Towers built everywhere now. why?

[stlouisx50]

I have discovered more towers and antennas all over the place. Some as trees, inside of billboards, water towers on buildings, just all over. I realize they have been located in theses spots in the past, but now you will find them close to every block you're on.

In 2015 a study showed 90% of American adults own a cell phone. So I could see more antennas/towers being built for coverage, but it's in excess. There is no possible way they are all cell towers.

Pager use has declined big time so we know it's not that.

Personal radio/ Business radio use including Amateur radio seem to be used less and less too. You rarely see anyone holding a handheld radio to their face, or a mic from a mobile radio.

Many cell phone companies has moved to leasing towers , so doing a look-up for a specific cell company will not help narrow anything down. But you can however see the many that do, and realize it does not take a tower on every corner to cover an area or an areas use, it would simply be overkill.

So this leaves me to question, just what are all these towers and antennas being used for?

 

[bfperez]

My guess is smaller cell size enabling higher bandwidth per device.

It's just not possible to give everyone 100mbps (or whatever) per device if you have large cells with high client device counts.

 

[stlouisx50]

Is there a site that shows what each type of tower antenna would be used for? Back in the Police Call book days, they listed towers and antennas by band. There has got to be something like that now.

Something that could be used to identify The 800 Mhz towers, Relay Towers, LTE, G3. G4 and soon to be G5, etc.

 

[jim202]

There has been a big push over the last number of years to gripe, yell, scream, jump up and down in front of public zoning officials that they don't want these big ugly radio towers near them. It's called "NIMBY" (Not In My Back Yard) by all the cellular carries. These people are also complaining to the cell companies that their cell phone doesn't work everywhere, yet they don't want these towers put up. Sorry, you can't have it both ways.

No towers means poor coverage for the cell phones. The next step was to try and hide the antennas by making the mono poles look like trees. This too has had it's problems. I can attest to the problem first hand as I was one of those people responsible for installing the cell sites a number of years back. We had this one neighborhood that was told at a meeting that a tree was going to be put up. There was this one person that said it couldn't go over 90 feet. That was lower than the surrounding trees. So he was asked to at least allow a few more feet to allow the installation be done correctly, but still allow for a good signal coverage. Nope, he insisted it couldn't go over the 90 feet. The zoning board gave him his wish.

So we started construction. Got everything ready. Foundation poured for the mono pole, fence started and the shelter foundation installed. On Saturday morning at 8 AM, the crane showed up. They set the crane up, set the mono pole and placed the shelter on it's foundation. The tower crew was there and they put the arms on the mono pole with the branches. By Sunday noon, it was all done. There was this 90 foot tall mono pole that didn't go over 90 feet. But what the person that fought the project didn't realize was that all the top branches that would normally be installed to round the tree off were all not installed. What he got was a 90 foot tall steel tree that looked like someone went up there and used a chain saw to cut the top off of the steel tree. He got what he asked for but didn't expect it would look like it ended up as. Now some 10 years later, that mono pole still looks the same with the flat top.

He yelled and went to the zoning board. They told him that the top of the tower didn't go over 90 feet just like he demanded. Being that the work was done over the weekend, there was no one at the zoning office that was available to come out and issue a stop work order.

The moral of the story here is be careful what you are asking for. The results may not be what you expected.

As for all the antennas showing up behind bill boards, on the top corners of buildings, in church steeples and where ever another high place may seem like a good choice, remember the neighbors got what they asked for. No towers in their back yard.

 

[jim202]

Is there a site that shows what each type of tower antenna would be used for? Back in the Police Call book days, they listed towers and antennas by band. There has got to be something like that now.

Something that could be used to identify The 800 Mhz towers, Relay Towers, LTE, G3. G4 and soon to be G5, etc.

I missed on answering one of your questions. Most of the cellular antennas used on the lower sites are what is called a panel antenna. These look like a long, gray, rectangular box that generally will have multiple panels pointing in the same direction. They can range in length from about a foot to as long as 8 feet. You will also find that if it is set up for sector operation, you will find there will be 3 groups of the antennas set up in a 120 degree sector mount.

I have used the term "cellular" antennas as this covers a multitude of uses. Weather it is the normal cellular, LTE or what ever, you should be seeing the same style antenna used by most of the companies. The size may vary with the gain they have, but they all do the same function.

If your seeing a thick stick that's about 20 feet long, you may be looking at a public safety or other land mobile operation using the 700, 800 or even 900 MHz. bands. These come in many sizes and lengths. The longer the round stick, the more gain. We just installed some 11.5 db gain omni antennas for a public safety, P25 trunking system. These were 22 feet long and about 5 or 6 inches in diameter at their base.

 

[stlouisx50]

@Jim Then that leads me to believe most of the antennas around the St. Louis metro area are not Cell antennas. I know the "cell antennas" that you mention. But there are more and more round, drum looking type of antennas ranging from high up on towers to low. On 1 side of towers are on all 4 sides. I have seen what the 800mhz p25 trunking towers look like around the area. However there are always additional systems that build on the same tower so it can be confusing.

I have figured the utility companies most likely have a big tower network set up too for the "smart meters".

All the towers, shapes , sizes, elevations just make me question, what they are.

 

[N4GIX]

Is there a site that shows what each type of tower antenna would be used for? Back in the Police Call book days, they listed towers and antennas by band. There has got to be something like that now.

Something that could be used to identify The 800 Mhz towers, Relay Towers, LTE, G3. G4 and soon to be G5, etc.

Have fun here searching out all towers and antennas anywhere in the U.S.
AntennaSearch - Search for Cell Towers, Cell Reception, Hidden Antennas and more.

 

[12dbsinad]

One thing you have to keep in mind is that cell towers have very short range per given tower. So, a 800 Mhz public safety system co-located on the same tower as say Verizon, may have a usable range of lets say a 10 mile radius. The Verizon cell system may have a radius of only 1.5 - 2 mile radius, or sometimes less if it's a micro site.

Newer technology LTE 4G require even more sites then 3G. It runs at a much lower power among other things. A lot of carriers are still running both 3G and LTE systems together on the same tower. Not only did they do that for transitioning the handsets over to LTE, but they also do it because of better coverage in areas not saturated with tower sites. Also, a lot of carriers are using 8' "radio head" panel antenna's. Meaning the RF equipment is built into the antenna and not in the shelter.

Many City's are also deploying WiFi systems, which need sites. Plus smart meters, electric, gas, wireless security systems, the list goes on and on. That's why you see towers galore.

 

[ecps92]

Police Call never listed site (Lat/Lon or Address) info :roll:
They did however indicate the Transmitter City

There are plenty of resources to find who owns a tower and likely who might me using the tower, via the FCC at

Site / Market / Frequency Query or even go to

Radio-Locator
ASR Registration Search
AntennaSearch - Search for Cell Towers, Cell Reception, Hidden Antennas and more.

Is there a site that shows what each type of tower antenna would be used for? Back in the Police Call book days, they listed towers and antennas by band. There has got to be something like that now.

Something that could be used to identify The 800 Mhz towers, Relay Towers, LTE, G3. G4 and soon to be G5, etc.

 

[SCPD]

How to put out a tower welcome mat

About 3 or 4 years ago, someone wanted to put a tall tower up just outside Ida Michigan. The usual zoning board meeting was held, objections were heard, wah wah, you know the routine.
Then someone from the audience stood and asked the tower people "I heard a rumor you're gonna put a free WiFi hotspot on top of the tower that will cover the village. Is this true?". The people from the tower company looked at each other with a "what the ..?" look on their face. A couple of seconds went by, then someone from the tower people thought quick and said "Why most certainly, we had planned on giving free WiFi to everyone in town".
The audience started saying "Free internet? Did he just say free internet?" The mood of the meeting did a 180 and the tower got approved.

 

[ChetsJug]

It's a Communist plot!

 

[cmdrwill]

Cell palms and Cell pines.

 

[nd5y]

But there are more and more round, drum looking type of antennas ranging from high up on towers to low.

Those are parabolic reflector (dish) antennas with side shields and covers.

 

[cmdrwill]

Those are parabolic reflector (dish) antennas with side shields and covers.

The microwave links between Cell sites,

 

[Project25_MASTR]

Big ones are going to bee LMR, cell and in rural areas WISP.

Cellular and WISP generally use 120 or 100 degree sectors depending on application for access points. By sectorizing the system you increase loading capacity without having throughput suffer. Also by sectorizing the receiver on the AP only has to listen for the subscribers in its beam width (think of looking for a fox in a field if your standing in the middle versus looking from a corner).

Point to point is where the real magic happens (I'm honestly not kidding). It's all about gain and link budget for backhauls. Doing that you'll lean it's all about antenna and not really about transmit power...most people don't believe me when I tell them most microwave links are less than a watt.

Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk

 

[mmckenna]

Point to point is where the real magic happens (I'm honestly not kidding). It's all about gain and link budget for backhauls. Doing that you'll lean it's all about antenna and not really about transmit power...most people don't believe me when I tell them most microwave links are less than a watt.

I think if people new to radios could understand this it would be great. So much $ is wasted on transmitter power, linear amplifiers, golden screwdrivers, etc.
A 300mw cell phone can work over several miles because of excellent antennas at the cell site.
We have point to point data links at work running miles using just a few milliwatts of power.

Taking a page from the cell site book of design, scanner listeners, GMRS and amateur operators could all learn something valuable. Good coax, good antennas = some pretty amazing stuff.

 

[Project25_MASTR]

I think if people new to radios could understand this it would be great. So much $ is wasted on transmitter power, linear amplifiers, golden screwdrivers, etc.
A 300mw cell phone can work over several miles because of excellent antennas at the cell site.
We have point to point data links at work running miles using just a few milliwatts of power.

Taking a page from the cell site book of design, scanner listeners, GMRS and amateur operators could all learn something valuable. Good coax, good antennas = some pretty amazing stuff.

I've got a 19 mile shot using unlicensed 5 GHz equipment right now. Each transmitter is pushing 1/2 W...still putting 78 Mbps over it.

Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk

 

[kayn1n32008]

A 300mw cell phone can work over several miles because of excellent antennas at the cell site.

We have point to point data links at work running miles using just a few milliwatts of power.



Taking a page from the cell site book of design, scanner listeners, GMRS and amateur operators could all learn something valuable. Good coax, good antennas = some pretty amazing stuff.

A member here does trouble shooting for one of the cell carriers in Alberta, and has had customer having issues with HSPA on 1900MHz, hearing, and locking onto a site in excess of 60km, in the -90 to -80dBm range, causing the user to not be able to register on 800Mhz site under 10km away.

Can we say 'add some down tilt!' In all reality, when the transceivers are tower mounted, feedline loss is almost zero!

 

[mmckenna]

Can we say 'add some down tilt!' In all reality, when the transceivers are tower mounted, feedline loss is almost zero!

Excellent point. Forgot to consider that.

 

[kayn1n32008]

Excellent point. Forgot to consider that.

This particular instance, the site was on high ground, at the top of a 100m tower, with the terrain to the customer sloping down. Likely the site would be receivable for a great deal further on 1900Mhz, the customer was out side the site maximum distance threshold.