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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 09-15-2010, 10:00 PM
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Originally Posted by KE4NYV View Post
I realize I have the minority opinion here and I refuse to get into a pissing contest over something so petty. I made my opinion and youins have yours. I'll leave it at that.
Just to let you know jason,that not everyone here is a no-code tech and yes I remember the days of the original novice license holder! I also passed my 13wpm code test,but yet still have no need for all the "cb like" mentality I frequently hear on 15,40 and 80 meters. Nor is there any joy in being a "brasspounder".
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Old 09-15-2010, 10:20 PM
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My comment wasn't meant to be offensive to you. It's just how I see the issue. Had I been licensed when you were and made the effort to learn code I might feel the same way. I'm just saying that from a technical aspect it seems strange to me that they required people to learn code when there are so many other things that can be used to form the basis of a test as well.

I suppose it's a moot point anyway.


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Originally Posted by KE4NYV View Post
I realize I have the minority opinion here and I refuse to get into a pissing contest over something so petty. I made my opinion and youins have yours. I'll leave it at that.
  #23 (permalink)  
Old 09-16-2010, 8:39 AM
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If the offense is directed at you then it's up to you to not drag it out, to contact the FCC and give them recordings, times and dates, and let them handle it. Just keep it between yourself and the FCC. They are the regulator and it's up to them to enforce the rules and regulations. They only ask that we as amateurs point out those who are offensive. And don't be an aggressor, or you'll have a target on your back.

I personally just laugh it all off. Sometimes it's just a simple slip of the tongue and other times it's "normal" operation of some. Those people should be dealt with within a club, if they are in one, otherwise it's all up to the FCC to get it under control.

And as it was pointed out by someone else in this thread, if you don't like what you hear there are two ways to end it, either tun the knob to a different frequency, or turn it off.
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Last edited by N1BHH; 09-16-2010 at 8:42 AM..
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Old 09-25-2010, 2:52 PM
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Originally Posted by KE4NYV View Post
This is a direct result of no-code licensing and the overall dumbing-down of the hobby and licensing criteria.
Yup! The elimination of the code requirement has been blamed by my age peers for everything - including pattern baldness, a delayed sun spot cycle, global warming, flouridation of drinking water, the decline of western civilization and pandemic levels of middle-aged flatulence. Yet, if you look up the callsigns of many of the pottymouth offenders you describe, you'll find that the majority have been licensed far longer than this change -some licenses dating back into the 1950's. LID behavior is not limited to vhf/uhf repeaters nor newer operators. We also have old-time fools and nere-do-wells on hf that detract from the desired level of ethical standards that we'd like to see maintained. It is also interesting that activity on the cw the portion of bands has actually increased as newer operators have voluntarily discovered the challenge and joys of the key or in my case the Vibroplex classic. After an absense of four decades away from the hobby, cw is a fun and rewarding portion of my enjoyment, Global statements, such as quoted above, only identify the level of the operator's curmudgeon quotient that separates experience and talented operators from helping the new people.. The observed symptoms of the curmudgeon disease is the accusedly quivering of the first finger digit and a rapidly quaking voice of outraged derision. It should be quarantined to QRZed forum diatribes.
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Last edited by elk2370bruce; 09-25-2010 at 3:03 PM..
  #25 (permalink)  
Old 09-25-2010, 8:19 PM
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I have heard a fair share of obscene traffic on the HAM bands too, I have heard more when monitoring taxi radio traffic.
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Last edited by FLA2760; 09-25-2010 at 8:21 PM..
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Old 09-25-2010, 9:04 PM
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Originally Posted by FLA2760 View Post
I have heard a fair share of obscene traffic on the HAM bands too, I have heard more when monitoring taxi radio traffic.
Add to the list CB radio, GMRS, MURS, police, fire, ems - not to mention cable/direct tv. The choice remains:
a. make a tape/cd or dvd and send to FCC with details as to date. time, band, repeater and callsigns.
b. turn the big knob on the radio to less offensive qso's.
c. Keep listening out of vicarious desire and ring your hands in guilt
d. look up their callsign address and go cuss em out. You can also carry a picket sign "The owner of this radio station is a potty mouth."
We are all exposed to language and actions that are potentially offensive in every life activity - not just on the ray-di-oh.
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Old 09-25-2010, 11:51 PM
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Originally Posted by KE4NYV View Post
This is a direct result of no-code licensing and the overall dumbing-down of the hobby and licensing criteria.
Yes I understand because I am a no coder that I haven't earned [in your eyes] any approval nor should I be allowed to talk on the exaulted frequency spectrum . My learning and testing and all my years on radios means nothing and I should be swept away so the "PURISTS" are allowed to use it as a special persons class. Next I suppose someone will need to blame the older tube rigs as the cause of global warming..
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2010, 12:30 AM
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Yes I understand because I am a no coder that I haven't earned [in your eyes] any approval nor should I be allowed to talk on the exaulted frequency spectrum...
Not to worry... In my experience as a 35+ year 'know code' ham, I'm pretty sure that the opinion that the elimination of the code has wrought havoc on the ham bands is an opinion held by a very vocal, but small, minority.

The fact is, the entry level ham license was always easy to get - 20 simple questions and a 5wpm code test. Now there's no code test, but there's more questions. Seems like a wash to me.

Look though the letters to the editors of old copies of QST, and see the rants against the foul language and LIDS on 75 meters.. in the 30's, 40's and 50's. Learning the code has nothing to do with one's behavior as a ham, or one's level of knowledge.

My only lament is the no-code techs who can't complete a very weak signal UHF contact because they can't do code.Oh well...
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2010, 7:24 AM
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Originally Posted by mancow View Post
The only "dumbing down" was the ridiculous farce that was the requirement for people to learn an ancient language of beeps before earning the right to use their state of the art $1000 radio capable of communicating in a myriad of different modes.

Should we require teenagers to learn to ride a horse around town before granting them a driver's license?

I agree that there should be a level of difficulty and a set of standards but they should be based in reality and in context of the current technology.
I know the following comment is going to start a real tempest but I just got to say it.

Learning even just 5 words a minute requires some discipline. It requires some self-motivation. And it can't just be memorized out of a pool of questions. You can't just keep taking a practice test on QRZ 111 times until you pass it with no knowledge of what was on the test.

No code is giving us a different flavor of ham. It's giving us the social misfits who cluster on simplex because they are too cheap to put in on repeater maintenance. It's giving us the 40 year olds who still live at home with their mom and dad. The less than motivated who are on the radio all night and half the day because they don't have the self-inititve to get out and get a job.

How many no-code techs do you know that have the knowledge to reverse engineer a NASA satellite, yet there is something weird about them? Something's not quite right. A little strange. Kinda obvious they lack some social skills. No-code has seemed to bring in a lot of that too into the hobby.

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Last edited by Wyandotte; 09-26-2010 at 7:25 AM.. Reason: fat fingers
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Old 09-26-2010, 8:45 AM
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[QUOTE=Wyandotte;1387773]I know the following comment is going to start a real tempest but I just got to say it.

.

How many no-code techs do you know that have the knowledge to reverse engineer a NASA satellite,

How many know code operators can perform that complex task? A small minority can and the majority of those people that can are not even hams at all.
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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 09-26-2010, 4:03 PM
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Originally Posted by reedeb View Post
Yes I understand because I am a no coder that I haven't earned [in your eyes] any approval nor should I be allowed to talk on the exaulted frequency spectrum . My learning and testing and all my years on radios means nothing and I should be swept away so the "PURISTS" are allowed to use it as a special persons class. Next I suppose someone will need to blame the older tube rigs as the cause of global warming..
The purveyors of this diatribe seem to emerge from their coffins periodically and emote this nonsense out of pure ego. It is not "PURIST" as you state -- just pure, self-serving, fermenting fecal matter designed to impress us. It is these residents of self proclaimed Mount Olympus wherein the radio gods are thought to dwell (of which they are of course, plank-holding members) proclaim their own superiority to us mere mortals for adulation. I'd love to see these verbal detractors rise from their chairs and actually take active part in improving their esposed "sorry state of amateur radio" instead of the QRN (not QRM that might involve human interference) pap displayed by KE4NYV and his partners in crime. Begone foul denizen and return to the deep mire and ooze whence you sprang for reason of judicious isolation and quarantine,
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Last edited by elk2370bruce; 09-26-2010 at 4:13 PM..
  #32 (permalink)  
Old 10-04-2010, 4:00 AM
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Oh dear god ... here it comes.

No code or code. Morons can exist with either the skill or no skill. I have no sense of rhythm and couldn't do code for ten years, no matter how much I practiced and I did. Now I'm a General going for my Extra next month. And guess what, I have never cursed on the air. Oh and I'm an MSEE. And I'm a "no-code".

The no code and dumbing-down argument is used by the ignorant who need some tangible excuse due the an inability to understand basic human nature.
  #33 (permalink)  
Old 10-09-2010, 10:53 AM
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Oh dear god ... here it comes.

No code or code. Morons can exist with either the skill or no skill. I have no sense of rhythm and couldn't do code for ten years, no matter how much I practiced and I did. Now I'm a General going for my Extra next month. And guess what, I have never cursed on the air. Oh and I'm an MSEE. And I'm a "no-code".

The no code and dumbing-down argument is used by the ignorant who need some tangible excuse due the an inability to understand basic human nature.
I agree whole-heartedly with your statement. When I first got back on the air and found my old bug in a dusty box, I was glad that I was not Catholic -- for I had no rhythm either! I just sat down and crunched my way up- to 25 wpm and it did (and still does) take time. I am so sick of the artificial barriers (the them vs, us) that people assemble out of ego, stupidity, or just personal vindictiveness. No one in our hobby benefits from this self aggrandizing crap and only isolates newer or returning ops from the few, the contentious, and self-proclaimed superior beings that do not want to interact with us.. It must also be said that the overwhelming number of people that I've had QSO's with (around the world, on local club repeaters, and IRLP) were, and remain, very helpful and positive in helping me gain new skills and abilities in addition to being just nice people. Several great ops even have a slow-speed instructional cw net on 40 meters where you get super help for brass pounding skill improvement.They are the real heroes of the hobby - not the negative curmudgeons who act like they hate everyone - even themselves.
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Last edited by elk2370bruce; 10-09-2010 at 10:55 AM..
  #34 (permalink)  
Old 10-09-2010, 11:13 AM
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Originally Posted by KE4NYV View Post
This is a direct result of no-code licensing and the overall dumbing-down of the hobby and licensing criteria.
In the specific case he quotes you are incorrect. The LA area 147.435 repeater he mentions has been a problem child with this kind of activity since before the no-code Tech ticket existed, let alone removal of code from the other classes. This repeater has been a contributor to law suits, jail sentences, and pulled tickets for users, not that those people were not heading that direction anyway.

I might generally agree with you in some other areas of the hobby as a result of no code and easier testing, but definitely not about this one.

T!
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Old 10-10-2010, 12:03 PM
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In my opinion, having a FCC license carries are responsibility. As an operator, you are charged with observing the rules and regulations of the license, period!

Please, understand, that I have a Ph.D. in profanity, but I dont' think it is appropriate to use on a Ham radio. Otherwise, the medium will end up like the CB, a no man's land.

On the other hand, I am against ANY censorship on the television airwaves. In Europe, some countries show adult homo sapien husbandry films (better known as pornorgraphy in JesusLand, the U.S.A.). Despite the presence of V-chips and electronic cleansing devices, we still have morality police governing our lives. If you don't want your brat watching provocative programming, activate the many avenues of censorship that are available to you. You can employ parental controls and many other paths of moral sterilization instead of cramping my style.

So, please, increase the violence and sex during prime time. I am an adult! I should have adult programming.

Just sharing my opinion.
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Old 10-12-2010, 11:14 AM
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Having a post-doc in advanced scatology, and enjoying the televised "adult centered" content (within some reasonable limits), we do have some freedoms left. I do not include amateur radio in my liberal interpretation of freedom of speech issues. We have rules, social mores, common sense, and courtesy to guide us in our verbal communications on the ray-dee-oh. While we are "amateur radio" does not mean that we should not act professionally and appropriately - for the op at the other end of the qso may have different sensitivities or have his kids listening (or in my case grandson). It is not that hard to establish good on the air habits right from the get go. We have been blessed with the ability for complex reasoning. In short, put brain in gear before engaging the verbal opening.
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Old 10-12-2010, 11:38 AM
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Having a post-doc in advanced scatology, and enjoying the televised "adult centered" content (within some reasonable limits), we do have some freedoms left. I do not include amateur radio in my liberal interpretation of freedom of speech issues. We have rules, social mores, common sense, and courtesy to guide us in our verbal communications on the ray-dee-oh. While we are "amateur radio" does not mean that we should not act professionally and appropriately - for the op at the other end of the qso may have different sensitivities or have his kids listening (or in my case grandson). It is not that hard to establish good on the air habits right from the get go. We have been blessed with the ability for complex reasoning. In short, put brain in gear before engaging the verbal opening.
Oh, I am laughing now. Well-stated! Nothing is more embarrassing than to have young ears listen to an unprofessional driver talking about this and that. I have noticed more and more of this talk on the radio these days. Typically, it is centered around larger cities and certain truck stops.

For instance, if you are ever traveling in the Dallas area near the intersection of IH35E and IH20, it would be wise to turn off the radio if you are wanting to protect the sensitives of impressionable ears. This is a vile spot in Texas. I believe the trash talk is coming from the TA. Furthermore, you will frequently hear Lot Lizards soliciting Johns.

But, the top prize goes to the Pilot on the east side of San Antonio, Texas off of IH10. In my opinion, San Antonio is nothing but a cesspool disguised as a River Walk. That water is filthy. Furthermore, the Texas parole board once used San Antonio as a major dump location for offenders, even if they weren't from that area. Now, they return parolees to the county of their conviction.

10-4?
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Old 10-13-2010, 12:27 PM
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I remember San Antonio very well and, in fact, spend a week there one day. Every state, I am sure has their own share of trash talkers, potty-mouths, and purveyors of illicit compansionship hawking their wares. Unlike those who whine, complain, and wring their hands among themselves both here and elsewhere (but still keep listening vicariously), the options remain: (a) file a formal complaint and documentation with FCC or (b) locate the big knob on the radio (or find it the user manual) and rotate gently. There is also that nice little button/switch (often of a different color) that opens/closes the power circuit to the rig. We are blessed with a concept of free will and encouraged to solve our own problems - preferably in some quiet way.
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Old 10-13-2010, 9:17 PM
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I have been reading this thread, and I have some opinions. While the FCC is ultimately responsible, so is the control operator, and the repeater trustee. I am a fairly new ham -- and one of these "dreaded" no coders, perhaps in the future I might learn CW (and want to learn). One thing I learned was that we are to some degree are also a self-regulating community. For a short time we had some of the same problems on our repeater. We had what was for all we could tell was a unlicensed operator, that was basically an "Internet Troll". After a few times of trying to "confront" him on air, we then ignored him, and often resorted to keeping the tone on. After awhile he simply left. While I have no idea how bad it is, perhaps more "responsible" operators simply need to say (in a calm, instructive way) that to please stop it, as it is not correct operating procedure, and not "good will". The only other option is of course, simply move to another repeater. It is a pity that a few "bad eggs" can ruin it for everyone.
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Old 10-15-2010, 8:36 AM
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You are correct in that the Trustee listed on the club license has the "control" over the repeater. Unfortunately, there is no special software that can deny a specific individual (whether by name or callsign) from signing in and spreading their trash. Yes, the PL can be changed which can be easily scanned and inconviences the good ops as well. There have been a number of repeaters where the potty mouths has refused to cease their nonsense and the FCC has advised the repeater trustee/owner to shut it down completely.
While your theory works well for the good guys, the bad eggs just laugh and continue on to the detriment of all. I wish it were that easy from a very practical stance.
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