Tk-x180 838C Firmware

[Colton25]

So i updated my firmware to the 838C which is what i hear is needed in order to get the tactical functions. Now that i've updated it when i try to use the OST function it will only work when the channel doesn't have a tx tone. Supposedly the tactical features improve the OST function, I know that i still need to send in the radio for the tactical features but until then is there anything i can do to fix this?

 

[ramal121]

when i try to use the OST function it will only work when the channel doesn't have a tx tone.

Correct. That is the way it is supposed to work. For channels that do not require OST, putting a TX tone in the channel information locks out OST so you do not go out in left field by accident. There's no fixin' to be done.

If you now have the TFS firmware, I don't see why you still have to send the radio in. All the TFS features are available through the program software.

 

[Colton25]

Is that the correct firmware? If I try and add the TFS in the software it says something needs to be installed in the radio. And I thought the TFS gives more freedom with OST. Before I upgraded firmware I had one OST set up with no tones and named it "direct" for when I want to talk line of site, but now that's impossible with this.. If there's no way to fix this I'm extremely disappointed. I just thought it was because I haven't sent it off to get the TFS. The firmware I installed is 838C.

Correct. That is the way it is supposed to work. For channels that do not require OST, putting a TX tone in the channel information locks out OST so you do not go out in left field by accident. There's no fixin' to be done.

If you now have the TFS firmware, I don't see why you still have to send the radio in. All the TFS features are available through the program software.

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[ajohansson]

This is not TFS firmware. Its the firmware that locked out OST with encode and transmits a decode in Talk around.

The TFS is not firmware like we use it. Its a feature set that will add the command group function to this radio. Also adds OST Up/Down and field programming. It must be installed by a dealer. Its like a license key one only issued per radio. Like a windows license key.

Why dont you use the talk around feature for line of sight? Thats what it was designed for? Also how does OST with nothing in it make it line of sight? Im confused by how you are explaining the use of it. If the channel is duplex and you are encoding an OST list # that is blank that does not make it line of sight by any means.

What are you using this radio for? Like another other poster said this locks out the OST so you don't accidentally switch tones on a hard toned channel. Its a safety feature us in the fire service asked for doing what its supposed to do.

If its not what you want get the old firmware from someone and put it back in.

AJ


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[Colton25]

My apologies, I completely misunderstood the firmware change. I knew that you still had to send it off for TFS, the only reason I had an issue with the OST being protected was because like I said I was using one OST that was blank.. meaning no encode or decode tone. I thought that taking the tones out would make the channel "line of site" or Kenwood's talk around feature, but now that I think about it the transmit frequency still remains, I must be confusing myself. I was trying to go without using talk around feature because that's one more button that needs to be programmed and if you've had a 2180 or 7180 you know that your limited as it is with your key assignments, having really only 3 buttons that I can program.

This is not TFS firmware. Its the firmware that locked out OST with encode and transmits a decode in Talk around.

The TFS is not firmware like we use it. Its a feature set that will add the command group function to this radio. Also adds OST Up/Down and field programming. It must be installed by a dealer. Its like a license key one only issued per radio. Like a windows license key.

Why dont you use the talk around feature for line of sight? Thats what it was designed for? Also how does OST with nothing in it make it line of sight? Im confused by how you are explaining the use of it. If the channel is duplex and you are encoding an OST list # that is blank that does not make it line of sight by any means.

What are you using this radio for? Like another other poster said this locks out the OST so you don't accidentally switch tones on a hard toned channel. Its a safety feature us in the fire service asked for doing what its supposed to do.

If its not what you want get the old firmware from someone and put it back in.

AJ


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[Colton25]

Here are some pics of my key assignments.

 

[ajohansson]

What are you using the orange button for?

If not using it for anything else. I would add the Function button somewhere on your radio so you can get the 2nd function ability. add things like

Talk Around - Squelch

Some folks use the orange as the OST, we actually use the orange key for 2 tone encode for an emergency alert.

We use the side keys for key lock and function.

S - Scan - 2nd function is squelch
A - Add/Delete - 2nd function is TA
B - Zone down - 2nd is function is monitor
C - Zone Up - no second function

We have full key pads so we use the # for OST UP
* button for TAC/Command group
buttons 1 - 2 - 3 for direct channel inputs

We have had this config for about 6-7 years no issues.

Some other agencies I consult for have 7180's

We do the same thing for the S-A-B-C and use the square button for the function.
Orange Triangle for 2 tone encode.

 

[kayn1n32008]

I thought that taking the tones out would make the channel "line of site" or Kenwood's talk around feature, but now that I think about it the transmit frequency still remains, I must be confusing myself.

Talk around means that rather than transmitting on the input frequency, the radio makes the Tx and RX the same while in TA.

I was trying to go without using talk around feature because that's one more button that needs to be programmed

Minor, when just selecting a key assignment from a drop down menu.

and if you've had a 2180 or 7180 you know that your limited as it is with your key assignments, having really only 3 buttons that I can program.

Huh?

I own a TK-7180, and there are 10 programmable buttons... And with the use of the second function that makes 19 unique settings... If the TK-2180 has a full keypad, you have 19 keys, plus the second function makes like 37 unique functions.

Just remember that you need to set one key for FUNC so you can access the second function.


The TK-x180 series, and the NX-x00 are amazing radios. The key assignments are almost unlimited, except you do not get to select low or high power on the mobiles, you have to program a second channel as low power... Yet the portables can be set to have a key for High/Low power... PITA

Edit:

And if you put a speakermic on the portable, you get 2/4 more functions with the two keys on the speakermic.





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[kayn1n32008]

Here are some pics of my key assignments.

Take a look, you have LOTS of keys you can assign 1st and 2nd functions to... It just becomes a PITA to remember what key does what function/2nd function.


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[Colton25]

Yeah that's where I have the troubles, remembering.

Take a look, you have LOTS of keys you can assign 1st and 2nd functions to... It just becomes a PITA to remember what key does what function/2nd function.


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[ramal121]

I second that. You have 7 programmable buttons. Make one the function button and the other 6 can have dual capabilities giving you a total of 12.

I'm getting a little confused here. Direct communications is a function of having the transmit and receive frequencies the same. This is accomplished by hard writing this in the channel information screen or if using a repeater with split frequencies, programming a TA button which that will switch out the normal offset transmit frequency to make it the same as the receive frequency. Tones have nothing to do with making a channel direct or not. Besides, you cannot have an OST slot that is blank and be able to use it.

Maybe if you clarify your situation better we can help you figure it out and make it work the way you expect.

 

[Colton25]

I was confused on what direct actually meant, I thought if you remove the tones it makes it direct when in fact you need your receive and transmit frequencies the same. The main reason I want the TFS is for the OST up and down, so I suppose I can assign that as a second function. As far as for a mobile the tk-5710 seems comparable to the tk-7180 because of the number of channels and if I'm not mistaken the TFS is already installed in the radio.

I second that. You have 7 programmable buttons. Make one the function button and the other 6 can have dual capabilities giving you a total of 12.

I'm getting a little confused here. Direct communications is a function of having the transmit and receive frequencies the same. This is accomplished by hard writing this in the channel information screen or if using a repeater with split frequencies, programming a TA button which that will switch out the normal offset transmit frequency to make it the same as the receive frequency. Tones have nothing to do with making a channel direct or not. Besides, you cannot have an OST slot that is blank and be able to use it.

Maybe if you clarify your situation better we can help you figure it out and make it work the way you expect.

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[Colton25]

I have the Orange button set to key lock.

What are you using the orange button for?

If not using it for anything else. I would add the Function button somewhere on your radio so you can get the 2nd function ability. add things like

Talk Around - Squelch

Some folks use the orange as the OST, we actually use the orange key for 2 tone encode for an emergency alert.

We use the side keys for key lock and function.

S - Scan - 2nd function is squelch
A - Add/Delete - 2nd function is TA
B - Zone down - 2nd is function is monitor
C - Zone Up - no second function

We have full key pads so we use the # for OST UP
* button for TAC/Command group
buttons 1 - 2 - 3 for direct channel inputs

We have had this config for about 6-7 years no issues.

Some other agencies I consult for have 7180's

We do the same thing for the S-A-B-C and use the square button for the function.
Orange Triangle for 2 tone encode.

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[ramal121]

Take a look, you have LOTS of keys you can assign 1st and 2nd functions to... It just becomes a PITA to remember what key does what function/2nd function.


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No doubt. This tired brain needs a cheat.

 

[ajohansson]

Everyone has given you lots of good advice. Play around with button configs. i would leave in 838C firmware for safety reasons.




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[Colton25]

Yes I will, and I plan on keeping it

Everyone has given you lots of good advice. Play around with button configs. i would leave in 838C firmware for safety reasons.




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[kayn1n32008]

No doubt. This tired brain needs a cheat.

Hahaha yea, on my TK-7180 & NX-200 & 2x NX-700's I had to make cheat sheets to remember all the button assignments too.


NX-700 in my work truck:

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[ajohansson]

The beauty of the 5710/5210 and the nx-5000 series having the button or readout say what the button does but for the price a cheat sheet is worth it


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[kayn1n32008]

The beauty of the 5710/5210 and the nx-5000 series having the button or readout say what the button does but for the price a cheat sheet is worth it


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Very true. For the price I paid for the radio (free) the cheat sheet was a value addition!. Wish I could afford either of those radios!


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[ajohansson]

One of my customers key config. They do not have the TFS though.

If it was in my dept with the TFS I would probably make the second function of the right buttons OST/UP OST/Down.