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Harris / MA/COM / GE / Ericsson Forum - For general discussion of MA/COM EDACS and ProVoice systems, including equipment.

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Old 07-06-2017, 9:00 AM
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Default P7100ip "INV SYS" cause

M/A-COM P7100ip. I can write to it, and read back what I programmed in the codeplug. But when I power it up after programming, the name of the first system shows up for a split second, then I see "INV SYS" in the display. And it won't do anything else after that.
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Old 07-06-2017, 11:15 AM
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You have programmed it for something you don't have a feature for (encryption, edacs, p25, etc)

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
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Old 07-06-2017, 11:45 AM
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You have programmed it for something you don't have a feature for (encryption, edacs, p25, etc)

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Yep, I did some checking and I discovered I bought a radio that was supposed to support P25 trunking, but it turns out it doesn't.
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Old 07-06-2017, 3:00 PM
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The seller should disclose the active features. In order for P25 trunking to work, you need #39 feature at lease.
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Old 07-06-2017, 3:08 PM
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Yes; the listing did indicate feature #39. The seller says he sent me the wrong radio, and will send the correct one out to me.
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Old 07-08-2017, 10:25 PM
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You get the INV SYS message any time you have something programmed into the radio that is not supported by its feature set.

This even includes having more systems, talkgroups, or conventional channels in your profile than the radio allows.
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Old 07-09-2017, 6:34 AM
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I've seen a ton of conv only M7100s on FleeceBay recently, surplus from Washington State Patrol (You can tell by dual PTT on mic)... and the sellers listing them as P25 *capable* and P25 Trunking *capable* and neglecting to mention the $700 fee to activate said features... Even AFTER being corrected about the capabilities.....
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Old 07-09-2017, 4:07 PM
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There's a seller in Poland that has a bunch of these for sale, he claims that "all features are active". Is this even possible? Sounds like a hack.
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Old 07-11-2017, 6:15 PM
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Hello, i am from Poland too.

I bought one radio from this seller on the UHF band. The radio actually has all the features unlocked. Radio with F9 DSP work in AES encryption and Unencrypted. If You wanna use DES, need load another DSP file to radio. He programming all radios RPM R10B. Worth buying. Is not a scam.
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Old 07-11-2017, 6:47 PM
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Yes it is possible for all features to be active on a P7100. Those radios are usually radios that were used for demonstration or engineering purposes. They're scarce, but not THAT scarce.

One nice thing about the P5100/P7100 family of radios is that if you know what you're doing, you can transfer the feature set from a radio to another. Say you have a UHF low split radio (useless!) with a desirable feature set, and a VHF radio you only WISH had those features. Well, the features CAN be
swapped between the two radios but it requires someone who is adept with a soldering iron and also knows how to use the radio maintenance tools. The ESN chips need to be swapped and the feature strings, too.
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Old 07-11-2017, 6:57 PM
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With P7200 radio cant swap ESN chip?
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Old 07-12-2017, 3:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElroyJetson View Post
Yes it is possible for all features to be active on a P7100. Those radios are usually radios that were used for demonstration or engineering purposes. They're scarce, but not THAT scarce.

One nice thing about the P5100/P7100 family of radios is that if you know what you're doing, you can transfer the feature set from a radio to another. Say you have a UHF low split radio (useless!) with a desirable feature set, and a VHF radio you only WISH had those features. Well, the features CAN be
swapped between the two radios but it requires someone who is adept with a soldering iron and also knows how to use the radio maintenance tools. The ESN chips need to be swapped and the feature strings, too.
There are a few people out there who have beaten the feature set encryption, too. Those show up on eBay occasionally.
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Old 07-12-2017, 9:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by baskom View Post
With P7200 radio cant swap ESN chip?

Short Answer: NO, not on 7200 or newer.
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Old 07-13-2017, 5:26 PM
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If the FES has been beaten, it's sure news to me!

I'd like to know more about that....



Every radio from the 7200 and newer has a different way of putting the features into the radio, so no, the same method can not be used to swap features over. It became a lot more complicated and maybe even impossible unless the donor and recipient radios are both of the same model and in the same RF band. Why would you even want or need to swap features between two radios in the same band anyway?
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Old 07-13-2017, 5:56 PM
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Well I see a eBay seller selling Harris RPM software and feature upgrades right now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElroyJetson View Post
If the FES has been beaten, it's sure news to me!

I'd like to know more about that....



Every radio from the 7200 and newer has a different way of putting the features into the radio, so no, the same method can not be used to swap features over. It became a lot more complicated and maybe even impossible unless the donor and recipient radios are both of the same model and in the same RF band. Why would you even want or need to swap features between two radios in the same band anyway?
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Old 07-14-2017, 7:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElroyJetson View Post

...Say you have a UHF low split radio (useless!) with a desirable feature set,

I wouldn't say totally useless. They are great for monitoring FED/Mil traffic, and don't forget the 420-430 MHz Amateur Band. I, like a number of other hams started experimenting with FM in the bottom-end of 420 MHz, and put up [coordinated] repeaters. At the time, I thought it was a new idea, only to find out that there is a 420 repeater system in the Dallas-Fort Worth area that dates back to the 1970's that is still active!

I put up a local repeater in Lynchburg (VA) in 2001 on 420.050 out, 426.050 in (136.5 Hz tx & rx). In 2007 it was upgraded the Mastr3 to support P-25 (adding a DSP card to the shelf and reprogramming). Dual-mode, it supports both FM and P25. (NAC $293 tx & rx) There are other 420 repeaters, in Los Angeles (both P25) Dayton each year has several show up for the Hamvention, Washington DC, Raleigh, Miami, and elsewhere. Hams have started to discover this under-used segment of the band, and have been utilizing it in areas were ATV is not present. [Tests have demonstrated time and again that 5 kHz FM voice on 420 MHz can coexist with ATV, with no interference or harm to either mode !]

If you do a lot of Public Service Events, 420 has shown to be a handy place to "hide" from listeners, especially the MEDIA! Command Nets freely operate, as listeners see UHF radios, but never think to look outside of the 'normal' 440-450 MHz frequency range.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ElroyJetson View Post

One nice thing about the P5100/P7100 family of radios is that if you know what you're doing, you can transfer the feature set from a radio to another. Say you have a UHF low split radio (useless!) with a desirable feature set, and a VHF radio you only WISH had those features. Well, the features CAN be swapped between the two radios but it requires someone who is adept with a soldering iron and also knows how to use the radio maintenance tools. The ESN chips need to be swapped and the feature strings, too.
The practice of swapping ESN chips was the reason Harris changed how they serialize the radios starting with the M7200/P7200 product line around 2005. The ESN and Model ID code (portable system/scan/select tier) can be changed electronically, but the procedure is a closely held trade secret.

When the company discovered that Service Techs were swapping ESN chips when repairing radios, rather than upgrading the ESN of the radio's replacement Control/Logic Board, they were not amused.

On top of that, the practice of ESN swapping for mere upgrade was becoming known. (Hence the number of Aegis & ProVoice 35-50 radios on six meters and two meters! Especially among the Prepper folks.)

The Orion, M-RK, J700p, J725m, M7100 and P7100 all share the same exact ESN chip, their Feature Encryption structure is identical, and can therefore be freely swapped between radios.



My humble 2 worth...
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Old 07-14-2017, 11:50 AM
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When programming a Motorola P-25 trunked system on a M/A-COM P7100, do you need to enter only the control frequencies, or all frequencies?
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Old 07-14-2017, 2:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by richard630 View Post
Well I see a eBay seller selling Harris RPM software and feature upgrades right now.

That's all being done by purchasing from Harris,not hacking.
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Old 07-15-2017, 7:00 PM
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Quote:
When the company discovered that Service Techs were swapping ESN chips when repairing radios, rather than upgrading the ESN of the radio's replacement Control/Logic Board, they were not amused.
Oh, I'll just BET! I can imagine jaws hitting the floor the first time they got wind of that happening!

Though I'll be flipped if I can remember PRECISELY which one it is right now, but it's not hard to figure out, the entire codeplug can be moved from one radio to another by swapping out the right EPROM chip as well.

It even swaps over any encryption keys that haven't been zeroized. (FIPS-140, how does it work?)

Using this exact method I was able to recover ALL the data from a surplus radio that had been heavily damaged to include functional destruction of the main board.

I just took another board of the same type and swapped the DS2401 over as well as the relevant EPROM chip. The transplant recipient was very much alive, complete with ESK-enabled personality and encryption keys.

However the file was so utterly out of date that it was absolutely useless. It was a pre-deployment test file that was out of date before the agency put their first operating radios on the system.

But it was a fun repair anyway.

Back then, if there was ESK data in the radio, you could not view or save the data without ESK support in your programmer installation.

UNLESS...you changed ANY data in the radio. It was sufficient to change the display name of a single talkgroup. THEN you could view and save the file but even then only some data was viewable or editable.
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