RadioReference on Facebook   RadioReference on Twitter   RadioReference Blog
 

Go Back   The RadioReference.com Forums > Amateur Radio > Amateur Radio Antennas


Amateur Radio Antennas - For discussion of all amateur band designed antennas and related accoutrements. This includes base, handheld, mobile and repeater usage. For commercial antennas on the amateur bands please use Commercial Radio Antennas below.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 04-22-2017, 9:59 PM
davidzimmerman's Avatar
Member
  Shack Photos
Shack photos
Amateur Radio Operator
Amateur Radio
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: parma,ohio
Posts: 1,434
Default 2M\440 Shot Glass Mobile Antenna

who makes the BEST shot glass antenna? i just got a 2006 Ford Escape i run 3 of them now 2 are 700\800 MHZ 1 for Scanner 2nd for 700\800 MHZ Motorola XTL-5000,last is UHF for my other XTL-5000.i have a FT90 Dual Band radio i got new maybe 10+ Years ago need a good shot glass 2m\440 for the roof.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored links
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 04-22-2017, 10:45 PM
jparks29's Avatar
Member
   
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Britain
Posts: 1,005
Default

Maybe if you used standard terms instead of 'shot glass' we'd know what the hell you're talking bout...

I assume you mean low profile.

You're not gonna find a dual band phantom style antenna.....VHF is crap in those antennas, and UHF isn't much better....

A 1/4 wave on 2m is a 3/4 wave on 70cm, just an FYI, it resonates quite well....
__________________
Oh! Come and see the violence inherent in the system! Help, help, I'm being repressed!
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 04-23-2017, 1:35 AM
mmckenna's Avatar
Member
   
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: WTVLCA01DS0
Posts: 7,344
Default

For VHF, they all suck equally. Some might suck better (worse?) than others, but they all suck.

I haven't see any of the major antenna manufacturers make a "dual band" phantom style antenna, but I know some of the Cheap Chinese Antenna manufactures (located right next door to the CCR factories!) do.

Trying to squeeze 19" of radiating element into 2 inches doesn't work. Yeah, you can make it resonate on a VHF frequency, but you can do that with a dummy load, too.

What I can tell you about the VHF side of these things:
I know a few people that have tried these VHF phantom/low profile/shot glass/soup can, etc antennas.
All of them. Every single person that I know who has tried one, has regretted it. In fact I've had several people offer me used ones for free, that's how much they value these things.
- they are -very- narrow bandwidth, like 1MHz, maybe a bit less. Not going to cover the entire 2 meter band. That is IF they are tunable. Some of the Chinese ones aren't.
- they don't handle much power. 50 watts max. Anything more and they overheat (kind of like a dummy load).
- they are poor performers. Less than 0 gain (kind of like a dummy load).

Where they do work:
If you've got one frequency or a few that are very closely spaced. If you are within spitting distance of the repeater.

Honestly, it would be cheaper to just by a 50Ω dummy load and mount it on your roof. It would work as well.

On UHF they work a bit better. Cramming 6" of radiator into a 2" tube isn't quite as sucky. As you know, they work pretty well on 700-800MHz since it's not a stretch to put 1/4 wave inside the antenna and make it work. In fact, I have one and it actually works better than 1/4 wave.

But, if you've got to have one, at least let us know what you discover.
__________________
"I cut it three times and it's still too short!"
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 04-23-2017, 5:43 AM
davidzimmerman's Avatar
Member
  Shack Photos
Shack photos
Amateur Radio Operator
Amateur Radio
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: parma,ohio
Posts: 1,434
Default

thanks for everyone's help what about a good LOW PROFILE (shot glass) 2M VHF antenna? i have a low Clearance Garage Door don't want to put a L bracket on the fender.
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 04-23-2017, 6:56 AM
n9mxq's Avatar
Member
  Audio Feed Provider
Audio Feed Provider
Amateur Radio Operator
Amateur Radio
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Belvidere IL
Posts: 1,383
Default

Sorry, but they don't exist. They're a compromise antenna at best. You can't cram enough wire in to make it work worth a dang. If you're driving a pickup, I'd recommend a fold over style antenna in the stake pocket. Still get a full sized antenna, but easy enough to fold down to get in the garage.
__________________
Gene
Is there such a thing as too many radios??
Transceivers, receivers, and SDR! Oh My!
Reply With Quote
Sponsored links
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 04-23-2017, 7:00 AM
Member
  Premium Subscriber
Premium Subscriber
Amateur Radio Operator
Amateur Radio
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Michigan
Posts: 1,222
Default Low profile antenna

I have a friend who is an electrical engineer that tried one of these. The range in miles is lower than the SWR reading. As has already been said, forget 2 meters. A cheap quarter wave will out perform any low profile junk.
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 04-23-2017, 8:11 AM
Member
  Amateur Radio Operator
Amateur Radio
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Davenport,Fl.- home to me and the gators and the skeeters.
Posts: 1,380
Default

As already posted above, you just ain't gonna find one that works!!! I tried one of the CCRs, (rather CCAs) and the swr was over 3, and distances at most was something like 2 1/2 to 3 miles with very weak signal. Go with a standard quarter wave and be happy.
__________________
Freedom, a beautiful way of life.
Pro-107, Pro-44, Pro-94, Pro-2006, DX-440
YAESU FT-2900R, YAESU FT-101EE, RS HTX-202, ICOM IC-2AT, RS BTX-121, BAOFENG UV-5R
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 04-23-2017, 9:07 AM
davidzimmerman's Avatar
Member
  Shack Photos
Shack photos
Amateur Radio Operator
Amateur Radio
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: parma,ohio
Posts: 1,434
Default

thanks everyone guess i'll do the L Fender Bracket for the antenna
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 04-23-2017, 9:31 AM
Member
  Amateur Radio Operator
Amateur Radio
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Nebraska
Posts: 164
Default

What's your clearance issue, couple of inches?
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 04-23-2017, 10:54 AM
davidzimmerman's Avatar
Member
  Shack Photos
Shack photos
Amateur Radio Operator
Amateur Radio
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: parma,ohio
Posts: 1,434
Default

maybe under 8 inches
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 04-23-2017, 11:17 AM
mmckenna's Avatar
Member
   
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: WTVLCA01DS0
Posts: 7,344
Default

A simple 1/4 wave whip will bend over and spring back.

Stico makes a very flexible whip. So does Panorama antennas.
__________________
"I cut it three times and it's still too short!"
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 04-23-2017, 4:36 PM
jparks29's Avatar
Member
   
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Britain
Posts: 1,005
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mmckenna View Post
A simple 1/4 wave whip will bend over and spring back.

Stico makes a very flexible whip. So does Panorama antennas.
Yup. Even comet has a cellular look alike dual band antenna..

My vote is still for a thin 1/4 wave whip or a heavy duty 1/4 wave whip on a spring....

Believe it or not, sometimes longer whips are better as they flex more......

Comtelco A1511, NMOWBQCFT, etc
__________________
Oh! Come and see the violence inherent in the system! Help, help, I'm being repressed!
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 04-25-2017, 6:57 AM
davidzimmerman's Avatar
Member
  Shack Photos
Shack photos
Amateur Radio Operator
Amateur Radio
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: parma,ohio
Posts: 1,434
Default

i used the L Fender bracket works great
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 04-25-2017, 2:50 PM
Member
   
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 692
Default

I assume the criteria to define "best" is "Which one survives best in a high speed rollover?"

I think the April 2011 issue of QST carried full test results for those.
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 06-02-2017, 9:18 AM
Member
   
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 44
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jparks29 View Post
Maybe if you used standard terms instead of 'shot glass' we'd know what the hell you're talking bout...

I assume you mean low profile.

You're not gonna find a dual band phantom style antenna.....VHF is crap in those antennas, and UHF isn't much better....

A 1/4 wave on 2m is a 3/4 wave on 70cm, just an FYI, it resonates quite well....


Wait, you're saying a 1/4 wave 2m antenna will suffice as a dual-band?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
Reply With Quote
  #16 (permalink)  
Old 06-02-2017, 9:39 AM
mmckenna's Avatar
Member
   
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: WTVLCA01DS0
Posts: 7,344
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by OhSixTJ View Post
Wait, you're saying a 1/4 wave 2m antenna will suffice as a dual-band?
Yes. A 1/4 wave VHF antenna tuned for the 2 meter amateur radio band is a 3/4 wave antenna on the 70 centimeter band. I ran a dual band amateur radio like this for years.
I trimmed my antenna for low SWR on 2 meters and it had even lower SWR on 70 cm.

The trade off is that the radiation pattern for a 3/4 wave antenna is such that more energy is shot up at an angle than out at the horizon. Where I live with hills/mountains on 3 sides and the ocean on the other, this worked just fine.

I'd occasionally swap in a Larsen NMO-2/70sh (a purpose built dual band) and I really didn't notice any difference in performance, although that's because of my specific location.

Out on the plains of the central USA, this might not be an ideal solution for UHF work, but it will work.

Plus, if you shop around, it'll cost you a total of about $9.00.
__________________
"I cut it three times and it's still too short!"
Reply With Quote
  #17 (permalink)  
Old 06-02-2017, 10:03 AM
Member
   
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 44
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mmckenna View Post
Yes. A 1/4 wave VHF antenna tuned for the 2 meter amateur radio band is a 3/4 wave antenna on the 70 centimeter band. I ran a dual band amateur radio like this for years.

I trimmed my antenna for low SWR on 2 meters and it had even lower SWR on 70 cm.



The trade off is that the radiation pattern for a 3/4 wave antenna is such that more energy is shot up at an angle than out at the horizon. Where I live with hills/mountains on 3 sides and the ocean on the other, this worked just fine.



I'd occasionally swap in a Larsen NMO-2/70sh (a purpose built dual band) and I really didn't notice any difference in performance, although that's because of my specific location.



Out on the plains of the central USA, this might not be an ideal solution for UHF work, but it will work.



Plus, if you shop around, it'll cost you a total of about $9.00.


I actually have one but just recently purchased a dual band radio. I'll use it in the meanwhile as I'm probably gonna be TXing mostly in 2m. Thanks!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
Reply With Quote
  #18 (permalink)  
Old 06-02-2017, 10:24 AM
mmckenna's Avatar
Member
   
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: WTVLCA01DS0
Posts: 7,344
Default

I think you'll be happy with it.
__________________
"I cut it three times and it's still too short!"
Reply With Quote
  #19 (permalink)  
Old 06-02-2017, 10:39 AM
Member
   
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 44
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mmckenna View Post
I think you'll be happy with it.


Awesome. I appreciate the help.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
Reply With Quote
  #20 (permalink)  
Old 06-05-2017, 7:47 PM
Member
   
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Pittsburgh, Pa.
Posts: 281
Default

Look into "Compactenna"

They have the widest claimed coverage and performance

Available at Universal Radio
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 9:06 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
All information here is Copyright 2012 by RadioReference.com LLC and Lindsay C. Blanton III.Ad Management by RedTyger
Copyright 2015 by RadioReference.com LLC Privacy Policy  |  Terms and Conditions