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  #81 (permalink)  
Old 08-16-2018, 12:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lauri-Coyote View Post
.
So there's my challenge- anyone want to take a stab at writing their idea of what it should say ? **
I agree it is too vague, and I'm happy to take up the challenge!

Forgive the errors here, I'm a Network Engineer, not a lawyer.
-------------------------------
WHEREAS wireless communication is a shared public good that benefits all Americans in various forms.
and
WHEREAS wireless communication is severely limited by installation inside buildings, requiring the need for external antennas in many cases.
and
WHEREAS laws and covenants have been enacted that deny a homeowner using external antennas on their own property

THEREFORE, Congress declares the following:

1. The area within 10 feet of a home, or in a shared building, the area directly within 10 feet of the part of the building with exclusive use of the renter, may have an antenna or other receiving equipment that is less than 6 feet in any measurement. The mast and antenna may not intrude into any area not owned by the homeowner or within the area of exclusive use of the renter.

2. No laws or covenants can override this right of the homeowner or renter. The only restrictions permitted are ones that are designed to prevent an antenna from encroaching onto a neighboring property if it falls.
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  #82 (permalink)  
Old 08-16-2018, 12:13 PM
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Originally Posted by W9BU View Post
What this all comes down to, in my opinion, is land use rights and private contracts. I'm not crazy about the idea of government getting involved in private contracts.
I'm not crazy about it, either, but I think there are many examples where it is a good thing.

We can't sign a contract to put ourselves into slavery, for an extreme example.

I'm all for laws that would prevent a HOA from banning flying the American Flag, despite the intrusion into private contracts.

There has to be some limit put on HOAs for how far they can control my property, and I think within 10 feet of my home, an antenna of 6 feet or less is where that line is drawn.

We can, and likely do, disagree on where that line is drawn.

However, I don't think anyone* thinks that we should remove all limitations on contracts.

*Except Anarchists.
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  #83 (permalink)  
Old 08-16-2018, 12:36 PM
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I've heard so many people complain about HOAs that maybe HOAs should be the thing that needs to be ridden
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  #84 (permalink)  
Old 08-16-2018, 12:52 PM
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Originally Posted by needairtime View Post
I've heard so many people complain about HOAs that maybe HOAs should be the thing that needs to be ridden
My dad is president of their HOA group. Mainly, because no one else stepped up, and also because he didn't want some jackwagon getting in there and being stupid. On the board he has a cop, my brother, my brother in law and I think one other "random citizen".

I asked him specifically about how their HOA would handle this sort of stuff.
The management company doesn't have control, the board does, so unless someone bought a home without reading the declarations, that shouldn't be an issue, or a surprise.
The board can add/change/remove rules with a vote of the homeowners. They don't get to make unilateral decisions and make up rules as they go along.
The management company provides resources, attorneys, documentation, etc.
It's a democracy, if you want to be on the HOA board, then get nominated and voted in. It's like any other election, complaints don't mean much if you don't bother to get involved and vote.

He said they likely wouldn't have an issue with amateur radio antennas if they were small and reasonable. He's a ham. My brother is a ham and my brother in law is a ham. All three on the HOA board. No one has put up a tower/beam combination. There are small satellite dishes. My dad has one on his house, mounted on the back, out of view of the street. A small vertical antenna wouldn't be an issue. A wire antenna wouldn't be an issue, but the yards are awful small.

They do occasionally have to talk to home owners, but it's when they do stupid stuff, like park their cars in the fire lane.
They've had people buy houses there, then refuse to pay the HOA dues. They signed a contract, they gets lots of warning and flexibility to pay. Eventually it goes to court. Doesn't happen often, but some owners don't seem to be concerned with reading what they sign.

HOA's, on their own, are not the issue. If someone doesn't want to live in an HOA controlled area, there isn't anyone forcing them to be there. If they want to be on the HOA board, they can. The issue is HOA boards that get out of control, either through neglect or being overrun by people that make decisions that are not agreeable to others. There are ways to deal with that, but like most things, it takes effort. Many do not want to put the effort into it. They just want the government to fix it for them.

I don't understand that attitude.
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  #85 (permalink)  
Old 08-16-2018, 1:27 PM
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Originally Posted by JasonTracy View Post
*Except Anarchists.
You rang?

An anarcho-capitalist would not be in support of removing all limitations on contracts. Private contracts are the choice of the parties involved.
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  #86 (permalink)  
Old 08-16-2018, 1:27 PM
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To prevent this thread from going off topic, I've created a thread in the Tavern for HOA discussions.

HOAs are somewhat related, but this bill isn't discussing getting rid of them or if they're good or bad. It is narrowly focused on allowing amateur radio antennas to override HOA rules.

Outside of that, let's talk about HOAs over here: https://forums.radioreference.com/ev...-good-bad.html
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  #87 (permalink)  
Old 08-16-2018, 3:08 PM
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Hmmmmm Im Lost Jason---This Bill is All About HOA Talk/Rules and Regulations along with a bill that was being presented with More HOA Enforcement toward Us--- How is this Talk Running off Topic for you to Start another Thread---Sorry but It Feels Like a Hijack Job to Me

Please Enlighten Me
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  #88 (permalink)  
Old 08-16-2018, 3:44 PM
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I agree that the smart thing would be not to ever land yourself in an HOA/Covenanted neighborhood or complex in the first place. In my humble opinion, HOA's are as pointless, intrusive, and deadly as screen doors on a submarine. Most of the leaders of them seem to be corrupt or just love telling others how to live their lives. Frankly, HOA's should be outlawed.

But, since they do exist, this bill, or an improved version of it, needs to be passed. And it should be done at the federal level. Amateur Radio is a federally regulated service. Therefore it's the federal government's jurisdiction to protect it and ensure that those appropriately licensed may operate unfettered.

If you willingly signed the contract you're dumb for doing so. But even if you did, if you paid for your home and pay your taxes...your license should outweigh their brown-noising.
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  #89 (permalink)  
Old 08-16-2018, 4:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ipfd320 View Post
Hmmmmm Im Lost Jason---This Bill is All About HOA Talk/Rules and Regulations along with a bill that was being presented with More HOA Enforcement toward Us--- How is this Talk Running off Topic for you to Start another Thread---Sorry but It Feels Like a Hijack Job to Me

Please Enlighten Me
The way I took it... He made a thread in Tavern to give a little bit more latitude for some of us than is allowable in Amateur Radio General Discussion. Also, I believe that he wishes to focus more on HOA and not just about the Amateur Radio Parity Act.
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  #90 (permalink)  
Old 08-16-2018, 6:44 PM
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I'll take a go at my own question- a reworded....what the H is this called? the "Amateur Radio Parity Act (HR 555) ? "
.
.
It's Lauri Coyote's simple, guaranteed to pass Congress, Amateur Radio Parity Act (HR 123) :
it is as follows-
.
" If you have a two way hobby radio you are allowed, pursuant to state and local laws, to operate said equipment, barring any applicable restrictions"
.
Easy Peasy
.
.
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  #91 (permalink)  
Old 08-16-2018, 8:11 PM
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We Need You in Congress--I Vote Yes Its to Bad the Local and State Dont see it That Way---I Do Like your Thinking Tho
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  #92 (permalink)  
Old 08-16-2018, 8:27 PM
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I think it's easier than that, Lauri. The "Uniform Development Ordinance" for my town has sections that cover every zoning type, e.g. residential, commercial, industrial, etc. Each of those sections specify the maximum height of auxiliary structures. The height standards go into a lot more detail about how the maximum height is to be applied. At the end of the height standards section is this wording: "Ham radio towers shall be exempt from the maximum structure height if the ham radio tower is located on a lot owned by a ham radio operator that has a valid and active license from the Federal Communications Commission."

Period. End of story.

Many of the issues addressed by CC&Rs cover issues that are already addressed by the town's UDO. The CC&Rs do go into more detail and are often more restrictive than the UDO. That's fine. But, the UDO already addresses "ham radio towers".

Bottom line for me is that I would like for the CC&Rs to simply get out of the way. They are redundant in the face of a well-written zoning ordinance.
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  #93 (permalink)  
Old 08-16-2018, 8:57 PM
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I was hoping my sarcasm show'd thru my 'modest proposal' ..... smiles...
.
..........A community, thru their zoning laws, can handle this very well without any federal meddling.
.
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  #94 (permalink)  
Old 08-16-2018, 10:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ipfd320 View Post
Hmmmmm Im Lost Jason---This Bill is All About HOA Talk/Rules and Regulations along with a bill that was being presented with More HOA Enforcement toward Us--- How is this Talk Running off Topic for you to Start another Thread---Sorry but It Feels Like a Hijack Job to Me

Please Enlighten Me
I wasn't trying to hijack anything. I saw earlier in this thread that someone said the conversation may be getting off-topic, and I didn't want to end up with this thread being closed because it became a HOA rant rather than a discussion about the proposed law.

I'm still pretty new to the forums, and wanted to be cautious not to break the rules.
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Old 08-17-2018, 5:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JasonTracy View Post
I saw earlier in this thread that someone said the conversation may be getting off-topic..
Just let the moderators moderate. I read every thread in the amateur radio forums every day. If there's a problem, I'll put on my moderator hat and take action.

Now, back to the Amateur Radio Parity Act and what its trying to accomplish.
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  #96 (permalink)  
Old 08-17-2018, 7:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W9BU View Post
Bottom line for me is that I would like for the CC&Rs to simply get out of the way. They are redundant in the face of a well-written zoning ordinance.
So, isn't that what this bill would do?

There are many examples in government where we protect the rights of the minority even when it isn't popular.

I really think my right to put up an antenna on my own property that is small enough that it doesn't fall onto someone else's property is equal to my right to self protection or free speech.
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Old 08-17-2018, 8:22 AM
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I believe that any Commission licensee should be able to erect suitable antennas at their personal residence for non-business use. Ham radio alone might not be a big enough "bloc" to get Congress to move. Let's get the GMRS crowd in on this as well.

The simplest solution is for the FCC to amend PRB-1.
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Old 08-17-2018, 8:49 AM
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Originally Posted by DaveNF2G View Post
I believe that any Commission licensee should be able to erect suitable antennas at their personal residence for non-business use. Ham radio alone might not be a big enough "bloc" to get Congress to move. Let's get the GMRS crowd in on this as well.

The simplest solution is for the FCC to amend PRB-1.
I don't think there are enough GMRS users willing to spend the money for "suitable antennas" to make a difference.
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  #99 (permalink)  
Old 08-17-2018, 9:33 AM
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If you're looking for a house and expect to be able to erect an antenna, then check before you buy. This reminds me of a local neighborhood next to a local airport that experienced increased population quickly. Suddenly, everyone was griping about the airport that has existed since the 1920s. It's home research; the onus is on the buyer.

Even as a ham radio operator, I do not enjoy the sight of many of the antennas that are erected.

Last edited by belvdr; 08-17-2018 at 9:39 AM..
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Old 08-17-2018, 9:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by belvdr View Post
If you're looking for a house and expect to be able to erect an antenna, then check before you buy.

I built my house in 2003, and became a licensed amateur in 2016.

Id just like someone to explain why my neighbors have any right to dictate what I do on my property, when it does not impact them. Ive seen absolutely no evidence that a reasonable amateur radio antenna impacts home values.
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