Sticky Thread for MilAir III

[TinEar]

HAPPY NEW YEAR - January 1, 2008

It's a new year and time to start a new MilAir thread. The last one was stuffed and overflowing. I'm going to start this thread with a review of my aerial refueling frequencies contained in my scan rotation. If anyone has anything additional or notices something I've missed from the refueling world, please add those freqs here - assuming they're within possible listening distance of this general area. The description after each frequency is limited to 16 characters to fit within the Uniden and GRE format if you want to just grab the whole thing. If the Coronet frequencies are new to you and they need more definition, just ask.

396.2000 Coronet 11 A-#1
394.6000 Coronet 11 A-#2
391.0000 Coronet 21 B-#1
388.4000 Coronet 21 B-#2
378.2000 Coronet 31 C-#1
375.7000 Coronet 31 C-#2
372.3000 Coronet 41 D-#1
370.4000 Coronet 41 D-#2
314.5000 Coronet 51 E-#1
297.3000 Coronet 51 E-#2
343.1000 Coronet 61 K-#1
322.8000 Coronet 61 K-#2
254.6000 Coronet 71 I-#1
255.7500 Coronet 71 I-#2
236.7500 Coronet 81 J-#1
228.5500 Coronet 81 J-#2
293.0000 Coronet 91 F-#1
289.7000 Coronet 91 F-#2

123.5250 Navy Refueling
139.8750 TankerInterplane
143.8250 TankerInterplane
148.0500 TankerInterplane
228.0000 Aerial Refueling
234.5000 Refuel Duke MOA
235.1000 Refuel AR206/328
236.2500 Aerial Refueling
238.9000 AR-212/AR-636
252.8000 Aerial Refueling
256.6500 AR-20 Secondary
266.5000 756thARS Intrpln
274.4500 Refuel AR218/220
276.5000 Refuel AR216/609
277.3500 CAP Refueling
282.7000 AR Secondary
283.9000 AR-217/AR-616
288.0000 Refueling BLUE24
293.7000 STEEL Interplane
295.8000 Refueling AR-631
303.0000 108thARW McGuire
303.1250 AR18V Cherry Pt
305.5000 AR-20/AR-219
311.0000 STEEL Control
311.5750 AR18V Cherry Pt
315.9000 AR-777 Secondary
319.7000 Refueling AR-636
320.4500 AR W-386 TestTrk
320.6000 Aerial Refueling
324.6000 AR-204/AR-207
327.6000 Refueling AR-205
327.9000 Aerial Refueling
339.6000 Aerial Refueling
341.7500 Aerial Refueling
343.5000 Refueling AR-608
346.2500 Marine Refueling
348.9000 Refueling AR206H
351.2000 756thARS Andrews
365.7000 Aerial Refueling
387.8000 Aerial Refueling

 

[freqhopping]

AIRFORCE-2 returning to ADW. 119.3
To Tower for 19L.

 

[Mark]

Rgr TIN and Happy New Year to you and everyone here on Maryland Milair3.
Should be interesting season coming up.
First new logs for me this year..

2110z EVAC 21112 C-17 arriving Andrews 378.100,offload 14 litters,12 amb,etc.
Must be the Tuesday Ramstein-Andrews run.

REACH 5007 C-5 85-0007 with Dover CP 2124z,40 mins out.Alpha 3.
req c/ag,Satcom out,UHF radio 3 out,HF radio out...

REACH 4137 C-17 2149z arriving McGuire on CP 319.400

Mark

 

[TinEar]

What are those Coronet frequencies and what do they mean?

That's the gist of a few emails and a PM I've received after posting those refueling freqs. So, I'll do what I should have done to begin with...explain them.

Coronet missions are those across the Atlantic/Pacific Oceans that are either delivering new aircraft or flights of aircraft rotating to/from overseas bases. If they can't make it on their internal fuel load, they are assigned a tanker(s) to fly along with them and provide fuel.

Those frequencies above in Message #1 correspond to the suffix of the flight - such as TABOR 11. First, you look at the suffix. Since it's 11, their refueling freqs are the A (Alpha) set of freqs. There's a Primary and Secondary freq for the Alpha refueling plan which I've labeled #1 and #2. In the example, TABOR 11 would use the Alpha set of freqs - either 396.2 or 394.6.

A HURON 61 flight would use the Kilo set -- 343.1 or 322.8.

While I'm at it, I'll also repeat the new callsigns for Coronet East (Atlantic Ocean crossing.) The tankers are using CAFE and CLEAN (old were BLUE and GOLD which seem to still pop up occasionally) and the accompanied aircraft are using HURON and TABOR. Since I don't hear them, I've not been able to recover the Coronet West (Pacific Ocean) callsigns. The refueling freqs though apply to both East and West.

Clear? If not, please tell me I didn't do a good job explaining it.

 

[kmacka]

Thanks for the explanation!

 

[ka3jjz]

That explanation deserves to be wiki-fied, once everyone thinks it's clear (it was to me, but that means nothing, of course).

73s Mike

 

[BM82557]

That explanation deserves to be wiki-fied, once everyone thinks it's clear (it was to me, but that means nothing, of course).

73s Mike

Thanks for the explanation! I agree with Mike.

 

[TinEar]

Good. Glad that's cleared up. The 16-character limit for scanner Alpha tags doesn't always allow full explanations. With that limit in mind, there was nothing I could think of to make it clearer within the tag.

Looking over the tags for some of the other freqs, there are a few I could have made clearer for the particular AR track they're used in...but...I left some of the old tags I've used forever. Hopefully, I haven't forgotten any for the listening area and have picked up all the changed freqs over the past few months. If so, I hope you'll share what you have and post them. It always makes for better listening when everyone shares the freqs they have for an area although I know some people like to keep them to themselves for whatever reason.

The 282.7 freq I have labeled "AR Secondary" looks kind of bare but it's the secondary freq for about 20 different AR tracks so I couldn't think of any tag to better describe it.

 

[SquelchKnob]

What are those Coronet frequencies and what do they mean?

That's the gist of a few emails and a PM I've received after posting those refueling freqs. So, I'll do what I should have done to begin with...explain them.

Coronet missions are those across the Atlantic/Pacific Oceans that are either delivering new aircraft or flights of aircraft rotating to/from overseas bases. If they can't make it on their internal fuel load, they are assigned a tanker(s) to fly along with them and provide fuel.

Those frequencies above in Message #1 correspond to the suffix of the flight - such as TABOR 11. First, you look at the suffix. Since it's 11, their refueling freqs are the A (Alpha) set of freqs. There's a Primary and Secondary freq for the Alpha refueling plan which I've labeled #1 and #2. In the example, TABOR 11 would use the Alpha set of freqs - either 396.2 or 394.6.

A HURON 61 flight would use the Kilo set -- 343.1 or 322.8.

While I'm at it, I'll also repeat the new callsigns for Coronet East (Atlantic Ocean crossing.) The tankers are using CAFE and CLEAN (old were BLUE and GOLD which seem to still pop up occasionally) and the accompanied aircraft are using HURON and TABOR. Since I don't hear them, I've not been able to recover the Coronet West (Pacific Ocean) callsigns. The refueling freqs though apply to both East and West.

Clear? If not, please tell me I didn't do a good job explaining it.

Look good to me Tin. The freq plan for the Pacific (CORONET WEST) is a different arrangement. Some of the freqs are the same but the plan is different. I actually keep two separate files. One for East and One for West. I'll dig those out tomorrow. Just turned the Laptop here off and that is where they should be.

Edit: Something I just remembered. The indiviual that gave me the lists asked me specificaly not to post the WEST freqs. Tin I will PM you that list but I will not post it and ask you do the same, Simply because I was asked not to. I don't think he has a problem with sharing them privately. Just not publicly. But for what it's worth the freqs are very close to being the same if memory serves. Might be 2-3 different ones. Just the lineup is different.

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0IBT/is_3_57/ai_74407415

 

[TinEar]

Look good to me Tin. The freq plan for the Pacific (CORONET WEST) is a different arrangement. Some of the freqs are the same but the plan is different. I actually keep two separate files. One for East and One for West. I'll dig those out tomorrow. Just turned the Laptop here off and that is where they should be.

Edit: Something I just remembered. The indiviual that gave me the lists asked me specificaly not to post the WEST freqs. Tin I will PM you that list but I will not post it and ask you do the same, Simply because I was asked not to. I don't think he has a problem with sharing them privately. Just not publicly. But for what it's worth the freqs are very close to being the same if memory serves. Might be 2-3 different ones. Just the lineup is different.

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0IBT/is_3_57/ai_74407415

I remember that article from a long time ago. Well written. I didn't realize it was still available. Some of that stuff has been taken down (like the URL in the article that you can no longer get to.) JR, I'll look for the PM and thank you. I know you said you picked up a hard copy of the IFR Supplement. If I remember correctly, the newest Coronet freqs should be just below the section that contains the map with the AR tracks. That's where I pulled the list from that I presented above - in the last edition before the one beginning 20 December 07. That indicated no difference between East/West and there were no freq changes from an older version I had from....a long time ago.

 

[SquelchKnob]

I remember that article from a long time ago. Well written. I didn't realize it was still available. Some of that stuff has been taken down (like the URL in the article that you can no longer get to.) JR, I'll look for the PM and thank you. I know you said you picked up a hard copy of the IFR Supplement. If I remember correctly, the newest Coronet freqs should be just below the section that contains the map with the AR tracks. That's where I pulled the list from that I presented above - in the last edition before the one beginning 20 December 07. That indicated no difference between East/West and there were no freq changes from an older version I had from....a long time ago.

I got the freqs from a source well known within the Hobby that most folks know is hardcore into the CORONETS. (R). I do trust his input. As a matter of fact he and I followed several CORONETS live via online radios and used his CORONET WEST freq plan and it was right on the money. 'BUT' it is really no biggie as if memory serves the CORONET EAST plan is going to be 90% of what we should be hearing on this coast in this area. I think the ones heading to the WEST are more likely going to be coming in so far up north we will be unlikely to hit them anyway.

I'll doublecheck the IFR Supp for the CORONET freqs. That is all on the laptop as well and it is already packed up as I have to start the daily grind again tomorrow and do the back to work thing.

 

[TinEar]

I got the freqs form a source well known within the Hobby that most folks know is hardcore into the CORONETS. (R). I do trust his input. As a matter of fact he and I followed several CORONETS live via online radios and used his CORONET WEST freq plan and it was right on the money. 'BUT' It is really no biggie as if memory serves the CORONET EAST plan is going to be 90% of what we should be hearing on this coast in this area. I think the ones heading to the WEST are more likely going to be coming in so far up north we will be unlikely to hit them anyway.

I'll doublecheck the IFR Supp for the CORONET freqs. That is all on the laptop as well and it is already packed up as I have to start the daily grind again tomorrow and do the back to work thing.

I hear you. I'm not trying to argue the point because I know all too well there are freqs used that aren't covered in the IFR Supplements. We just went through that with the ARTCC freqs. There is no better source than someone that actually listens to this stuff - the "hardcore" guys you refer to. Anyway, I'll look for your PM whenever you can get to it. No hurry obviously. I guess it is back to work tomorrow for the workers of the world. Have fun, ya heah? Hopefully, MilAir will start to get back to normal in the next few days.

 

[JohnFB]

2110z EVAC 21112 C-17 arriving Andrews 378.100,offload 14 litters,12 amb,etc.
Must be the Tuesday Ramstein-Andrews run.

For those who like to collect selcals:
1533Z : 08864.0 HF Gander wkg EVAC 21112 posit rpts & secal chk CPLR

According to Airframes.Org that selcal was used by C-17 92-3292 at some time. I don't think mil aircraft have permanent selcals.

 

[jmhayes]

I don't think mil aircraft have permanent selcals.

They do, it's just that SELCAL codes aren't unique -- so there are up to 4 active airframes with the same SELCAL. You'll often see the SELCAL on a placard, sometimes with the serial number. Here's a decent example:

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/1253101/L/

That's KC-10A 79-1951 with SELCAL GSKM which is also owned by a jetBlue A320 N526JB among others.

 

[JohnFB]

That's KC-10A 79-1951 with SELCAL GSKM which is also owned by a jetBlue A320 N526JB among others.

Kewl, thnx, although I'm not quite sure as to where I'm supposed to look for the SELCAL in the picture ....... ooops, there it is ....... I just enlarged the photo and spotted the plate.

Thnx agin

 

[JohnFB]

I know you said you picked up a hard copy of the IFR Supplement. If I remember correctly, the newest Coronet freqs should be just below the section that contains the map with the AR tracks. That's where I pulled the list from that I presented above - in the last edition before the one beginning 20 December 07. That indicated no difference between East/West and there were no freq changes from an older version I had from....a long time ago.

Pardon my butting in ...... but do you mean the AP/1B Military Training Routes supplement?? I just searched thru the one I have & I don't see any CORONET freqs listed near the AR maps.

 

[SquelchKnob]

Pardon my butting in ...... but do you mean the AP/1B Military Training Routes supplement?? I just searched thru the one I have & I don't see any CORONET freqs listed near the AR maps.

I don't remember seeing them in any of the supps. Must have overlooked them many times. I just picked one of the freqs and ran a search on IFR, VFR AP/1, AP/1A AP/1B, GP and FIH.

I searched all documents for 396.2 and it only turned up in the AP/1B listed as an AR freq for AR406H & AR406L. I may do a bit more searching later when I have more time. Kinda curious as to how many more of these show in in listed AR routes now.

 

[TinEar]

I wish I had kept the original sequence and document section name for those Coronet freqs. I copied them to a file that was labeled 'ARF' for that section in the original document. I guess that ARF was for Aerial Refueling Frequencies. The Coronets were presented this way...(this is a copy and paste from the original file I copied - except that here they'll get squashed together)

USAF Coronet Air-Refueling
bandplan for the Continental US (CONUS)

CALLSIGN DESIGNATOR PRIMARY SECONDARY
---------------------------------------------------
11 ALFA 396.2 394.6
21 BRAVO 391.0 388.4
31 CHARLIE 378.2 375.7
41 DELTA 372.3 370.4
51 ECHO 314.5 297.3
61 KILO 343.1 322.8
71 INDIA 254.6 255.75
81 JULIETT 236.75 228.55
91 FOXTROT 293.0 289.7

Right under that part was the list of AR tracks, the ARTCC, freqs, etc. Here's the first line that I've truncated because the entire line is too wide for this format...
AR1 E KZLC T US WGE WGE 343.500 256.650 (continues across the line with flight levels, etc, and ends with CYCLE_DATE (showing last date freq was changed in this format -- 200707 -- meaning freqs began in cycle starting July 2007)

There were several sections on refueling. That one was the freqs used. Another part of that same document contained 'Remarks' for each of the tracks that dealt with who and where to call for the airspace, times AR is permitted in the tracks, certain types of aircraft that are or are not permitted to refuel in the track, etc. Here is an example of what was contained in that section for AR243V:
AR243V N KZOA REFUELING ALTITUDES 2 1 Restricted to H-60G and C-130 refueling operations. May include multiple tankers and/or receivers. There are actually eight lines of remarks for that AR track. The strange thing about that section is that not all AR tracks were included. For instance, there is nothing for our local AR-636.
Yet another section under 'ARF' contained the lat/long boundaries of each AR track, lat/longs for the IP, CP, EXIT points and on and on - although it might have had a different label than 'ARF' and I just dumped it into the same file from another similarly named one.

I have no idea if that will help anyone find those sections in the original. Apparently, they were not right under the map of the tracks as I thought I remembered. But they are alive and well somewhere in the document.

 

[Mark]

Quiet day so far...

1215 REACH 2302 C-130 arrive Dover for gas and go,25k...Could be 92-3022 Ohio ANG Youngstown.
1230 BATON 74 EC-130 Pa ANG doing touch and go's at Dover with appch 132.425
1220 NAVY WB767 with Huntress 364.200 on Sea Isle leg. WB? Could be WaterBug P-3 or KC-130 from VX-20 from Pax River,
Had noisy props in the background... Ref below,thanks TIN.

Mark

 

[TinEar]

Quiet day so far...

1220 NAVY WB767 with Huntress 364.200 on Sea Isle leg. WB? That Andrews detachment?

Mark

WATERBUG from Pax.