small technicality but that would be Sprint/Nextel and they are not the phone company. BTW, they are rapidly de-constructing that old 800MHz iden network and have received FCC ok to use the spectrum for 4G in some markets.

KF4ZTO · #16 (**permalink**) 03-21-2013, 3:55 PM

800MHz is going to be used for 4G eh?

This is news to me...

SkyPager · #17 (**permalink**) 03-22-2013, 7:21 AM

I'm really tired of people always blaming Sprint/Nextel for the delays in re-banding. What is your basis for this statement? I am directly involved with S/N re-banding issues and the associated RFI issues.

Most of the time the PS agency is bickering with S/N on the cost for something related to re-banding, or they are themselves slow to surrender frequencies S/N needs to take over. Take a look at how many agencies are still using the NPSPAC channels 866 - 869 MHz for their interop communications. Not to mention stupid things they do to themselves like mis-programmed code plugs (at a major international airport on the eastcoast), or forgetting to modify the tower-top pre-amps to pass the rebanded frequencies; (a county in MD). Or forgetting about having multiple in-building amplifiers for 851-869 MHz in the jail, court house etc, and blaming S/N for the RFI from these systems.

Yes, the iDEN network is being decommissioned. It should go off-line by June 30, 2013 if not sooner.
You may see a few "iDEN islands" in some areas after July 1, 2013 to support major customers like Long Island Power.

S/N is deploying CDMA in the 862-869 MHz range. If you have access to a spectrum analyzer tune 862 to 864 MHz you should see a big opening between 862 and 863.5 Mhz. In some places you may see a 1.25 MHz wide CDMA carrier. The 4G stuff is currently being deployed at 1900 MHz.

gcgrotz · #18 (**permalink**) 03-22-2013, 9:32 AM

I was just relating what I had read regarding the 4G. My employer is a Sprint affiliate so I keep an eye on them because it directly affects me. I'm thinking the 800 MHZ CDMA is to move customers off 1900 so they can clear spectrum for 4G. All I know is that they can't compete with us at 1900 in this market.

Some folks are using 700 MHz AWS spectrum for 4G and then you have the old Sprint WiMax network at 2600 MHz I believe, in many markets.

P.S. several of the old S/N sites here are powered down and at least on major site had it's building lifted last week. Antennas gone and all of that expensive Commscope hardline chopped up into small pieces. Some are still powered up and have T1's connected but for how long???

SkyPager · #19 (**permalink**) 03-22-2013, 12:06 PM

The entire S/N network is is a convoluted transition right now. Motorola, Ericsson and Alcatel Lucent are building out the LTE network nationwide while trying to keep the legacy services operational. In DC/Balto. the CDMA at 1930 to 1945 (base TX) is having the new ALU equipment installed. this equipment can also support the 1990-1995 MHz (G-block, The G-block will be all LTE) and the CDMA at 860 MHz. I don't have a great deal of interaction with Richmond, but I believe they are getting Moto equipment, and I do know the 1900 band that market is licensed to is diferent from DC/Balto.

gcgrotz · #20 (**permalink**) 03-26-2013, 8:17 AM

I guess we should stop the hijack of this thread but I'll throw out this first. I know the Sprint PCS legacy network is Moto in Richmond. I don't know much about Moto LTE equipment. Verizon around here has been MOTO since they began as analog but they switched to ALU for their LTE. Over in the Valley they are all ALU.AT&T seems to have deployed Ericsson LTE here, most of it is tower-mounted (YIKES). A guy from T-Mobile said they are doing Ericsson too but around here they haven't done much of anything in a long time.

Sprint's license in DC/Balto was one of the original 1900 MHz licenses from the development days.

My apologies to everyone for the hijack.