Charlotte NC Anti-mobile scanner code

[Phillipsc84]

I wanted to start a topic to get some thoughts from anyone about the Charlotte city code that makes scanners installed in vehicles illegal inside Charlotte. The code goes like this:

"It shall be unlawful for any person to equip or operate inside the city any motor vehicle with a high frequency police radio receivingset, unless such motor vehicle is being used by the federal, state, city or county government; by a law enforcement officer; or a permit for the use of the high frequency police radio receiving set shall be granted as prescribed in this article."

The definition of a police radio receiving set is this:

"High frequency police radio receiving set means any radio receiving set capable of transmitting or receiving any police radio messages"

That is section 15-51 of the city code of ordinances. Does anyone else feel like this goes against the FCC created federal laws that permit such use. Especially for licensed amature radio operators? Unless of course it's in the cell phone range.

There is a provision in here for getting a "permit" but it bassicaly states that you have to submit a written request to the chief and if he feels there is a need then he will grant a permit for a year.

 

[TheMadScanner]

WOW, I find it hard to believe that they would enforce this in the town of the race track where just about everyone has a scanner to listen to the races. I'm not 100% sure and I'm definitely no lawyer, but it seems to me that under the Supremacy Clause, the Federal Laws would supersede the local ordinance.

Supremacy Clause
There is often some disagreement over which laws--local or federal--prevail in the case of a contradiction. Generally speaking, the U.S. Constitution states clearly that federal laws are to govern in those cases where they contradict with local laws like city ordinances. But the 10th Amendment gives states the exclusive right to make laws in any area not specifically provided to the federal government in the Constitution. There are constitutional limits to the areas federal law can cover, and courts have sometimes ruled that the federal government has gone too far in asserting its legal powers over local laws.

Being a licensed HAM myself, I would fight it if necessary. I just read the ordinances and it says in order to get a permit you have to be finger printed and photographed as well as have the make and model of your vehicle including the VIN logged. I would have thought this was a joke if I didn't see it for myself!

 

[KC4YIN]

So what's to happen to the poor unsuspecting souls who have scanners and don't live in Charlotte and just drive through and get caught? This is gonna get UGLY!!!

 

[Phillipsc84]

I couldn't believe it myself either but believe it or not I was with a friend a few years ago who was questioned by CMPD about the scanner and given a ticket which REQUIRED a court appearance for the scanner. It is apparently a misdemeanor. He was also later told, in an unrelated incident, by a CMPD officer that it was illegal to own antennas similar to the ones on police vehicles!

 

[rdale]

Looks like the law Michigan had for many years, which finally was changed 2 years back. Nothing illegal about it.

 

[KC4YIN]

I couldn't believe it myself either but believe it or not I was with a friend a few years ago who was questioned by CMPD about the scanner and given a ticket which REQUIRED a court appearance for the scanner. It is apparently a misdemeanor. He was also later told, in an unrelated incident, by a CMPD officer that it was illegal to own antennas similar to the ones on police vehicles!

So what have they done? Gone completely paranoid.
i was not aware they had this law. I guess then it's o.k. to have a scanner in your house in the city limits?

 

[rdale]

No agency can outlaw a scanner in your home.

 

[Zagadka]

No agency can outlaw a scanner in your home.

Not yet...

 

[KM4WLV]

I live in Salisbury which is 30 minutes north of Charlotte. My wife works in Charlotte and I'm down there on a regular basis to visit her at work & such. I'd hate to think I get a ticket for it, or them to tell me it's illegal to own antennas similar to those used by PD. If it was illegal they wouldn't be offered for sale. I don't see how the hell they can enforce that code, especially for those who live outside the city & aren't aware of it.

Sounds like a buncha stupid to me.

 

[rdale]

There's nothing to prevent them from enforcing it. As I mentioned, that was the case in Michigan for decades and it was enforced.

 

[geoff5093]

Where it states "or a permit for the use of the high frequency police radio receiving set shall be granted as prescribed in this article", are they requiring you to get a permit through them, or does a HAM radio license qualify as a permit?

 

[WA4MJF]

With the words high frequency, it sounds like an ole law. By and large, the police abandoned high frequency radios many, many moons ago. It is still illegal in CA to have a mobile receiver that can hear the high frequency police bands (2500 - 3000 kHz) and very high frequency police bands (30Mcs-40Mcs and 150 Mcs to 160 Mcs). I think most of CHP is above 40 mHz now and most other agencies are on UHF there, but the law is still on the books. Probably not enforced in Charlotte any more than it is in CA.

 

[rdale]

are they requiring you to get a permit through them

I think this covers your question, which I found in the first post.

There is a provision in here for getting a "permit" but it bassicaly states that you have to submit a written request to the chief and if he feels there is a need then he will grant a permit for a year.

 

[JoeyC]

Does anyone else feel like this goes against the FCC created federal laws that permit such use. Especially for licensed amature radio operators? Unless of course it's in the cell phone range.

There are no such things as laws permitting a certain action.
It sounds like an archaeic law - still on the books - that is perfectly legal for them to utilize under the proper circumstances.

 

[JoeyC]

I don't see how the hell they can enforce that code, especially for those who live outside the city & aren't aware of it.

Sounds like a buncha stupid to me.

Ignorance of a law is not a defense.

 

[nitroboie]

My first time hearing about this, I wonder how many officers know about it (or care enough) to charge you for it during a stop... then again, they can't charge you for something they don't see ;-)

 

[DMSROX]

Laws made by people who don't understand technology.

Even though this does concern me, especially if they have not exempted Hams, but it also made me laugh.

Does this mean smart phones that can play streaming audio sites featuring Publuc Safety frequencies are now outlawed in Charlotte. What about my iPhone with it's scanner apps or my iPad with apps?

There's nothing like a law or ordinance that "fixes" a non-existent problem.

Donnie
KE4GYN

 

[yardbird]

I would not worry about it!

I have two scanners and two two way radios in my truck and nobody has ever said a word to me about either one of them.

Heck I even have one scanner on the desk at work.

I have even had CMPD Officers stop by to talk and chat, and they have never said a work about any laws about mobile scanner monitoring.

Matter of fact I travel all over the state and have two mobile antennas mounted on my truck. Knock on wood, I have never had any problems out of the Highway Patrol or Local Police. I even have my clear Whelen Talon dash light on the windshield as well.

Most of the time they ride by me and throw up there hand and keep on moving.

David

 

[yardbird]

Well to sum this up!

I just had a State Trooper pull up the laws for the City of Charlotte.

And there is in fact a law on the books about operating a mobile scanner in the city.

I goes to say that you need a permit to operate one. If you need to operate one in a vehicle you need to make application to the Chief of Police of the Charlotte-Mecklenburg Police Department.

It states in the ordinace that you must provide them with the following:

1. Name of applicant
2. License tag Number
3. Model and Make of Motor Vehicle in which unit will be installed
4. Photogragh and Fingerprints
5. And reason for wanting a mobile scanner in a vehicle

If the permit is granted, then it must be renewed every year.

These came from the City of Charlotte Municipal Code Numbers Sec. 15-51 through Sec.15-55

If I am looking at this right the code says "Code 1985"

I really wouldn't worry about it that much, because I have never been approached or stopped by CMPD for scanner check or anything else.

This information came from the following address:

Municode - Search Screen

Hope this sheads some light on the subject

I will keep digging and report what I can find out.

David

 

[W2NJS]

There is a specific FCC exemption for licensed amateur radio operators from ANY local law prohibiting possession or use of a radio in a vehicle when the radio is a ham transceiver that incidentally also receives public service transmissions. It was and is intended to handle situations such as this. I carry a copy of it with me in the car at all times. The actual document is Docket 91-36 (a.k.a., FCC 93-410) which goes into excruciating detail about the history of the situation and reasons why the FCC has decided to exempt amateur radio transceivers. The document does NOT cover scanners at all, only ham transceivers.