MPSCS Alpha tag scheme

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RadioSnoop

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I've spent hours looking through the forums and wiki and haven't found my answer, so forgive me if this has already been answered and I just haven't found it.

I'm from Mississippi, but I'm spending a lot of time in Michigan lately (6 times last year!) and may be moving there.

When looking at the MPSCS database, many of the alpha tags don't make sense to me.

For example:

Talkgroup 13366 is Fennville Fire Tactical. When "03F0305" (the alpha tag) is displayed, how do you know what that means?

Talkgroup 2701 is Algonac Police: Proprietary. When "74P209" is displayed, how do you know what that is? I'm guessing 74 is the county, but what is the "209"?

Obviously, there is some kind of numbering scheme or shorthand that I'm not understanding.

And also, many channels are described as "Proprietary". What does that mean?

Thank you so much! Michigan is a beautiful state and I can't wait to get back there.
 

RayAir

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I've spent hours looking through the forums and wiki and haven't found my answer, so forgive me if this has already been answered and I just haven't found it.

I'm from Mississippi, but I'm spending a lot of time in Michigan lately (6 times last year!) and may be moving there.

When looking at the MPSCS database, many of the alpha tags don't make sense to me.

For example:

Talkgroup 13366 is Fennville Fire Tactical. When "03F0305" (the alpha tag) is displayed, how do you know what that means?

Talkgroup 2701 is Algonac Police: Proprietary. When "74P209" is displayed, how do you know what that is? I'm guessing 74 is the county, but what is the "209"?

Obviously, there is some kind of numbering scheme or shorthand that I'm not understanding.

And also, many channels are described as "Proprietary". What does that mean?

Thank you so much! Michigan is a beautiful state and I can't wait to get back there.

74P209-
74- County number
P- Police or proprietary?
209- Agency number

Proprietary probably just means the TG is for that particular agency. Maybe the area has a countywide law dispatch group and then individual agencies are assigned a proprietary TG, probably used for local ops purpose. Genesee Co has a lot of that.
 

RadioSnoop

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74P209-
74- County number
P- Police or proprietary?
209- Agency number

Proprietary probably just means the TG is for that particular agency. Maybe the area has a countywide law dispatch group and then individual agencies are assigned a proprietary TG, probably used for local ops purpose. Genesee Co has a lot of that.

Thank you.

The county number makes sense. There are 83 counties. And alphabetically, St. Clair is number 74. So that part makes sense. The MSWIN system in Mississippi does that too.
But what about talkgroups like 12118 (Clay Twp: Fire Dispatch) which shows an alpha tag "867OPS1"? Shouldn't it be 74867OPS1 or something like that?

But what about the agency number? Surely there are thousands of agencies. Is there a numbered list somewhere?

I wonder what the actual user radios are programmed to display?
 

iMONITOR

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I've spent hours looking through the forums and wiki and haven't found my answer, so forgive me if this has already been answered and I just haven't found it.

When looking at the MPSCS database, many of the alpha tags don't make sense to me.

It is frustrating at times. I've lived in Michigan all my 67 years. When Michigan went to P25 digital, the Alpha Tags are not consistent, and sometimes don't even give a hint as to what they are. Once you look them up in RR's database and then view the Description, you can usually figure it out and how the Alpha Tag relates, but not always. Most it not all the programming software gives you a choice to import either the Alpha Tags, or the Descriptions. However the Descriptions are often truncated to fit the number of characters in the field.

ie; 740COM Shelby Twp. Police & Fire: Common Mutual Aid

For the most common, local and important ones, I edit the description to what makes more sense to me. The problem with this is, when you do an update, your custom Tags/Descriptions are overwritten with the ones in RR's database.
 
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drdispatch

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First 2 characters are the county number.
P = Police, F = Fire, E = EMS, EM = Emergency Management, COM = Common, SPEV = Special Event, EMER = Emergency Scene. There are plenty of others, but those are the most common ones, which were originally designated when the system was configured.
The 3-digit numbers that are used are the specific agency number, which are assigned by the state for both LEIN and crime stat reporting purposes. I can rattle off all the ones in my county, only because we have to use them for LEIN, so they get committed to memory after a while. Battle Creek PD is 237, so their talkgroups are 13P237, 237P911, 237TAC1, etc. I'd like to think (and so would the state, I imagine) that there is rhyme & reason to the TGID system, but.... let's just say I'm going on faith.
 

iMONITOR

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First 2 characters are the county number.
P = Police, F = Fire, E = EMS, EM = Emergency Management, COM = Common, SPEV = Special Event, EMER = Emergency Scene. There are plenty of others, but those are the most common ones, which were originally designated when the system was configured.
The 3-digit numbers that are used are the specific agency number, which are assigned by the state for both LEIN and crime stat reporting purposes. I can rattle off all the ones in my county, only because we have to use them for LEIN, so they get committed to memory after a while. Battle Creek PD is 237, so their talkgroups are 13P237, 237P911, 237TAC1, etc. I'd like to think (and so would the state, I imagine) that there is rhyme & reason to the TGID system, but.... let's just say I'm going on faith.

It's beginning to make more sense now. Thanks for posting!

Is there a list available showing Michigan's counties and their related 2 character county number?
 
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RadioSnoop

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First 2 characters are the county number.
P = Police, F = Fire, E = EMS, EM = Emergency Management, COM = Common, SPEV = Special Event, EMER = Emergency Scene. There are plenty of others, but those are the most common ones, which were originally designated when the system was configured.
The 3-digit numbers that are used are the specific agency number, which are assigned by the state for both LEIN and crime stat reporting purposes. I can rattle off all the ones in my county, only because we have to use them for LEIN, so they get committed to memory after a while. Battle Creek PD is 237, so their talkgroups are 13P237, 237P911, 237TAC1, etc. I'd like to think (and so would the state, I imagine) that there is rhyme & reason to the TGID system, but.... let's just say I'm going on faith.

Thank you!!!

I don’t suppose there’s a list of the agencies and their numbers somewhere...?
 

troymail

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Not incredibly helpful for folks who might be just visiting the area... and I though things like "1" or "Dispatch" as alpha tags were bad....

Apparently, alpha tagging talkgroups is a "local" thing that only means something to the locals... just more lack of consistency in the RRDB models.
 

opps2016

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There are a lot of tags that are listed incorrectly in the data base. However, when you see the 3 digit code as part of the tag it indicates the last 3 of the agency ORI, this scenario is more than likely a local Agency. If you see the 82P911 is more like a county TG.

The correct tag for Dearborn for example is 343PD01, not 82DBPD911.
 

w8fsm

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Page 2 of this doc has the naming standards that are to be followed on the system.
http://www.michigan.gov/documents/3...ation_and__Programming_Standards_165080_7.pdf

7 characters are the limit as that is the max the older radios supported. The network follows the least common supported config even know the newer radios do support more characters for channel names so that everybody is on the same page for interop.
 

mikey60

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Not incredibly helpful for folks who might be just visiting the area... and I though things like "1" or "Dispatch" as alpha tags were bad....

Apparently, alpha tagging talkgroups is a "local" thing that only means something to the locals... just more lack of consistency in the RRDB models.

Many of the alpha tags in the RRDB are the actual alpha tags on the system radios. The xxP911, xxF911, xxE911, and xxCOM are pretty consistent. Some of the local municipalities are probably incorrect because the agency code is unknown at the time.

Mike
 

troymail

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Page 2 of this doc has the naming standards that are to be followed on the system.
http://www.michigan.gov/documents/3...ation_and__Programming_Standards_165080_7.pdf

7 characters are the limit as that is the max the older radios supported. The network follows the least common supported config even know the newer radios do support more characters for channel names so that everybody is on the same page for interop.

That 10+ year old document intentionally uses a talkgroup encoding scheme based on this statement:

For interoperability purposes, talkgroup names are limited to seven (7) characters or less due the display capacity of some models of mobile radios.
I believe the RRDB and most scanners are 16+ character displays which would allow for more obvious and useful names.

Having to be aware of/know the "encoding" scheme and/or look things up all the time is kind of self-defeating....
 

opps2016

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Although I realize a lot of this is put together by contributors there are a bunch of errors.

Westland PD is WLPD

Dearborn Hgts is DHPD

Warren PD is 50WRPD

Eastpointe and St Clair Shores is 50EPSS1

Just to name a few off top of my head.
 

m297

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What folks need to realize when this system came online it wasn't intended to be for other agencies it was intended to be for the State Police. Then it developed into the system we have today.

I agree there are significant errors in reporting tags.
 
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Ronaldski

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There are a lot of tags that are listed incorrectly in the data base. However, when you see the 3 digit code as part of the tag it indicates the last 3 of the agency ORI, this scenario is more than likely a local Agency. If you see the 82P911 is more like a county TG.

The correct tag for Dearborn for example is 343PD01, not 82DBPD911.

I agree there a significant errors in reporting tags.

The database is mostly updated by all users on this website like you. If you or anyone see items that are wrong please submit the updates and we can get to work fixing 'em up! :)

Go to the database section that you found and you will see near the top and middle, the SUBMIT tab. list out all the items needing updating and the fixes and then click Submit Data
it can also be done at the county level for items that are analog needing to be updated,
 

drdispatch

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I believe the RRDB and most scanners are 16+ character displays which would allow for more obvious and useful names.

Having to be aware of/know the "encoding" scheme and/or look things up all the time is kind of self-defeating....
True, but most users would tend to identify channels or talkgroups by whatever information appears on their radio's display. If you hear an officer say: "Go to 13COM", it's probably because that's what the radio displays when you turn it to that talkgroup.
A lot of agencies are still using the radios they bought when they joined the system; in my county's case, that's 12 years.
 
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drdispatch

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What folks need to realize when this system came online it wasn't intended to be for other agencies it was intended to be for the State Police. Then it developed into the system we have today.

I agree there are significant errors in reporting tags.
+1 on all of that...
 
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