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Old 07-08-2018, 10:32 PM
   
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Question Western New York Repeater

Any one know where "Western New York Repeater" heard on CB Channel 30 is located and what it might be linked to? I hear it ID all the time at night in Iowa.
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Old 07-10-2018, 7:16 AM
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CB Radio does not use Repeaters.....


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Originally Posted by Archdruid View Post
Any one know where "Western New York Repeater" heard on CB Channel 30 is located and what it might be linked to? I hear it ID all the time at night in Iowa.
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Old 07-10-2018, 9:16 AM
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Originally Posted by ecps92 View Post

CB Radio does not use Repeaters.....
I'm sure the OP already knows that, which is why the question is posted.

It seems the CB band is used for anything and everything. Illegal repeaters, baby monitors, digital communications, voice scrambling, FM mode, thousand watt amps, etc.

However, the ID could be an image from another frequency that has a strong signal. Without any more information, it will be difficult to give an answer. If you can record the repeater ID and decode it, then you will be a long way in getting an answer as to what is going on there.
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Old 07-10-2018, 10:04 AM
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There have been a number of repeaters set up in the CB band over the years. Probably the most famous was by Larry WA6SWG, now SK.

Edit: Here is another thread discussing this particular CB repeater but there are a few wrong comments in post # 41 like Larry did not work for TPL but he did work for Fannon Courier and designed a popular CB and amplifier for them and also for Pace. I introduced Larry to the property owner where the repeater lived and was found by the FCC and I also sold Larry some of the equipment he used to build the repeater.

https://forums.radioreference.com/cb...epeater-3.html

Larry's repeater even made news in Popular Communications magazine on page 20 here: https://www.americanradiohistory.com...ns-1988-06.pdf and in Monitoring Times magazine page 18 here: https://www.americanradiohistory.com...es-1987-12.pdf



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Originally Posted by ecps92 View Post

CB Radio does not use Repeaters.....

Last edited by prcguy; 07-10-2018 at 10:32 AM..
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Old 07-10-2018, 11:33 AM
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Thanks, never heard of one on actual CB channels.
Freeband and bootlegging Amateur Sure...

Quote:
Originally Posted by prcguy View Post
There have been a number of repeaters set up in the CB band over the years. Probably the most famous was by Larry WA6SWG, now SK.

Edit: Here is another thread discussing this particular CB repeater but there are a few wrong comments in post # 41 like Larry did not work for TPL but he did work for Fannon Courier and designed a popular CB and amplifier for them and also for Pace. I introduced Larry to the property owner where the repeater lived and was found by the FCC and I also sold Larry some of the equipment he used to build the repeater.

https://forums.radioreference.com/cb...epeater-3.html

Larry's repeater even made news in Popular Communications magazine on page 20 here: https://www.americanradiohistory.com...ns-1988-06.pdf and in Monitoring Times magazine page 18 here: https://www.americanradiohistory.com...es-1987-12.pdf
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Old 07-30-2018, 1:16 PM
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There are many repeaters on channel 30 cb band 11m 27.305MHz,
Locations are in: Russia, Sweden, Germany, UK, Serbia, Australia, USA New York.
Some are on AM, FM and Upper SSB, I did hear Packet on the one in New York for a short time on AM.

Might be more that I haven't heard before. The UK has a big net on the repeater that if you go to youTube, can find the guys talking and signing in. type "27.305 repeaters" and can find many repeaters for that channel.
Im not sure why they pick channel 30?
I have heard the NY repeater for about 2 years now or more, I do hear people on it time to time voice and that one time of packet sound, maybe to guys where talking computer to computer?
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Old 08-14-2018, 4:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archdruid View Post
Any one know where "Western New York Repeater" heard on CB Channel 30 is located and what it might be linked to? I hear it ID all the time at night in Iowa.

If you are still interested in an answer, this repeater is located south of Buffalo, New York. The input is carrier access at 27.770 mhz. Once in a while you will hear two parties talking directly on channel 30. One of the voices is that of the person on the voice ID and is usually stronger that the other party. The conversations are of a low technical level. That person may be the owner and/or control operator, and may be located at the actual repeater site itself. The ID announces "Western New York Repeater" every 10 minutes 24/7. It can be heard throughout the United States. It has no purpose and I never hear it repeating anything or anyone. Regardless, it is not legal.

Last edited by wska999; 08-14-2018 at 5:53 PM..
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Old 08-15-2018, 12:24 PM
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I was on the repeater the other day, very interesting, they said I was coming not so good, lots of static, so I went simplex. They have added a computer link now to the repeater that if you have a computer connection, you can link to the repeater by phone or computer, have to install Teamviewer and skype to your phone or computer and talk from anywhere in the world as long as you have internet access. Very clever and hope to see these guy grow this thing. I dont know many or really anyone in there area so its hard to follow talks, they all seem to know each other for years, Hate being the new guy.

I know its not Legal, but 99% of CB isnt legal, cant run more than 5w, can only use a CB radio, no Ham type radios, cant talk more than 50 mile and or Skip, no repeaters, no cussing, so I guess we all brake. rules.
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Old 08-15-2018, 8:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by princeshyness View Post
I was on the repeater the other day, very interesting, they said I was coming not so good, lots of static, so I went simplex. They have added a computer link now to the repeater that if you have a computer connection, you can link to the repeater by phone or computer, have to install Teamviewer and skype to your phone or computer and talk from anywhere in the world as long as you have internet access. Very clever and hope to see these guy grow this thing. I dont know many or really anyone in there area so its hard to follow talks, they all seem to know each other for years, Hate being the new guy.

I know its not Legal, but 99% of CB isnt legal, cant run more than 5w, can only use a CB radio, no Ham type radios, cant talk more than 50 mile and or Skip, no repeaters, no cussing, so I guess we all brake. rules.

Then my question for you: Did you actually transmit on the input frequency at one point and bring up the repeater? Secondly, the 150 mile restriction for CB radio was eliminated some time ago. The five watt limitation still stands.
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Old 08-16-2018, 9:36 AM
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this is the last up date massage for CB by the FCC:\
FCC Personal Radio Service Revisions Will Affect GMRS, FRS, CB, Other Part 95 Devices
Soon it will be legal for CBers to work DX on 11 meters. In a lengthy Report and Order (R&O) in a proceeding (WT Docket No. 10-119) dating back 7 years, the FCC has announced rule changes affecting the General Mobile Radio Service (GMRS), the Family Radio Service (FRS), the Citizens Band Radio Service (CBRS or "CB"), and other applications that fall under the FCC's Part 95 Personal Radio Services (PRS) rules and regulations. Part 95 devices typically are low-power units that communicate over shared spectrum and, with some exceptions, do not require a license

The FCC said changes to the decades-old Citizens Band (CB) rules will remove outdated requirements, including certain labeling requirements. DXing on Citizens Band will become legal too. Once the new rules are effective, CBers will be allowed to contact stations outside of the FCC-imposed -- but widely disregarded -- 155.3-mile distance limit. The revised CB rules further clarify how hands-free devices can be used with CB radios and will allow the use of wireless microphones with CB radios. The FCC left in place the current power limits for the CB Radio Service.

Yes, I tx on 27.700 AM, and rx on 27.305 it had a hang time of about 3 sec, they said I was coming in with static, so i went simplex. I cant hear everyone on the channel, seems like there is a lot of people that talk on 30. I only hear the repeater call out every 10 mins about and once in awhile someone will be on it, a party or 2, but not often. Might be do to most people dont have split frequencies in there radios, or lack of knowing how to use it? I think it be great to have one in my area, might get more people to talk, would have to run way less power. might also be good for a person that is elderly and or living in a place where an antenna is not permitted, a repeater with a computer remote could be very useful also. I have had heard also 2 people using Packet on the repeater, now that was interesting. I didnt think people used that anymore, but there it was, sounded like 2 fax machines fighting.
I do go to buffalo a lot, Ill get my Icom hooked in my mobile and see if I get in better, now I have to find my old 5/8 magnet antenna.
wska999 do you live in NY? and can you key the repeater?
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Old 08-16-2018, 5:00 PM
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No. I live in Florida. I only worked the owner of the New York repeater directly on 27.305 a few times. Yes- I think is was May of last year that the FCC dropped the 150 mile restriction on 11 meter CB. It has always been a sport for me to track unidentified signals. Most of the ones I located were accidental. Some we not. One was a toy that belonged to the kid of one of the guys who was helping me locate the signal. One was on a boat in a dock. Another was on a construction rig. The best one was in a home set up to monitor customers from across the street. I won't go into any detail on that one. One was a jammer that was meant for me. I found it in 15 minutes. What a waste that was for them. Live, intentional jammers aren't worth the trouble. You find the person and let everyone know who is, and they laugh in your face. What happens after that? Nothing. I still enjoy the sport, nevertheless. I love the challenge. Enjoy your hobby. That's what it's all about.
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Old 08-17-2018, 1:23 PM
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ok, nice, not sure if I could handle the Florida heat.
I think once I install my antenna up higher, I should make in the repeater without noise, Im only 30 feet off the ground, and going to put in my poplar tree thats about 90 feet tall. I ran a tape up it to see how big the trees are in my yard, I choose this one as its one of the biggest and closest, I went as far as 75' and didnt want to go any further as i didnt have any climbing gear. My options of where I talk should open up once i get off the ground.
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Old 08-18-2018, 6:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by princeshyness View Post
ok, nice, not sure if I could handle the Florida heat.
I think once I install my antenna up higher, I should make in the repeater without noise, Im only 30 feet off the ground, and going to put in my poplar tree thats about 90 feet tall. I ran a tape up it to see how big the trees are in my yard, I choose this one as its one of the biggest and closest, I went as far as 75' and didnt want to go any further as i didnt have any climbing gear. My options of where I talk should open up once i get off the ground.

I would like to make one more comment about the 11-meter repeater: You hand mentioned that you were able to bring up the repeater using the input frequency of 27.700. If you did bring it up, that's remarkable. Maybe you meant 27.770. This is the frequency the owner said was the input frequency on two different occasions. I could understand why he would use such a odd input. There's nothing assigned to that frequency here in the U.S., and it's far enough away from the regular portion where most people operate. It is also 5khz off the standard channel step configuration of most radios. I monitored 27.770 a few times when the band was open and heard nothing.

I'm not sure how he does his separation and filtering. Many 10-meter repeaters operate without a PL. The receiver must me very tight in those cases. As far as antenna height is concerned, it depends on the design. During our last hurricane down here, one guy learned his lesson. He had his 5/8 on a 100-foot tower. Not good. I'm up less than 20 feet and I found parts all over the place. I was able to recover most of the parts and purchased some tubing at a hamfest and repaired it. It works well on 12 through 10 meters.
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Old 08-19-2018, 9:30 AM
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I will know more tonight, I'm in the middle of installing the antenna in the tree, I should be done this afternoon and I should hit the repeater better. I dont think the guys talk much on the weekend but maybe I might get lucky. I then can find out how the repeater works and why.
I have had my antenna in a big tree before and it lasted about 15 years till the coax went bad, and eventually had to take it down and moved. We dont have hurricanes, ice storms maybe, but 20 to 100 feet dig differences, erp watts go way up. Let me get back to work and I'll update when I can talk to the owner or others that talk on the repeater.
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Old 08-19-2018, 2:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by princeshyness View Post
I will know more tonight, I'm in the middle of installing the antenna in the tree, I should be done this afternoon and I should hit the repeater better. I dont think the guys talk much on the weekend but maybe I might get lucky. I then can find out how the repeater works and why.
I have had my antenna in a big tree before and it lasted about 15 years till the coax went bad, and eventually had to take it down and moved. We dont have hurricanes, ice storms maybe, but 20 to 100 feet dig differences, erp watts go way up. Let me get back to work and I'll update when I can talk to the owner or others that talk on the repeater.

We are having our usual daily storms here, so I usually shut down my station during those times. I monitor channel 30 for the most part and I have not heard our friends from the Buffalo area lately. I did, however, hear the repeater ID a few times early in the morning.

I'm not sure where you said you are located, but if you are located anywhere near Buffalo, NY, the height of your antenna would be to your advantage for groundwave. The ERP is based on the design of the antenna, not how high it is. A tree is not the best place for an antenna, but whatever works for you, go for it.

Again, I spoke to the guy a few times directly on channel 30 and he said the input was 27.770, and I explained why he probably chose that frequency. I'd like to obtain his email address so I could get more information.
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Old 08-21-2018, 3:05 PM
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ok, sorry for taking so long, but took longer than I thought to raise the antenna. I have a friend that worked for our local utility distributor, he came over during slow time mixed with lunch and help with the antenna. I have the tip of the antenna about 130'. swr 1.04 nice. now the real test.
I keyed 27.700 AM and keyed the repeater with no problem, I really didnt need the repeater as i could talk simplex to just about everyone on that channel, but the guys further west I would have to use the repeater and them also. I talked on it for about an hour plus. learned a lot about why and how it works. Its not owned by 1 person but split up to 3 people. TX is loactaed at one location and the RX is at another. The RX isabout 7 mile away ran throw CAT5 to internet and back to the TX station then audio is ran with a mixer. they said a duplexer would be to costly and to big, not including the loss in db's. They pick the RX as nobody of he norm talks on it and normaly no skip. the squelch is set a little high to keep out low grade signals. One of the people that use the repeater is an elderly man that has been on for years and keeps the channel going, he uses the repeater sometime to talk as he cant talk to his one friend far away, so they both use it to when there out on the radio, A couple guys us the remote portion of the repeater as they dont have a base radio at all, this had me a little confused, but one guy uses his phone to talk to the repeater and the other uses a tablet and or laptop. I asked how I can use the remote, but I was told I would have to know how to run it and install software to run and be showed how to use it, also said they have to get to know me better. I dont think its easy, I might watch a few youtube videos first. they told me about the remote before, just didnt understand the depth of it. I think its a neat toy and be cool to see more linked to it. They said since its been running more and more people have been getting on the air, even thought they most dont use it.
I think it be a good thing if you lived in a place and couldnt have a big antenna, apt, townhouse, old fokes home, camping, its endless. Well im having fun now testing this new antenna, I went up 6s units to all my friend, height is king for sure.
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Old 08-21-2018, 5:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wska999 View Post
The five watt limitation still stands.
There has been no 5 Watt limit for CB for decades.

There is, however, a 4 Watt carrier limit for AM, and a 12 Watt PEP limit for SSB.

The "5 Watt" power specification was changed in the 1970's, I think it was 1976, but I am not sure of the exact year. Prior to then there was indeed a 5 Watt limit. This "reduction" to 4 Watts actually did not reduce the power output available to CBers appreciably, in fact in some cases it resulted in an increase in the allowable transmitted power.

The previous 5 Watt power limit was "input power". Power as determined by the DC power used by the final amplifier. The newer 4 Watt limit is output power, defined as measured RF power output based on an unmodulated carrier.

Depending on the amplifier design its efficiency might be anything from about 30% to about 80%. If your PA was near the low end, say 30%, the old 5 Watt input limit would mean your carrier power output would only be about 1.5 Watts. If your efficiency was about 80% your allowable RF output (from 5 Watts input) would be about 4 Watts.

Most CB PAs of the day were in the range of 40 70% efficient, in later years 80% (using Class C) was on the rise. This means that the output power of a properly adjusted CB, measured as it would be today, was from about 2 to 4 Watts.

After the regulation change all CBs could legally have the same output power, 4 Watts carrier power, regardless of amplifier design. This now allowed for some interesting applications of very high linearity amplifier designs without having to pay an output power penalty.

T!
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Old 08-22-2018, 10:59 AM
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Hello "Token"
we wherent talking about power on the cb but about the repeater thats on it, but your half right about the power on cb, This is what you can only do, and this is stated by the FCC:
Channel (MHz) Transmitter power (carrier power)
Watts
27.255, 25w
26.995-27.195, 4w
72-76, 0.75w
(d) CB. Your CB station transmitter power output must not exceed the following values under any
conditions: AM (A3)--4 watts (carrier power) SSB--12 watts (peak envelope power).
and for amplifiers:
95.313 May I use power amplifiers?
(a) You may not attach the following items (power amplifiers) to your certificated CB transmitter in any
way:
(1) External radio frequency (RF) power amplifiers (sometimes called linears or linear amplifiers); or
(2) Any other devices which, when used with a radio transmitter as a signal source, are capable of
amplifying the signal.
(b) There are no exceptions to this rule and use of a power amplifier voids your authority to operate the
station.
(c) The FCC will presume you have used a linear or other external RF power amplifier if--
(1) It is in your possession or on your premises; and
(2) There is other evidence that you have operated your CB station with more power than allowed..
(d) Paragraph (c) of this section does not apply if you hold a license in another radio service which
allows you to operate an external RF power amplifier.

so no amps aloud of yet.
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Old 08-22-2018, 12:48 PM
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He wasn't referring to an external amplifier. Every radio, regardless of power output, has a power amplifier (PA) in the circuitry. That is what Token is referring to.

John
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Old 08-22-2018, 1:23 PM
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but you still cant run more that 4w on AM cb, so its still regulated. there is a section that takes about erp watts but doesnt give the erp wattage.
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