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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2008, 10:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W9NES
Newsalan,Yes this is what we have been trying to tell everyone what is going on here.Thank You for waking up to the idea that now "IMPD is above the law and now they are using "Illegal radios" Duh? Now it is time to get something done about it instead of "Reading about it in the papers" Maybe the fcc needs to notified about this matter at hand along with Administration under the new mayor in Indianapolis/Marion County.Also the Public Safety Director needs to be informed with the City/County Council.
Could this be retaliation from receiving a citation?
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2008, 11:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W9NES
Newsalan, Yes this is what we have been trying to tell everyone what is going on here. Thank You for waking up to the idea that now "IMPD is above the law and now they are using "Illegal radios"
No where did I say IMPD was above the law. Yet, sometimes these things happen. You should hear police I-call conversations on Franklin County Ohio’s system. I don’t think you realize what you are hearing takes place in dozens of cities across the US; some are on I-call and most are probably on Nextel or Cell phones. I believe with your publicity, IMPD will soon be there as well. Nextel that is... Perhaps someone should enable the group function on Nextel for them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by W9NES
Duh? Now it is time to get something done about it instead of "Reading about it in the papers"
And no where did I say don’t do anything about it. I did say there is a proper way to go about it, posting on RR is not the best way to do so. Probably not wise either. IMHO

Quote:
Originally Posted by W9NES
Maybe the fcc needs to notified about this matter at hand along with Administration under the new mayor in Indianapolis/Marion County. Also the Public Safety Director needs to be informed with the City/County Council.
Feel free to notify the FCC and the Metro Government administration. Don’t let me stop you

AL
  #23 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2008, 3:26 PM
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I'm not saying what they're doing is right, but I'll bet it does provide for some interesting and colorful monitoring.
  #24 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2008, 3:49 PM
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Or, get on the air, and say "Hi"
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2008, 4:58 PM
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Departments are allowed Low Power access to ANY part 90 frequency, as long as they do not cause interference to the primary user. [Read: Not Scannists]

It occurs all the time.



Quote:
Originally Posted by baw352
Yeah, there are frequencies in the 156.xxx area of the band for assignment to the public safety agencies. Just because they are assignable doesn't mean you can hijack them for use whenever you want. You still have to obtain a license from the FCC for them and use a type accepted radio.


The biggest problem I have is there is a well known use of modified amateur radios being used by officers for tac channels. The admin knows this and does nothing.

From my understanding there has been offical complaints to uncle sam in the past but there isn't enough resources to enforce it.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2008, 5:11 PM
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That's VERY incorrect.
  #27 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2008, 5:20 PM
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http://frwebgate2.access.gpo.gov/cgi...ction=retrieve

Page 269

(5) A Police licensee may use transmitters on the frequencies
indicated below in connection with official police activities without
specific authorization from the Commission, provided that such use shall
be on a secondary basis and shall not cause harmful interference to
services of other licensees operating on regularly assigned frequencies,
and further provided that all such use complies with the requirements of
Federal, State and local laws. The provisions of Sec. 90.429 shall not
apply to transmitters authorized under this paragraph. To be eligible
for operations in this manner, the transmitter must comply with all of
the following requirements.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rdale
That's VERY incorrect.
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2008, 5:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by baw352
Yeah, there are frequencies in the 156.xxx area of the band for assignment to the public safety agencies. Just because they are assignable doesn't mean you can hijack them for use whenever you want. You still have to obtain a license from the FCC for them and use a type accepted radio.
Ok, you tell the nice man with the gun and badge that… I’ll bet you get a free ride in the police car… beating is optional.

Quote:
Originally Posted by baw352
The biggest problem I have is there is a well known use of modified amateur radios being used by officers for tac channels. The admin knows this and does nothing.
Maybe the administration knows this, and maybe they don’t. I do know this, if you guys called up the administration with the attitude and lack of respect that you show to people here, the complaint went no where… And who knows what kinds of radios they are using, they could be Marine radios or modified ham radios or legally programmed radios, just illegal use of the frequencies. Next time you get close to a IMPD car, tell them, no demand you want to see their radios. (See above for their reaction). And maybe the radios serve a purpose that you guys are not privileged to know.

Quote:
Originally Posted by baw352
From my understanding there has been official complaints to uncle sam in the past but there isn't enough resources to enforce it.
Trust me, if there was interference, it would be stopped very quickly. Which means the FCC doesn’t think it’s that big of a deal, and they are probably not causing interference with Marine users, unless I missed the yacht clubs on my last visit to Indianapolis The smart approach would be to listen, that IS what the hobby is all about.

AL
  #29 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2008, 5:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ecps92
http://frwebgate2.access.gpo.gov/cgi...ction=retrieve

Page 269

(5) A Police licensee may use transmitters on the frequencies
indicated below in connection with official police activities without
specific authorization from the Commission, provided that such use shall
be on a secondary basis and shall not cause harmful interference to
services of other licensees operating on regularly assigned frequencies,
and further provided that all such use complies with the requirements of
Federal, State and local laws. The provisions of Sec. 90.429 shall not
apply to transmitters authorized under this paragraph. To be eligible
for operations in this manner, the transmitter must comply with all of
the following requirements.
Oh no, I see some peoples bubbles bursting. Maybe that's why the administration doesn't see as that big of a deal.

AL
  #30 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2008, 6:18 PM
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If anybody in the Metro Indianapolis area listens to the 156Mhz-157Mhz area you will hear the Illegal frequencies in use.I am looking for IMPD Southeast,IMPD North, and IMPD Downtown.If anyone would find these frequencies would you please post them here for all of us to check out and lsten to.Thank You!!!
  #31 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2008, 6:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by baw352
I think that W9NES is just looking out for the good of the scanning / amateur radio hobby.
If he were looking out for the good of he scanning/amateur radio hobby, I'd think he'd be glad that he found some potentially 'juicy' frequencies to listen to and share with others. Getting the FCC to crack down on PDs using what some have proclaimed as 'illegal frequencies' would simply make monitoring with a scanner much less exciting. Be thankful that some agencies are still using VHF and make use of those frequencies instead of hanging out on a trunked system that many people can't monitor.

My 0.02 from Ohio.

Mike
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2008, 7:05 PM
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Yes I understand that point but my point is they do not have a license!I had a pay for my license and therfore anybody else should pay and get licensed thru the FCC.You cannot just go and pick a frequency and use it.This is not a "CB Childrens Band radio"
  #33 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2008, 7:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W9NES
Yes I understand that point but my point is they do not have a license!I had a pay for my license and therfore anybody else should pay and get licensed thru the FCC.You cannot just go and pick a frequency and use it.This is not a "CB Childrens Band radio"
If you paid for a license, you probably didn't pay a whole lot for it - and if you obtained a license more recently you didn't pay for the license but the testing, unless you have a vanity call. If you think law enforcement operators are turning 156-157 mhz into children's band, I suggest you listen in on just about every ham band - although the ham children are more prevelant above 30 mhz. I have an AR license too. The comment isn't personal.

Mike
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2008, 9:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ecps92
http://frwebgate2.access.gpo.gov/cgi...ction=retrieve

Page 269

(5) A Police licensee may use transmitters on the frequencies
indicated below in connection with official police activities without
Are you serious? Did you REALLY intentionally cut off the rest of that section? You would INTENTIONALLY mislead people, then post a link that doesn't work?

(i) these are modified ham radios, which would not be certified
(ii) okay, meets that
(iii) must NOT be voice, yet they are using voice. Two strikes (no strikes allowed)

The more I read, the more I realize this is about communication taps or similar, NOT daily chatter.

Wow. I'd be embarassed to have posted that clip to intentionally mislead others.

===

(i) In accordance with Sec. 90.203 and Sec. 2.803 of this chapter,
the transmitter must be of a type which has been certificated by the
Commission.
(ii) The carrier frequency shall be within the bands listed below
and must be maintained within 0.005 percent of the frequency of
operation. Use on assigned channel center frequencies is not required.

30.85-30.87 MHz
30.89-30.91 MHz
30.93-30.95 MHz
30.97-30.99 MHz
31.01-31.03 MHz
31.05-31.07 MHz
31.09-31.11 MHz
31.13-31.15 MHz
31.17-31.19 MHz
31.21-31.23 MHz
31.25-31.27 MHz
31.29-31.31 MHz
31.33-31.35 MHz
31.37-31.39 MHz
31.41-31.43 MHz
31.45-31.47 MHz
31.49-31.51 MHz
31.53-31.55 MHz
31.57-31.59 MHz
31.61-31.63 MHz
31.65-31.67 MHz
31.69-31.71 MHz
31.73-31.75 MHz
31.77-31.79 MHz
31.81-31.83 MHz
31.85-31.87 MHz
31.89-31.91 MHz
31.93-31.95 MHz
31.97-32.00 MHz
33.00-33.03 MHz
33.05-33.07 MHz
33.41-34.00 MHz
37.00-37.43 MHz
37.89-38.00 MHz
39.00-40.00 MHz
42.00-42.91 MHz
44.61-45.91 MHz
45.93-45.95 MHz
45.97-45.99 MHz
46.01-46.03 MHz
46.05-46.60 MHz
47.00-47.41 MHz
150.995-151.490 MHz
153.740-154.445 MHz
154.635-155.195 MHz
155.415-156.250 MHz
158.715-159.465 MHz
453.0125-453.9875 MHz
458.0125-458.9875 MHz
460.0125-460.5125 MHz
460.5625-460.6375 MHz
462.9375-462.9875 MHz
465.0125-465.5125 MHz
465.5625-465.6375 MHz
467.9375-467.9875 MHz

(iii) The emitted signal shall be non-voice modulation (type PO
emission).
(iv) The maximum occupied bandwidth, containing 99 percent of the
radiated power, shall not exceed 2.0 kHz.
(v) The transmitter output power shall not exceed a mean power of 30
mW nor shall any peak exceed 1 watt peak power, as measured into a 50
ohm resistive load. Should the transmitter be supplied with a
permanently attached antenna or should the transmitter and antenna
combination be contained in a sealed unit, the following standard may be
used in lieu of the above: the field strength of the fundamental signal
of the transmitter and antenna combination shall not exceed 0.4 V/m mean
or 2.3 V/m peak when measured at a distance of 3 meters.
(vi) The transmitter shall contain positive means to limit the
transmission time to no more than 10 days. In the event of a malfunction
of this positive means, the transmitter signal shall cease. The use of
battery life to accomplish the transmission time limitation is
permissible.
  #35 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2008, 9:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newsalan
Oh no, I see some peoples bubbles bursting.
It's not really a bubble, but it sure does bring shame down on the hobby and ham radio operators when someone would clip out snippets here and there for the purpose of intentionally misleading the RR forum users.
  #36 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2008, 9:45 PM
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newsalan, the more I read your posts the more I think you just need someone to give you a big hug.
  #37 (permalink)  
Old 01-27-2008, 6:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W9NES
Yes I understand that point but my point is they do not have a license!I had a pay for my license and therfore anybody else should pay and get licensed thru the FCC.You cannot just go and pick a frequency and use it.This is not a "CB Childrens Band radio"
Government agencies are exempt from license fees. They pay nada for their license.
Now the coordination fee are another matter, I'm not sure if those are always paid. Years ago, the APCO coordinator worked for ISP, and he retired before I coordinated a frequency, but he was full of helpful information, none of the advice cost anything. The coordination cost almost 200.00, but the license itself cost nothing. And the renewal costs nothing as well.

AL
  #38 (permalink)  
Old 01-27-2008, 6:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by baw352
newsalan, the more I read your posts the more I think you just need someone to give you a big hug.
Actually I need a PSR-500 or 600, with programming software thrown in as well.
  #39 (permalink)  
Old 01-27-2008, 6:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newsalan
Government agencies are exempt from license fees. They pay nada for their license.
Now the coordination fee are another matter, I'm not sure if those are always paid. Years ago, the APCO coordinator worked for ISP, and he retired before I coordinated a frequency, but he was full of helpful information, none of the advice cost anything. The coordination cost almost 200.00, but the license itself cost nothing. And the renewal costs nothing as well.

AL
WRONG! GO TO APCO YOU WILL SEE THEY PAY BIG FEES AND GO TO THE FCC WEB SITE AS WELL
  #40 (permalink)  
Old 01-27-2008, 6:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdale
It's not really a bubble, but it sure does bring shame down on the hobby and ham radio operators when someone would clip out snippets here and there for the purpose of intentionally misleading the RR forum users.
I think it's more like you can't judge a book by its cover. In other words don't believe everything you read, check it out yourself as you did. And of course some things are always open to interpretation.

It seems people are assuming a lot here. Like ham radios are being used. I don't know what’s being used, they could be using legally programmed radios, just "illegal" frequencies, and the "users" could get a business license tomorrow and reprogram all the radios and be 100% legal. They could even be using marine radios, and these are illegal on land except for certain cases.

But I don't know what they are using for sure, and I'm pretty sure most people on here don't have that knowledge either, they are just guessing as to the type of radio. Heck, it could be one big spoof, 4-5 guys playing IMPD cops on VHF to fool the city and just repeating calls they’ve heard over their scanners.

A lot of it is just another opinion, but if the opinions here represent Ham radio, then it is in worse shape then I thought.

AL
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