Question: Filters sds100-200

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Vinnie1224

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I’ve purchased the sds100 about 2 1/2 weeks ago. Now when I’m on vhf & uhf it seems wide normal is the best. Has anyone had better performance on any other one ? An for me 800 mhz band it’s wide invert ? Is there a print out that uniden made for filters ? Because in the user’s manual I don’t see nothing that explains which filters to use for what band to listen to an adjust it . Well thank you for looking an hope to hear some great feedback .
 

SteveSimpkin

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The filter settings were added in firmware after the manual was released. They were added to help with signals that interfer with what you are trying to listen to in your particular location. You need to experiment with the setting that works best for your listening situation at your location.
 

Vinnie1224

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The filter settings were added in firmware after the manual was released. They were added to help with signals that interfer with what you are trying to listen to in your particular location. You need to experiment with the setting that works best for your listening situation at your location.
Yea I understand that but I’ve tryed all of them an still do not get in Burlington co public safety.
 

kruser

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Yea I understand that but I’ve tryed all of them an still do not get in Burlington co public safety.

Many trunked systems today are built using directional antennas that purposely only cover the area they need signal.
This allows for frequencies to be reused by other agencies not as far away as the old days. This seems to apply to simulcast systems very often.

I have trunked systems here that are lucky to be heard not even 10 miles away if you are outside of the intended coverage area.
Sometimes a yagi will help along with a high quality preamp made for just the band of interest and sometimes there is simply no signal to work with. I'm not totally familiar with your area but this could be your issue with Burlington County.
 

Vinnie1224

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Many trunked systems today are built using directional antennas that purposely only cover the area they need signal.
This allows for frequencies to be reused by other agencies not as far away as the old days. This seems to apply to simulcast systems very often.

I have trunked systems here that are lucky to be heard not even 10 miles away if you are outside of the intended coverage area.
Sometimes a yagi will help along with a high quality preamp made for just the band of interest and sometimes there is simply no signal to work with. I'm not totally familiar with your area but this could be your issue with Burlington County.
I am right near the tower that I get reception from and I have a Wilson yagi & a comet antenna up 41 feet in the air so don’t understand I did receive Burlington co like a week ago but nothing now .
 

kruser

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I am right near the tower that I get reception from and I have a Wilson yagi & a comet antenna up 41 feet in the air so don’t understand I did receive Burlington co like a week ago but nothing now .

An overload problem maybe? Have you tried turning attenuation on for that site being so close. I've definitely needed to run attenuation on a site or two just down the road from me with the SDS models. Filter settings don't always work for super strong signals but once the signal is tamed down, then different filter setting need to be tried.
 

Vinnie1224

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An overload problem maybe? Have you tried turning attenuation on for that site being so close. I've definitely needed to run attenuation on a site or two just down the road from me with the SDS models. Filter settings don't always work for super strong signals but once the signal is tamed down, then different filter setting need to be tried.
Yes I did that as well just don’t understand. Thank you for the feedback Kruger .
 

kruser

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Yes I did that as well just don’t understand. Thank you for the feedback Kruger .

One suggestion while you are figuring all this out, make backups of your SD card every day or so. That gives you a pretty easy way to revert back to when it was working just in case it was one of those stupid mistakes we all make!

I used to do that when I was figuring out my first x36HP models. I still make card backups fairly often to this day but more for the reason that SD cards can just up and die on ya.

Hope you figure it out.
 

trentbob

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Hey Vinnie I was just wondering... Are you talking about Burlington County New Jersey type II smartzone system? I live right across the river from Burlington City and listen to the Bordentown (North) and Westampton (North Central) Towers. I monitor P1, P3 and P4. I might be misunderstanding something, from Norristown, PA you are nowhere close to any Tower in the Burlington County 500 megahertz type II smartzone system and I cannot imagine you picking them up on a regular basis. I can imagine maybe once in a while if the atmospheric conditions are correct and all the stars are aligned you might get something but it would be amazing if you pick them up on a regular basis.

As far as the filters go there is a ton of information on RR if you Google it. I know I have written several extensive posts explaining the use of the filters. The thread that is quoted here I go into the use of IFX and what it is.

As far as the filters go, it makes no sense for me to tell you what I use for Philly or Burco or for conventional frequency because it's your RF environment that dictates what filter works best. There is no constant on a particular system when you are in different RF environments. What works for me may not work for you.

Anyway if you could clarify for me if you were talking about Burlington New Jersey? I think I may have misunderstood when you said there was a tower down the street in Norristown, Pa.
 

trentbob

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Okay Vinnie I just looked at a map and it would be definitely the Mount Laurel Tower that you would be receiving, I can't imagine any other Burlington County Tower you could reach. So here's what I would do...

Go into the Burlington County system and lock out all other sites other than the Mount Laurel site... Leaving Global filter on normal and it's normal for a reason drill down to the Mount Laurel site and change the filter from global to invert and see if that gives you any bars, use the RSSI and see what your reading is, then do the same with wide invert, then do the same with wide normal and see which filter works best on the Mount Laurel site. I would avoid using the auto filters as they sample each filter and slow your scanning way down. I would also think turning the filter off would not be the best choice here but you can always try it.

See if that helps you receive Burlington County. If you do get the Mount Laurel site that's a pretty good trip!
 

Vinnie1224

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Okay Vinnie I just looked at a map and it would be definitely the Mount Laurel Tower that you would be receiving, I can't imagine any other Burlington County Tower you could reach. So here's what I would do...

Go into the Burlington County system and lock out all other sites other than the Mount Laurel site... Leaving Global filter on normal and it's normal for a reason drill down to the Mount Laurel site and change the filter from global to invert and see if that gives you any bars, use the RSSI and see what your reading is, then do the same with wide invert, then do the same with wide normal and see which filter works best on the Mount Laurel site. I would avoid using the auto filters as they sample each filter and slow your scanning way down. I would also think turning the filter off would not be the best choice here but you can always try it.

See if that helps you receive Burlington County. If you do get the Mount Laurel site that's a pretty good trip!
Good morning bob... must be something in the air today I’m getting Burlington co it’s weird because I usually get bulington co at night but just turned on like 15 mins ago and boom there it was getting things I’ll send a pic of what I did receive. I just looked an had the filters on wide normal it seems to work best . Thank you for your time
 

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Vinnie1224

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Norristown pa
Hey Vinnie I was just wondering... Are you talking about Burlington County New Jersey type II smartzone system? I live right across the river from Burlington City and listen to the Bordentown (North) and Westampton (North Central) Towers. I monitor P1, P3 and P4. I might be misunderstanding something, from Norristown, PA you are nowhere close to any Tower in the Burlington County 500 megahertz type II smartzone system and I cannot imagine you picking them up on a regular basis. I can imagine maybe once in a while if the atmospheric conditions are correct and all the stars are aligned you might get something but it would be amazing if you pick them up on a regular basis.

As far as the filters go there is a ton of information on RR if you Google it. I know I have written several extensive posts explaining the use of the filters. The thread that is quoted here I go into the use of IFX and what it is.

As far as the filters go, it makes no sense for me to tell you what I use for Philly or Burco or for conventional frequency because it's your RF environment that dictates what filter works best. There is no constant on a particular system when you are in different RF environments. What works for me may not work for you.

Anyway if you could clarify for me if you were talking about Burlington New Jersey? I think I may have misunderstood when you said there was a tower down the street in Norristown, Pa.
Hello , yes I was taking about the tower down the road from me in lower providence pa I’m on the border line of Norristown & lower providence. There is a town on 50 eagleville rd an that like 1 1/2 away. It’s a 911 tower I believe I guess it’s just for Montgomery co digital simulcast like I said I’m new don’t really know but there is definitely a tower up the road from me .
 

Vinnie1224

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Hello , yes I was taking about the tower down the road from me in lower providence pa I’m on the border line of Norristown & lower providence. There is a town on 50 eagleville rd an that like 1 1/2 away. It’s a 911 tower I believe I guess it’s just for Montgomery co digital simulcast like I said I’m new don’t really know but there is definitely a tower up the road from me .
Hey Vinnie I was just wondering... Are you talking about Burlington County New Jersey type II smartzone system? I live right across the river from Burlington City and listen to the Bordentown (North) and Westampton (North Central) Towers. I monitor P1, P3 and P4. I might be misunderstanding something, from Norristown, PA you are nowhere close to any Tower in the Burlington County 500 megahertz type II smartzone system and I cannot imagine you picking them up on a regular basis. I can imagine maybe once in a while if the atmospheric conditions are correct and all the stars are aligned you might get something but it would be amazing if you pick them up on a regular basis.

As far as the filters go there is a ton of information on RR if you Google it. I know I have written several extensive posts explaining the use of the filters. The thread that is quoted here I go into the use of IFX and what it is.

As far as the filters go, it makes no sense for me to tell you what I use for Philly or Burco or for conventional frequency because it's your RF environment that dictates what filter works best. There is no constant on a particular system when you are in different RF environments. What works for me may not work for you.

Anyway if you could clarify for me if you were talking about Burlington New Jersey? I think I may have misunderstood when you said there was a tower down the street in Norristown, Pa.
Hello , yes I was taking about the tower down the road from me in lower providence pa I’m on the border line of Norristown & lower providence. There is a town on 50 eagleville rd an that like 1 1/2 away. It’s a 911 tower I believe I guess it’s just for Montgomery co digital simulcast like I said I’m new don’t really know but there is definitely a tower up the road from me .
I meant up the road from me *
 

trentbob

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Okay Vinnie, look at you... picking up Burlington County. Good pictures, easy to read even on their side.

I have made some observations from the pictures and have a couple of questions.

I am assuming you're not doing this every day and that it only happens intermittently. Looking at your RSSI and s meter you're right on the line and I'm wondering if you're even getting broken Transmissions or missed Transmissions, you wouldn't really know about the missed Transmissions because you're missing them LOL. What antenna are you using, is this the yagi?

I've also noticed something else, you have not programmed this system in a favorites list, you are simply doing a search on the database with your ZIP code. I noticed that you don't have any favorites list numbered in the upper left-hand corner of the screen.

Everything I told you about applying different filters to different sites, it's not applicable here as when you search the database it will just scroll through all the sites in the system. When you say that you are on wide normal filter you are obviously referring to the global filter which is going to put every single object you listen to anywhere on wide normal.

The reason I was asking about if you were using the yagi is the only site I see in the photos is Medford (west). Believe it or not the Medford site is a little further away from the closest site to you which would be Mount Laurel except Mount Laurel is north of Medford.

So that is one heck of a mast you have and and it appears well-positioned with regards to what's around it. Forgive me but I don't remember if you had another antenna other than the yaggie.

As far as a full tutorial on the use of the filters, it's kind of premature for you on that now until you actually establish and number favorites list. Then you can leave Global filter on normal which means that will be the filter for every object that you don't go into and customize. Systems are customized by going into the individual sites and assigning a filter which would overrides the global filter. Conventional objects, you go into the department settings that that conventional object is in and change the filters in that department options overriding the global filter, unfortunately that changes the filter on all of the objects in that department but you can get around that by the way you program the department.

I'm assuming that you did not own one of the X36 series. If you did that is a great advantage as people who are familiar with the 436 and the 536 never even open the manual of the SDS radios.

It would be good to work on programming your radio using Sentinel and establishing favorites lists and numbering them. Those numbers will appear in the top row on the left top of your screen. You will be able to label your favorites list as you wish, you might want to limit each favorites list to one system like Philadelphia, Montgomery etc etc. Establishing favorites list will allow you to customize your systems especially with regard to locking out unnecessary sites, applying specific filters to specific sites, applying system hold times etc etc.

There is so much on RR that will show you exactly how to do this. You can search RR or you can even just Google it and it'll take you to the threads that will explain these things. As far as starting a favorites list your manual should be adequate. Don't worry about the second and third line on the top left of your screen. Just work on the favorites list first. Assigning them a number and naming them using Sentinel.

Just a hint, you do this in Sentinel and that's how you basically set yourself up but after you do that you can always make changes like on filters and system hold times right on the radio which for me sometimes is just easier because I do it spontaneously but... The first thing you do when you hook up to Sentinel again after making the changes is copy the data card to your configuration on your profile so as to save the changes you made manually on the radio.

Geez that was a long post. Hope it makes sense... Bob.
 
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bearcat

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The filter settings were added in firmware after the manual was released. They were added to help with signals that interfer with what you are trying to listen to in your particular location. You need to experiment with the setting that works best for your listening situation at your location.
These filters make me curious as to their function. A highpass/lowpass filter eliminates signals above/below a specific freq. Since these filters are applied to all the freqs in a site or all of the conventional freqs in a department. I question how effective they can be. They may even be filtering freqs that I want to hear. If they were freq specific I would then understand their function. A site or conventional dept may contain freqs that are several or even many mhz a part. I sure wish we had more technically specific information on what they do. Frankly I see no difference no matter which one I use, except for reduction in scan speed.
 

trentbob

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These filters make me curious as to their function. A highpass/lowpass filter eliminates signals above/below a specific freq. Since these filters are applied to all the freqs in a site or all of the conventional freqs in a department. I question how effective they can be. They may even be filtering freqs that I want to hear. If they were freq specific I would then understand their function. A site or conventional dept may contain freqs that are several or even many mhz a part. I sure wish we had more technically specific information on what they do. Frankly I see no difference no matter which one I use, except for reduction in scan speed.
Hello... I have spoken to the o p in private conversation and he's going to get his Radio setup and at some point I'm going to come back and do a tutorial on the filters on this thread.

I've done it several times before as have many others on other threads and they can be seen in the archives. I don't want to get bogged down in the weeds here with anybody but...

The filters work, they have made all the difference for many people especially P1 and P 2 simulcast systems, they also work great on type II smartzone systems.

The only filters that slow down scanning are the auto filters which sample each filter, I would avoid them. The filters have also helped with the less-than-stellar VHF and UHF conventional reception on the SDS series.

How do they work? Uniden has been clear that they're not going to reveal what's in the sausage. I guess that has to do with their competitor if you can call them that.

I'm a believer because when I first got my sds100 before the filters had been introduced, my radio ended up in a drawer, I couldn't use it because it didn't work on my single site, multiple Tower tdma P2 simulcast system. I had clipped Transmissions and missed Transmissions and had to use a system hold time of 4 minutes to make my simulcast system work which precluded me from using the radio for anything else, I went back to using my Mot gear.

When the first round of filters was introduced in a firmware update and I tried invert on the single simulcast site of my system it was a freaking miracle.

I'm a believer.
 
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Anderegg

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Best way I have found to determine the best filter for trunked systems, is to identify which trunked frequencies you have issues with, program them as conventional,a nd throw the filters one at a time at them under "department" until you get the best performance and error rate. It's harder to determine filters during trunking because you get a different frequency each time.

Paul
 

bearcat

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Hello... I have spoken to the o p in private conversation and he's going to get his Radio setup and at some point I'm going to come back and do a tutorial on the filters on this thread.

I've done it several times before as have many others on other threads and they can be seen in the archives. I don't want to get bogged down in the weeds here with anybody but...

The filters work, they have made all the difference for many people especially P1 and P 2 simulcast systems, they also work great on type II smartzone systems.

The only filters that slow down scanning are the auto filters which sample each filter, I would avoid them. The filters have also helped with the less-than-stellar VHF and UHF conventional reception on the SDS series.

How do they work? Uniden has been clear that they're not going to reveal what's in the sausage. I guess that has to do with their competitor if you can call them that.

I'm a believer because when I first got my sds100 before the filters had been introduced, my radio ended up in a drawer, I couldn't use it because it didn't work on my single site, multiple Tower tdma P2 simulcast system. I had clipped Transmissions and missed Transmissions and had to use a system hold time of 4 minutes to make my simulcast system work which precluded me from using the radio for anything else, I went back to using my Mot gear.

When the first round of filters was introduced in a firmware update and I tried invert on the single simulcast site of my system it was a freaking miracle.

I'm a believer.
Based on your statement that they are no going to reveal the technical side of the filters, assuming they are high/low pass may not even be accurate. That makes much more sense to me. I do not monitor any systems in my area that do not work. So I would not expect to see any real differences using them. Thanks for the explanation.
 

trentbob

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Based on your statement that they are no going to reveal the technical side of the filters, assuming they are high/low pass may not even be accurate. That makes much more sense to me. I do not monitor any systems in my area that do not work. So I would not expect to see any real differences using them. Thanks for the explanation.
yes I see filter use as more of troubleshooting a problem rather than something you need to use on every object you listen to. In a lot of cases they make no difference whatsoever.

Leaving Global on normal there by applying normal filter to every object unless otherwise modified probably works best for most, there have been reports of people turning off Global filters and getting Optimal Performance.

If someone has an issue with a system or conventional Channel That's when you start fiddling with specific filters on those objects with problems. (y)
 

Anderegg

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Uniden should relabel them "level adjustments"...with arbitrary numbers next to them...that would make better sense. :-|

Paul
 
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