San Bernardino 6/7 Red Channel?

[jlanfn]

Over the past few months I have been hearing traffic on System 6/7 on what was once called the "7-CHASE" talkgroup. Each time the traffic originated from the San Bernardino Sheriff dispatching console that normally handles 6-WTac-1 and 7-ETac-1. The traffic would always be a "be on the look out" for a call that SBSO was working. Occasionally a dispatcher from another agency would respond asking questions about the BOL. This lead me to believe that the "7-CHASE" channel was actually a patch to some kind of intercom channel.

Last night I heard the SBSO dispatcher say something like "LASO and CHP on the Red channel..." There was no response.

Does this kind of traffic ring a bell for anyone? If it is a "Red channel," it surely can't be the same Red channel discussed in this thread.

I updated the database to reflect the actual channel usage since the talkgroup certainly isn't used for pursuits anymore.

 

[f40ph]

I think that talkgroup is patched to the "universal" conventional 800mhz RED listed in the Database but I can't confirm from where I live.

 

[jlanfn]

I think that talkgroup is patched to the "universal" conventional 800mhz RED listed in the Database but I can't confirm from where I live.

The one listed in the database (868.8625) is the one mentioned in the thread I linked to in the first post. I have monitored that channel for years and it is never used. I don't even know why it is in the database, since it isn't "confirmed" data. It certainly didn't carry any traffic at the same time as the 6/7 talkgroup did, so it couldn't be patched to that.

 

[f40ph]

Spoke to someone "in the know" and found out some things:
Normally conventional site "RED" is left patched on the Supervisor console in SBSD dispatch to the trunking talkgroup "7-RED". We keyed up the conventional site just fine and got squelch tail. However, while monitoring 7-RED on another radio, the patch did not come through (same as you observed). What happens is this: whenever the trunking system goes into failsoft for any reason, even for very short times, the console patch drops out. If no one notices, they get left unpatched for days? on end.

 

[dropkick]

Spoke to someone "in the know" and found out some things:
Normally conventional site "RED" is left patched on the Supervisor console in SBSD dispatch to the trunking talkgroup "7-RED". We keyed up the conventional site just fine and got squelch tail. However, while monitoring 7-RED on another radio, the patch did not come through (same as you observed). What happens is this: whenever the trunking system goes into failsoft for any reason, even for very short times, the console patch drops out. If no one notices, they get left unpatched for days? on end.

Confirmed. There are two RED's, one conventional, one a talkgroup. The reason is some agencies got smart... The "Red" program, for lack of a better name, was a grant funded venture that bought everyone new radios to use for the "RED" channel, but no one ever used them. The idea was to have a 2nd radio like OC that's always tuned to RED. Not a bad idea, just the ball was dropped here in SB. So someone figured out they could make up a new talk group called 7-RED. This makes the auditors of the grant happy, as long as it says RED somewhere in the list of channels, and the agencies could then use the brand new radios as regular trunked units.

btw the patch is down again no one uses it cause dispatchers just use the telco based intercom channel.

 

[jlanfn]

btw the patch is down again no one uses it cause dispatchers just use the telco based intercom channel.

It's interesting you say that because I thought the envisioned "RED Channel" was supposed to be so much more that just an intercom channel. It was primarily to be used for coordination between subscriber units in the field, especially with those who did not already have access to the county's 800 MHz systems.

Since that effort obviously never came to fruition, it's surprising that they even bothered to establish the patch at all. If everyone who needed it already had access to the intercom channel, who was the patch intended to benefit? Also, wouldn't it be two patches, one between the intercom channel and the 7-RED talkgroup, and one between the 7-RED talkgroup and the conventional RED channel? Which patch is down?

I think at one point the county was licensed for a P25-capable conventional RED channel repeater at San Sevaine. The original license was for an analog repeater at Skyland. Is either one of those currently operational (online)?

 

[f40ph]

It's interesting you say that because I thought the envisioned "RED Channel" was supposed to be so much more that just an intercom channel. It was primarily to be used for coordination between subscriber units in the field, especially with those who did not already have access to the county's 800 MHz systems.

I think at one point the county was licensed for a P25-capable conventional RED channel repeater at San Sevaine. The original license was for an analog repeater at Skyland. Is either one of those currently operational (online)?

Subscribers in other counties come in via the conventional analog RED 800mhz repeater pair at Skyland (and it does key up). Subscribers of the 800mhz Motorola trunking system within SBCo can use the 7-RED talkgroup. With only a couple mouse-clicks, the dispatcher can set up the patch if there's anything going on. The fundamental problem (as I understand it) is you can't plan to have one "master" mutual aid channel for disaster or terrorism situations. It will simply get overloaded and become worthless. The fire service learned this years ago - the larger the incident or fire gets, the more tactical channels that get allocated to different divisions of the incident.

 

[dropkick]

Yes the conventional repeater is still on the air in the valley (the freq in the database is correct). I dunno if it's P25 capable or not but right now it's analog. No one uses either channel at this time. The only reason it still exists in any form is to satisfy grant auditors and I understand that requirement is ending within a year so it will probably just become a piece of history until someone else decides "Hey, we should have a RED channel" at which time the newbies will cheer, the old timers will roll their eyes, and more money will be spent on something we already had. And the cycle repeats.

Yes, it was a good idea for BOLO's, broadcasts, announcements, etc, and that's what other counties use theirs for. It was never meant mutual aid or specific incidents (I understand OC does use theirs for pursuits but I don't listen to them and someone else might confirm that). We have CHASE and FGND's for that. BOLOs now come over the intercoms and then dispatchers can re-broadcast them if they choose or dept policy dictates they do so.