451.800 or other UHF Business Frequencies

[KN4EIG]

My work Place is using the Baofeng BF-888s and currently on the FRS Frequencies. My question is can we use these radio's on the UHF Business Frequencies so we don't have outside interference. We are a high tourist area and every summer John boy and his kin in different cars along with Jane Doe and her kin in different cars, come through the main area using the FRS Frequencies and interrupt our operations. The company is to cheap to get their own license for a set of Frequencies on a normal day we use 3-4 different channels. As a HAM Op I know what i can and can't use but the info i am finding about the UHF Business Frequencies is about as clear as Mud with 10' stagnate water on top of it. The list of Frequencies i am talking about is listed here https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?aid=7792

 

[nd5y]

You need a business radio license to operate on those frequencies.
See https://www.fcc.gov/wireless/bureau...strial-business/industrial-business-licensing for licensing information.

 

[Golay]

Letter Dots

You shouldn't have any problems communicating with any of the UHF frequencies listed that are 4 digits to the right that end in 5.These are itinerant frequencies. I would first try to communicate on low power.

Nd5y is right in that you may need to be licensed.
Having said that, I would just go ahead and use them, with a CSQ. More than likely, anyone actually licensed will be using a tone or DPL. So they're not going to hear you anyway. By running a carrier squelch, you'll know if someone else is using the channel, and simply move to another itinerant frequency.

But I ponder why you yourself are not using a DPL on the FRS channels you got now. Looking at that radio, I believe I read 105 different TPL's and 50 DPL' s. Doing this would mean they can hear you, but you can't hear them. Maybe you're also thinking you don't want them to hear you. Not a bad idea.

 

[TampaTyron]

Please do not follow this advise. As someone who is in the industry, you will likely not get caught. But, the penalty for illegal use is much more expensive than the permit to use the radio frequencies. We track down unlicensed users quite often. Now, the reality is that the FCC could care less about unlicensed operation unless you are Public Safety or leaking cable TV equipment. Again, find a legal way or maybe use MURS if your radios are capable of it. Thank you, TT.

You shouldn't have any problems communicating with any of the UHF frequencies listed that are 4 digits to the right that end in 5.These are itinerant frequencies. I would first try to communicate on low power.

Nd5y is right in that you may need to be licensed.
Having said that, I would just go ahead and use them, with a CSQ. More than likely, anyone actually licensed will be using a tone or DPL. So they're not going to hear you anyway. By running a carrier squelch, you'll know if someone else is using the channel, and simply move to another itinerant frequency.

 

[KK4JUG]

The radios aren't legal on FRS either.

 

[cmdrwill]

The list of Frequencies i am talking about is listed here https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?aid=7792

ALL those listed frequencies REQUIRE a FCC License..

 

[Golay]

But of course

The radios aren't legal on FRS either.

Yeah, that's the first thing that crossed my mind when I read the original post.
But I left it alone. Figured why go there?

 

[KK4JUG]

Yeah, that's the first thing that crossed my mind when I read the original post.
But I left it alone. Figured why go there?

Since it's illegal, someone should go there because not everyone knows the limitations and/or requirements of FRS radios.

 

[Darkstar350]

With the dot/star "Business GMRS"(a nickname i call them...) freqs such as 451.800,464.550 ,etc you do need a IG industrial business license
Many department stores and retailers among other businesses are licensed for nation wide use of such frequencies
The big radio manufacturers like Motorola and Kenwood actually make handheld radios specific for this purpose with pre programmed frequencies and tones in the radios much like the regular GMRS portables
TK-3230DX | On-Site Business Radio | Communications | KENWOOD USA
What im not positive on is exact radio type that can be used with these channels or power limits and whatnot..

 

[nd5y]

What im not positive on is exact radio type that can be used with these channels or power limits and whatnot..

Radios have to be Part 90 certified.
Power limits vary depending on the frequencies used.
More info and links to FCC rules at https://wiki.radioreference.com/index.php/Common_Itinerant_and_Business

 

[Thunderknight]

And as a ham, technically you are risking your license if you knowingly commit a violation of the FCC rules. Your license could be held to a fitness hearing.

 

[Thunderknight]

But I ponder why you yourself are not using a DPL on the FRS channels you got now. Looking at that radio, I believe I read 105 different TPL's and 50 DPL' s. Doing this would mean they can hear you, but you can't hear them. Maybe you're also thinking you don't want them to hear you. Not a bad idea.

Just masking it with a PL doesn't keep the signal from interfering. If the undesired users are in the same area, unless your desired user is at least 12dB stronger, if they are talking at the same time the other family is talking, you won't be able to get a clean signal from the coworker.

 

[daugherh]

You should explain to your workplace (whoever's in charge) that by using the radios the way they are being used currently is setting up the corporation, llc, whatever type of business entity it is for a major failure and possibly very expensive fine from the FCC (if an investigation every does happen...and they do.) Tell them to do everyone a favor and spend the couple hundred dollars to get a license from the FCC and any coordination they may need for it. Licenses are typically good for 10 years. A single fine from the FCC can range in the area of $10,000 +. Even with coordination and application a FCC application and license will probably be less than $1000. A very huge difference. Just my 2 cents worth.

 

[lmrtek]

Switch to MURS radios

 

[KN4EIG]

And as a ham, technically you are risking your license if you knowingly commit a violation of the FCC rules. Your license could be held to a fitness hearing.

Hence the reason i am asking before i do something wrong.

As for the BF888s my understanding is if you put them in low power like the FRS is allowed then they would become legal correct. I am trying to find the best way to get us on our own freq or where we don't have interferance.... also as for the freq we already us that was decieded way before i got here and they was using the Relm RPU4200-a at that time

 

[KK4JUG]

888s are not acceptable for FRS, wattage not withstanding. They don't meet FCC standards because they have removable antennae and are frequency adjustable. Essentially, the RELM is pretty much the same as the 888, they're just more expensive

There's no way you can have your "own freq" on FRS. We all have access to it. A CTCSS tone can help some with privacy but not if someone figures it out.

 

[KD8DVR]

Hence the reason i am asking before i do something wrong.

As for the BF888s my understanding is if you put them in low power like the FRS is allowed then they would become legal correct. I am trying to find the best way to get us on our own freq or where we don't have interferance.... also as for the freq we already us that was decieded way before i got here and they was using the Relm RPU4200-a at that time

No. Bf888 radios are not fcc certified for use on frs, so therefore illegal.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk

 

[KC4RAF]

+1 with John just posted. If the transceiver has a detachable antenna, then it's not type acceptable for FRS, (that's just ONE of the no no).

 

[baltimorecs]

The only two options for the 888S are ham and part 90 (business). But you can get a business license for those itinerant frequencies for not too much money. I cannot recall exactly but ours was less than $300. An itinerant part 90 license does not require coordination and you can do it yourself if you know how to navigate the online form 601 in the FCC's ULS system.

 

[Golay]

Get on the air

Hence the reason i am asking before i do something wrong.

As for the BF888s my understanding is if you put them in low power like the FRS is allowed then they would become legal correct. I am trying to find the best way to get us on our own freq or where we don't have interferance.... also as for the freq we already us that was decieded way before i got here and they was using the Relm RPU4200-a at that time

So from what I gathered looking at the 'net, the Relm radio you speak of is a 16 channel 5 watt radio with a programming range of 420-470 MHz. This also appears to be a radio no longer made. Do you happen to know if the Relm radios were also programmed with just FRS freqs?

I can't shag the feeling that at some point in time, y'all had a business license. And possibly it was so long ago, no one at your crib realizes it. Would you care to share, either here or in a private message to someone , the name of your employer. Folks here could ascertain if my theory holds water.