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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2016, 1:17 PM
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Originally Posted by kayn1n32008 View Post
So exactly where is the 'right' to stream public safety comms enshrined in the constitution? Also where is the 'right' to listen to listen to 2way radio communications, not intended for you to be a recipient enshrined in the constitution?
Because government is not a living thing, it hasn't any rights; only privileges afforded it by the People. The First Amendment clearly protects the right of a free press. Who is the press? It theoretically can be seen as every potential individual. There's a big push right now to control the First Amendment if you haven't noticed. The short answer to your question is, the First Amendment of the Constitution of the United States. Failing that, the plethora of unenumerated inalienable individual rights pretty much covers it. Government entities are carrying out day-to-day operations under the privilege of government authority. Individuals are listening under the authority of their own individual rights. Trust me, you do not want a completely closed off government. Watch what happens with public records, fair trials, etc.

You want tyranny because this is how we get tyrants.

I am going to try to not further derail this thread as I think the OP is paramount!

Last edited by Hans13; 12-13-2016 at 1:43 PM.. Reason: Cleaned up a couple of typos. Content unchanged.
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2016, 1:18 PM
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"having our radio traffic broadcast in real-time has created a serious threat to officer safety,"
What a marvelous declaration. Perhaps you should agree with him--and insist that the city itself immediately cease all real-time broadcasting (i.e., their own dispatching) as it has been determined to be a public safety threat.
That's only logical, right? (sigh)

I think they're barking at the wrong dog, Broadcastify would only be bound by FCC regulation in this matter. And perhaps the initial response should be to enquire first, what they think their basis of jurisdiction is (since you are not residents or citizens of their burb), and second, what FCC regulation they think you are violating.

If they can't answer those two...odds are it will cost you a fast twenty grand to show up in court, but their failure to answer should earn them a charge of frivolous suit, and earn you a fast dismissal with costs plus penalties. Good luck.

And don't forget, the FCC itself tends to have words for any person or agency attempting to usurp the FCC exclusive authority to regulate radio matters. "Papa spank".(G)
  #23 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2016, 1:19 PM
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Originally Posted by kayn1n32008 View Post
So you are not going to answer the question then?
I did answer, you just haven't read it yet. Please, let's not take this thread off of the topic of the potential injunction.
  #24 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2016, 1:23 PM
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Honestly you can fight this letter until your Broadcastify people are blue in the face. If this feed is not taken down then the city will have no choice to just

ENCRYPT everything including the FIRE Department too. This is the permanent fix to this nagging on-going safety issues that the Police and Fire Departments are starting to complain about.

Trust me once they Encrypt then the problem completely goes away forever. In SOCAL all agencies are doing it now and it continues at a high rate of speed too.

Trust me it sucks and it blows big time because I love the hobby but its the climate of weirdo people in the world and terroists running our country ragged. Plus the technology is way up to speed and its built into the radio systems now. It's a no brainer for departments just to upgrade and flip the switch remotely and all of the radios are now programmed on the fly.

This hobby is going bye bye because scanner manufacturers have no way of keeping up with technology at this point. It's impossible and this is the near of the end on what scanners can do at this point.

ENCRYPTION has stopped scanner companies right in their tracks. Its a dead end road. There is no way around it and never will with encryption laws.
  #25 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2016, 1:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kayn1n32008 View Post
So exactly where is the 'right' to stream public safety comms enshrined in the constitution? Also where is the 'right' to listen to listen to 2way radio communications, not intended for you to be a recipient enshrined in the constitution?
it could be said since that radio system is paid for by tax payers. (ie the people) it is the peoples 2 way radio system and we have a right to listen to the system we the people own. to be frank, government should not be allowed to use encryption on any radio system that WE pay for. if they do not want us to listen, then they should find another way instead of stealing our money to pay for a system we are unable to listen to.
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Old 12-13-2016, 1:26 PM
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Default Broadcastify Receives Cease and Desist from Terre Haute, IN City Attorney

Quote:
Originally Posted by W2IBC View Post
it could be said since that radio system is paid for by tax payers. (ie the people) it is the peoples 2 way radio system and we have a right to listen to the system we the people own. to be frank, government should not be allowed to use encryption on any radio system that WE pay for. if they do not want us to listen, then they should find another way instead of stealing our money to pay for a system we are unable to listen to.


Then Take them to court and challenge their 'right' to encrypt. Let us know how that goes
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2016, 1:29 PM
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Folks, keep it on topic or we're going to start moderating this discussion.
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2016, 1:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kayn1n32008 View Post
Then Take them to court and challenge their 'right' to encrypt. Let us know how that goes
instead of being a internet smart ***, why not get a large group together and make it fact.

but i forget Americans are cowards these days.
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2016, 1:34 PM
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Originally Posted by NyGregg View Post
So what's to stop citizens from getting handheld scanners and listening and showing up at incidents? The next right we lose is scanning? Gov't is getting out of control.
+1

Additionally, anyone could stream with their own little server or any of the many other streaming platforms available. Even Zello it could be used.
  #30 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2016, 1:37 PM
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Honestly you know this is a real big "HOT BED" right now with streaming audio and departments nationwide encrypting all of their comms at the highest rate of speed in history. In the past 5 years this alarming rate of encryption is killing all of us and there is no turning back.

We all know this. Our hobby is loosing steam so bad right now that everybody that loves this hobby feels helpless and there is no fix at this point.

So as to the leader of RR.com and Broadcastify how are we going to get a handle on this and start to reverse the effects of this horrible disaster of departments locking us out nationwide?

Everybody is feeling real bad anxiety and stress because we are loosing ground so fast and honestly we just have no ground to stand on anymore. All of us are having to take the brunt of the storm and there is no turning back.
  #31 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2016, 1:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NyGregg View Post
So what's to stop citizens from getting handheld scanners and listening and showing up at incidents? The next right we lose is scanning? Gov't is getting out of control.
TH is a city that used to have OpenSky for everything. It was sort of amazing the THPD Dispatch wasn't encrypted from the beginning. Of course going to SAFE-T from their own OpenSky system was for interoperability.

Indiana has anti scanning laws for the general public (35-44.1-2-7. Unlawful use of a police radio.), that have exceptions for certain professions and for FCC Licensed Amateurs. There was case in Munice where Police tired to prosecute someone under these laws, but later dropped the charges. There's a locked thread in the Indiana section on the matter. IN defines a police radio as
Quote:
(c) As used in this section, “police radio” means a radio that is capable of sending or receiving signals transmitted on frequencies assigned by the Federal Communications Commission for police emergency purposes and that:
(1) can be installed, maintained, or operated in a vehicle; or
(2) can be operated while it is being carried by an individual.
The term does not include a radio designed for use only in a dwelling.
It appears that they don't want to (or cannot, with how I read the statute) go after people listening on phones the same as people listening on actual scanners. So instead they seem to want to harass the streaming source for some sort of threat of action. Considering this law has been repealed and repassed under 44.1 (used to be in plain old 44) the legislature has had the time to change it if they wanted, but the legislature didn't.

They can ask all they want, but I'm really curious to find out what legal basis they have to make a meritous claim or contention if they want to take it further than burning up city letterhead.
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2016, 1:46 PM
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Folks the answer is quite simple stop streaming and save our hobby !!
  #33 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2016, 1:51 PM
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Allend, if encryption ever becomes the norm, it will create an atmosphere in which people can bring grievance. As it stands right now there is less encrypted relative to all government traffic so the argument for transparency might be weaker. If most of government traffic is encrypted, I think it would ripen a case against government encryption. It's darkest before the dawn. My theory is let it get dark faster and dawn will soon follow.
  #34 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2016, 1:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mitbr View Post
Folks the answer is quite simple stop streaming and save our hobby !!
Cutting off ones nose to spite their face...

Streaming IS part of the "hobby."
  #35 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2016, 1:55 PM
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I expect this to be the first of many "take down orders". Possible ending in Broadcastify its self being taken down.

Welcome to Trump's America.
  #36 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2016, 2:24 PM
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I'm going to step way out on a limb, this is an easy battle to fight. The city can't point to one instance where the feeds put officer's lives in danger. You should cite the numerous times people listening to police scanning have HELPED the police. These instances outweigh the t imes people use police scanners to commit crimes!On the contrary maybe if the police knew people were listening maybe some police abuses of power would stop.

Also nice try pinning this on Trump, when in theory the FCC is indeed one of the LEAST political branches of government. ACTUALLY if you want to really go there, encryption has SKYROCKETED under President Obama,. So get your facts straight
  #37 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2016, 2:26 PM
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Here are the three scenarios that will happen.

A. Broadcastify fights the letter.

B. Broadcastify wins the battle because of Constitution rights

C. City and County then goes Encrypt everything. They win the war. Problem solved.
  #38 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2016, 2:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by allend View Post
Here are the three scenarios that will happen.

A. Broadcastify fights the letter.

B. Broadcastify wins the battle because of Constitution rights

C. City and County then goes Encrypt everything. They win the war. Problem solved.
BINGO you win the prize! Oh and we all loose our hobby.
  #39 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2016, 2:39 PM
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More and more the move is to computer communications alot of the time here in NE Ohio you can here the dispatch then not a lot of info about what going on. Then there is cell phones that get used alot
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Old 12-13-2016, 2:42 PM
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Interestingly enough, there are a lot of law enforcement agencies that value scanner listeners and their involvement in the community.

Go pull the archives from Broadcastify from the incident where the two Des Moines police officers that were ambushed and shot and killed on Nov 2nd 2016. The dispatchers pleaded for any scanner listeners that had any information to call them at a special phone number they set up. They literally broadcasted over the air for any scanner listeners that had any info to help.
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