Johns Creek PD

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alex4659

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JCPD Dispatch seems to be encrypted while the units are in the clear.

Has anyone else notice this?
 

CFDQ1

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I noticed this yesterday as I was passing through. Didn't know if it was a recent change or had been in affect.
 

alex4659

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I noticed this yesterday as I was passing through. Didn't know if it was a recent change or had been in affect.

It's recent as I have been listening for a while and then about a month ago, I noticed garbled (encrypted) transmissions from the dispatcher.

I wonder if they will stay like this or eventually, hopefully not, *knocks on wood* ALL talk groups will be encrypted.
 

genemalet

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If you pull the Fulton County database that carries Johns creek. You will also get the Fulton County SWAT and Fulton County Jail that is encrypted. You have to avoid those channels. JCPD is not encrypted.
 

DanRollman

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JCPD is not encrypted.

You sure you are listening to JCPD? They have definitely migrated to being mostly-encrypted. As noted above, exactly who and how many subscribers are using encryption can vary from day to day (perhaps encryption mode is still selectable by the subscriber and they aren't doing it consistently yet). But it is clear to me that most users on JCPD dispatch channel are now encrypted most of the time.

As a recent sample, yesterday and this morning the dispatcher was encrypted and most units were encrypted, but at least one patrol officer was transmitting un-encrypted and could be heard.

JCFD continues to operate without encryption.

Dan
 

genemalet

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Well that sucks. I just heard them 2 days ago. Have the scanner going now and heard dispatch for a few seconds and blank. Wonder what type of encryption they are using.
 

N8IAA

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Do you folks actual understand the way the MODE column works in the database? Float your cursor over the mode and it will show the modes.
When it shows 'De', encryption is used randomly. If it shows 'DE', it means fully encrypted.
Or, it should. GA has one of the worst entries on this site.
Larry
 

genemalet

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N8IAA, Obviously I didn't but you had to call that out.

HEY EVERYONE, I didn't know the way the mode column works!!!

Very cool....

Thanks for the info though...
 

DanRollman

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When it shows 'De', encryption is used randomly. If it shows 'DE', it means fully encrypted.

To be clear, 'De' doesn't mean encryption is used randomly. It just means partial (not full-time/permanent) encryption. JCPD is listed as De for just that reason. For now, we are hearing lots of encryption, but we are still hearing some transmissions (a minority at this point) in the clear.

GA has one of the worst entries on this site.

Eagerly awaiting your submissions where you think the site has a bad entry in the Mode column. Remember, the information on the site is only as accurate as user submissions.
 

N8IAA

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To be clear, 'De' doesn't mean encryption is used randomly. It just means partial (not full-time/permanent) encryption. JCPD is listed as De for just that reason. For now, we are hearing lots of encryption, but we are still hearing some transmissions (a minority at this point) in the clear.



Eagerly awaiting your submissions where you think the site has a bad entry in the Mode column. Remember, the information on the site is only as accurate as user submissions.

To be clear, I understand what the De stands for. Not all did.
I stopped submitting years ago because of RR members making comments about what was heard on sensitive TG's, then going quiet or encrypted. So, don't hold your breath, Dan, waiting on my submissions. It isn't going to happen. My listening pleasure hasn't diminished.
But, I do search and research. A lost art in the past few years.
Larry
Oh, and I didn't mean in the MODE department, I was referring to the overall GA database being out of date and confusing.
 
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ButchGone

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I’ll echo the sentiment, that the Georgia database is lacking. For example, I have submitted info for GSP/state law enforcement a couple of times but it was never posted in the data base. So I’ll be the first to admit I stopped submitting because of that. As long as someone is a gate keeper who decides what people should know, or not, there is no point in sharing info with what I thought was an open forum.
BG..
 

genemalet

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I would like to know what type of encryption is Johns Creek using as this is something we all need to make sure to not support.? Whos crazy idea was it to switch. I am sure that there is some real top secret stuff going on in this community. Scanning fun has diminished however I can still listen to the Sherriff, FD and wow, public works!! But others may feel its needed however in my opinion takes the fun out of scanning since I have been doing for over 30 years. The people that ruin it for us will ruin the hobby.
 
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MTS2000des

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I would like to know what type of encryption is Johns Creek using?

Why? It is against Federal and Georgia law to attempt to defeat encryption.

Whos crazy idea was it to switch.

My employer prohibits me from discussing specific details of what users do, but suffice it to say it is not a "crazy idea" to secure communications. I know many in the scanner community lack this understanding, but due a variety of reasons, including the progression of technology, encryption and securing of communications systems is going to continue to evolve in this and many regions over the next few years.

With FirstNET being adopted by all 50 states, encrypted and secured voice and data are the way forward.
 

genemalet

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Why? It is against Federal and Georgia law to attempt to defeat encryption.



First off no one said anyone was attempting to defeat encryption, secondly It was fun to listen to my local police and know whats going on in the community however now I guess we will have to find a different hobby thanks to this. If they need to make it private, make a phone call.
 
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MTS2000des

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First off no one said anyone was attempting to defeat encryption,

Than why ask what is being used? Asking about things like the type of encryption used on our radio systems gets attention from folks who operate these systems such as myself.

Think about it, it's like asking on a public forum what kind of locks are used on the front door of your house.

secondly It was fun to listen to my local police and know whats going on in the community however now I guess we will have to find a different hobby thanks to this.

The purpose of public safety radio systems are not to provide entertainment. They are to provide life safety communications for their users.

The fact that you could listen in the past was by nature of the technology in use. That is changing, and for the better of the safety and efficiency of the users.

If they need to make it private, make a phone call.

Why when modern digital wireless makes it possible to enjoy the same secure communications you use everyday such as encrypted WiFi, email, and cellular/PCS/AWS. All of these are encrypted by nature and design. You aren't complaining because you can't sniff the encrypted LTE or WiFi connections of police MCTs but somehow radio is different because it's your source of entertainment?

You need to get past the fact that LMR has been stuck in the past and now is starting to catch up.
 

genemalet

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Washington, D.C., officials switched off the encryption for fire communications. The move came after firefighters had problems using their radios in a subway tunnel during an emergency response. The tunnel filled with smoke because of an electrical malfunction, killing one person and sickening dozens more.
The Metro transit agency, which had a radio system in the subway that allowed below-ground communications by city firefighters, said the radio problems were the result of the fire department changing its own radio system, including adding encryption, without telling the transit agency. City officials denied encryption caused the problems.

I would sure hate a mass emergency and encryption caused communication failures which caused lost lives.

While encryption protects privacy and prevents criminals from tracking police movement, it works best for preplanned tactical or staged situations and is no longer ideal for emergency situations.

Some police and fire departments are bucking a trend to conceal dispatch communications from the public, acknowledging that radio encryption has the potential to backfire and put first responders in danger.
Agencies with digital radio systems have turned off the encryption to their main dispatching channels and others have decided not to turn it on. They say their officers and firefighters may not be heard during emergencies by responders at neighboring departments with radio systems that either don’t have access to their encrypted channels or aren’t advanced enough to have encryption capability.

Also taxpayers will move to area where they are not spending this type of money on a system that the public, news organizations want to be alerted when major events happen.

This practice withholds crucial information about emergency situations from the public.... period.

You and several others will never agree so my final word. Dont bother responding because I wont read your posts anymore. Not interested in your view.
 

MTS2000des

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Washington, D.C., officials switched off the encryption for fire communications.

Old news. Not germane at all.

While encryption protects privacy and prevents criminals from tracking police movement, it works best for preplanned tactical or staged situations and is no longer ideal for emergency situations.

Problem with this logic is any call can become a tactical call. Las Vegas comes to mind. Boston comes to mind.

Also taxpayers will move to area where they are not spending this type of money on a system that the public, news organizations want to be alerted when major events happen.

Encryption is now included on just about every vendor's P-25 subscriber radio. It's 2018. AES-256 is now the mandated standard. Even Motorola is including it on all APX subscriber radios they are shipping. No additional money gets spent. It's just enabled at time of initial subscriber programming.

I seriously doubt people are moving out of your area because of this. Statistics show they are moving there in high numbers. You did.

You and several others will never agree so my final word. Dont bother responding because I wont read your posts anymore. Not interested in your view.

The fact that you mentioned "several others" demonstrates you've been presented with the facts I have and you refuse to be reasonable and listen. So, that being said...

Your mentality is why many in the business run far, far away from amateur radio operators. Your attitude goes very far to break down relationships between amateur radio operators and public safety officials. You really need to rethink your position. That is, if you care about anything other than being entertained.
 
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D

dnathedvman

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I am newer to the scanning community here in Georgia and have been mostly a reader of these posts until I ran across this one. I had to sign up and respond.

I have been in community service for 30 years, retired. All I have to say that this is the craziest thing I have heard.

This is a hobby and a legal hobby by the way. But this guys MTS, wannabe stadium cop makes it sound like its something we abuse and wants to ruin it for all of us scanning enthusiasts.

I am not going to get into the whys, whos and what's as I am an old man. I can tell you, what this guy is doing is trying to make people who enjoy the hobby or listen to the area happenings look bad. I am 78 years old, I use this as my hobby and it keeps me feeling safe in my environment!! Go push your radio encryption to the FBI and all that other stuff. Leave the local scanning alone!
Just my opinion.
 

ButchGone

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There is no reason why fire departments need to encrypt radio transmissions. I asked a representative of a local emergency services agency why they chose to encrypt all fire traffic, and he said it was for the safety of firefighters.when I asked why he thinks unencrypted radios pose a danger to firefighters, he could not answer. Finally, he admitted, it’s to keep the public from hearing what’s goin on. That’s what’s goin on, along with Motorola pushing this on customers.
BG..
 
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