supernoma
Member
La Salle fire dispatch calls themselves this, anybody have an idea why?
Xjf493
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supernoma
Member
Why doesn't other stations do this?
ve1sef
Member
You ask a good question. When I joined the local VFD at home in 1974. It was drilled into I our heads
that at the start of any transmissions to use our "call sign"
"XJH-535 Mobile 3 this is XJH-535 Base".
I've been a Ham Operator since 1994, and I am required to use my call sign, when I transmit.
However, in recent years I have noticed that this regulation is being ignored by a lot of dispatch centers.
So, if you hear a mobile or base station using a call sign it means the users are operating in
accordance to regulations established by the CRTC and/or Industry Canada.
Incidently, this is why AM/FM stations and TV networks usually identify themselves every 30 minutes
or so.
that at the start of any transmissions to use our "call sign"
"XJH-535 Mobile 3 this is XJH-535 Base".
I've been a Ham Operator since 1994, and I am required to use my call sign, when I transmit.
However, in recent years I have noticed that this regulation is being ignored by a lot of dispatch centers.
So, if you hear a mobile or base station using a call sign it means the users are operating in
accordance to regulations established by the CRTC and/or Industry Canada.
Incidently, this is why AM/FM stations and TV networks usually identify themselves every 30 minutes
or so.
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I don't know if it is a case of being ignored, per sa. The regulations also permit the callsign to be transmitted via morse at the repeater. Most of the repeaters in use now, will transmit the callsign in morse by default.
But there are still a lot of radio users that don't do either and IC doesn't have the resources to hunt them down.
But there are still a lot of radio users that don't do either and IC doesn't have the resources to hunt them down.
Just for those who haven't read the regs on call sign usage, here is an exerpt from RIC-15:
4. Call Sign
All radio stations require some form of identification during radiocommunications. Although Industry Canada requires that land stations in all services be assigned specific call signs, this is not required for many types of mobile stations. For example, mobile stations operating in the aeronautical mobile and maritime mobile services are often identified only by their respective aircraft or vessel registration numbers. Whereas in the case of mobile stations operating in the land mobile service, most are identified simply by using the name of the licensee, followed by the mobile’s fleet number.
5. Acceptable Methods Which Can Be Used for Identification
The following two methods can be used to identify a radio station:
1. manual calling procedure; and
2. automatic identification.
5.1 Manual Calling Procedure
One way to identify a station is to incorporate the assigned call sign in the station’s calling procedure.
Examples of the calling procedure are:
1. Base station calling a mobile station - “Mobile 2, this is ABC123” (where ABC123 is the call sign assigned to the base station).
2. Mobile station calling the base station - “ABC123, this is Mobile 2”.
3. Mobile station calling another mobile station - “Mobile 3, this is ACME Mobile 2” (where ACME Ltd. is the licensee).
When radio operators are familiar with the correct calling procedure, it can be shortened by dropping the phrase “This is”. However, for the abbreviated calling procedure to be effective, all radio operators must use the same calling format; the call sign of the station being called followed by the call sign of the calling station. Uniformity and consistency in following this procedure will avoid any confusion as to who is being called.
5.2 Automatic Identification
Incorporating the call sign in the radio operator’s calling procedure is an effective way of identifying the station. However, this form of identification is not suitable for all users. For example, because of a busy operational environment, a taxi dispatcher may find it impossible to state the station’s call sign every time he/she transmits to a mobile. As well, digital radio systems or repeater stations which automatically relay transmissions between stations do not have radio operators calling other stations. For stations that do not have a radio operator or for the convenience of radio operators, automatic identification using digitally stored or taped voice messages or Morse code can be used. Devices that will automatically transmit the assigned call sign in Morse code by modulating the transmitter at a lower level than normal are commercially available. Most of these devices are acceptable to the Department under the current regulations.
Optimum technical characteristics for Morse code identification are:
- a transmission speed of 20 wpm;
- an audio tone of 1 kHz for amplitude modulation; and
- a 1 kHz tone with +2 kHz deviation for frequency and phase modulations.
The addition of automatic identification equipment must not alter the performance of the radio equipment with respect to the Radio Standards Specification under which it was approved. No additional radio station licence application or fee is required for the use of automatic identification equipment.
4. Call Sign
All radio stations require some form of identification during radiocommunications. Although Industry Canada requires that land stations in all services be assigned specific call signs, this is not required for many types of mobile stations. For example, mobile stations operating in the aeronautical mobile and maritime mobile services are often identified only by their respective aircraft or vessel registration numbers. Whereas in the case of mobile stations operating in the land mobile service, most are identified simply by using the name of the licensee, followed by the mobile’s fleet number.
5. Acceptable Methods Which Can Be Used for Identification
The following two methods can be used to identify a radio station:
1. manual calling procedure; and
2. automatic identification.
5.1 Manual Calling Procedure
One way to identify a station is to incorporate the assigned call sign in the station’s calling procedure.
Examples of the calling procedure are:
1. Base station calling a mobile station - “Mobile 2, this is ABC123” (where ABC123 is the call sign assigned to the base station).
2. Mobile station calling the base station - “ABC123, this is Mobile 2”.
3. Mobile station calling another mobile station - “Mobile 3, this is ACME Mobile 2” (where ACME Ltd. is the licensee).
When radio operators are familiar with the correct calling procedure, it can be shortened by dropping the phrase “This is”. However, for the abbreviated calling procedure to be effective, all radio operators must use the same calling format; the call sign of the station being called followed by the call sign of the calling station. Uniformity and consistency in following this procedure will avoid any confusion as to who is being called.
5.2 Automatic Identification
Incorporating the call sign in the radio operator’s calling procedure is an effective way of identifying the station. However, this form of identification is not suitable for all users. For example, because of a busy operational environment, a taxi dispatcher may find it impossible to state the station’s call sign every time he/she transmits to a mobile. As well, digital radio systems or repeater stations which automatically relay transmissions between stations do not have radio operators calling other stations. For stations that do not have a radio operator or for the convenience of radio operators, automatic identification using digitally stored or taped voice messages or Morse code can be used. Devices that will automatically transmit the assigned call sign in Morse code by modulating the transmitter at a lower level than normal are commercially available. Most of these devices are acceptable to the Department under the current regulations.
Optimum technical characteristics for Morse code identification are:
- a transmission speed of 20 wpm;
- an audio tone of 1 kHz for amplitude modulation; and
- a 1 kHz tone with +2 kHz deviation for frequency and phase modulations.
The addition of automatic identification equipment must not alter the performance of the radio equipment with respect to the Radio Standards Specification under which it was approved. No additional radio station licence application or fee is required for the use of automatic identification equipment.
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From what I've typically heard, most stations do this all the time. At least in my area. London Fire always identifies itself as XJI765, and when they dispatch county departments they are always identified by their callsign. Strathroy-Caradoc Fire also always identifies as XJH299. Strathroy Police aren't quite as consistent, but frequently identify as XJF794.
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I think most fire departments do, due to their level of dedication and professionalism. One of the few "radio professionals" out there. The radios are literaly their life line now and they will do anything to protect it. Regulations and all.
Callsigns...
Just as a followup, here is a list that I have of Middlesex County fire departments:
Location Callsign
Delaware XJK562
Kerwood XJK558
Oneida VE3042?
Ailsa Craig XJK573
Arva XJK557
Bryanston XLQ271
Coldstream XJH529
Dorchester XJK560
Glencoe XJK561
Granton XJK563
Ilderton XJI951
Lucan XKJ572
Melbourne XJH341
Mt. Brydges XJH340
Newbury XJK565
Parkhill XJK559
Strathroy XJH299
Thorndale XJK571
I also have a fairly complete list of apparatus that goes along with these stations if anyone is interested.
Just as a followup, here is a list that I have of Middlesex County fire departments:
Location Callsign
Delaware XJK562
Kerwood XJK558
Oneida VE3042?
Ailsa Craig XJK573
Arva XJK557
Bryanston XLQ271
Coldstream XJH529
Dorchester XJK560
Glencoe XJK561
Granton XJK563
Ilderton XJI951
Lucan XKJ572
Melbourne XJH341
Mt. Brydges XJH340
Newbury XJK565
Parkhill XJK559
Strathroy XJH299
Thorndale XJK571
I also have a fairly complete list of apparatus that goes along with these stations if anyone is interested.
It is too bad that some radio operators were either improperly trained or to unable to comprehend the procedures. I work in the maintenance dept and we often call our airplanes on their way in or out of the base to see if everything is working OK or what time he expects to be in. There is one guy in another department that also has a radio. I will call out the flight number like "5649, Maintenance". If they don't answer in like two milliseconds, this guy with the other radio will come on and say " Go ahead 5649, I don't think maintenance is there". I will then call again "5649, this is Maintenance" thinking adding the assumed part back in will clue him in, but I will often hear "5649, this is _______ dept, what do you need?" Then I just tell him "Frank, this is Joe in maintenance, I am trying to call the flight, get off the radio". Then I get a "Oh sorry, I thought they were trying to call me". It is amazing how many times that scenario has played out.
All the departments in southern Durham region used to do this when we were all on the VHF frequencies in the 1980s. Pickering Control XJH346, Ajax XJI43, Whitby XJH409, Oshawa XJI72, and I forget the rest except that Caesarea and Clarington did tests with Pickering once a week.
I remember those..
I also remember when Bowmanville Fire, now Clarington, used to do their tests with Oshawa and Nortumberland Fire on 154.40 MHz.
Ah the good old days.
I also remember when Bowmanville Fire, now Clarington, used to do their tests with Oshawa and Nortumberland Fire on 154.40 MHz.
Ah the good old days.
Niagara Falls Fire Dept - XJF300
Niagara Regional Police - XJF933
Niagara Parks Police - XJF950
Welland Fire Dept - XJF289
Niagara Regional Police - XJF933
Niagara Parks Police - XJF950
Welland Fire Dept - XJF289
XJF933 to all cars, all units on Operations Channel 3, special attention 3111, keep observation for a...
hehe, that's dating myself some
Port Colborne FD - XJH200
St Catharines FD - XJI81
Attention attention, this is XJF300 Niagara Falls...
By the way, why did Stations 2 and 3 *always* have to acknowledge even if it wasn't their call? lol..one way of making sure they stay awake I spose!
hehe, that's dating myself some
Port Colborne FD - XJH200
St Catharines FD - XJI81
Attention attention, this is XJF300 Niagara Falls...
By the way, why did Stations 2 and 3 *always* have to acknowledge even if it wasn't their call? lol..one way of making sure they stay awake I spose!
XJF933 to all cars, all units on Operations Channel 3, special attention 3111, keep observation for a...
hehe, that's dating myself some
Port Colborne FD - XJH200
St Catharines FD - XJI81
Attention attention, this is XJF300 Niagara Falls...
By the way, why did Stations 2 and 3 *always* have to acknowledge even if it wasn't their call? lol..one way of making sure they stay awake I spose!
yes thats it, makes sure at least one Firefighter stays awake,
stations 1 and 2 - station alarms activate with each call, even the volunteer calls, the "probie" or junior Firefighter answers the base radio.... "2 roger" "3 roger"
Peel Police announce their callsign (XJK706)occasionally, usually when they are doing an announcement or all-call.
Canada's Wonderland announces their callsign (VCO911) when the park opens in the morning, and in the evening when the park is swept, and again when dispatch signs off for the night.
There are many other examples, I just can't remember them.
Canada's Wonderland announces their callsign (VCO911) when the park opens in the morning, and in the evening when the park is swept, and again when dispatch signs off for the night.
There are many other examples, I just can't remember them.
69stiles
Member
Around Waterloo Region it is not used on the trunk system but if dispatch calls a neighbouring county on the VHF back up then it is used. XJJ24 Kitchener
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