536 and HP1 not receiving local P25 system

[brumey]

Hello:
I have the same post in the local area forum but I thought I'd expand to the Uniden experts in the hope of a solution.

Hello:
I have the Uniden 536, HP1 and SDS-100. Using the same favorite lists, SRRCS and SRRCS P25 (Sacramento, CA), same antenna, same location, I can only receive the P25 on my SDS-100. I think I have checked all the obvious (Attenuation, Services, Range, etc). I am using the same lists and profile for both radios.

When I put both in Analyze, the SDS-100 shows a healthy S, Q and A. The 536 has a little signal but no Q or A. I am 45 miles from downtown Sac but on a hill with clear views into the valley. I have an HP1 scanner which exibits the same issue, receiving on the SRRCS (moto SmartNet II) but not the SRRCS P25. The 536 does not show system ID's in analyze mode. The SDS-100, even with rubber duch shows ID's. Its driving me nuts.

Both the 536 and HP1 do receive P25 from other systems.

Is the SDS-100 that much better for P25? I know I can put the rubber duck antenna on it and leave the discone connected to the 536 and HP1 and still get SRRCS P25 on the SDS-100.

Any advice welcome before I have to sell my 536 and HP1 to get a SDS-200 and gamble on getting a hum, bad display or both.

Thanks...

 

[buddrousa]

I had a 536 go deaf after a lightning strike 300 yards from my house had to send in for repair. Is this working on all other things?

 

[brumey]

Yes, it is working on all others, conventional and local P.25 systems. Same with the HP1, it works on the same system (they are transitioning from Moto Smart net to P25). I am blown away that the SDS-100 works inside a stucco house on P25 and the other two are not. Maybe the SDS-100 is just better?

 

[SteveSimpkin]

If this is the system you are referring to, it shows it as a simulcast system.

Sacramento Regional Radio Communications System (SRRCS) P25 Trunking System, Sacramento, California

Sacramento Regional Radio Communications System (SRRCS) P25 Trunking System Profile

www.radioreference.com

If so then yes, the SDS100 is that much better. It was specifically designed to correctly receive Simulcast systems that often can't be received well on most other scanners. It also works well on very weak signal digital systems.

 

[hiegtx]

Yes, it is working on all others, conventional and local P.25 systems. Same with the HP1, it works on the same system (they are transitioning from Moto Smart net to P25). I am blown away that the SDS-100 works inside a stucco house on P25 and the other two are not. Maybe the SDS-100 is just better?

The SDS100 is much better than the HP-1, and better than the 536HP. As SteveSimpkin noted, you are having to deal with a simulcast system. Here's a map of the sites:

From your location in Auburn (circled on map) you have a forest of simulcast sites facing you from the system.
Link to the above map:

RR Database Home

The most complete database of radio communications data

www.radioreference.com

 

[brumey]

Thanks... I appreciate your advice and detail. I guess I'll have to find the $$$ for the SDS-200 and hope I don't get a lemon.

Not questioning your theory at all, I just thought if I was struggling with Simulcast, I'd get something in terms of intelligible or on the analyzer see the same as the SDS-100. I simply cannot receive anything on the 536 or HP1 using an external antenna while the SDS-100 works using just a duck. I did validate the external antenna and the SDS-100 works even better using it. Wow, it the SDR based scanner is that much better, I am sold.

 

[cmdrwill]

536 or HP1 using an external antenna

May be too much signal.

 

[maus92]

May be too much signal.

Possibly, but more likely is simulcast distortion. Get the right tool for the job. But it would be easy to test your theory.

 

[nessnet]

Remember, on the Internet, you hear a lot of complaints.
You DON'T hear from the hundreds/thousands that are happy (or don't know about RR).

Buy a 200, it's a good radio and remember it's only a few out of thousands

 

[Ronaldski]

Before you shell out $, update the database in both with sentinel, many times thats all thats needed as systems go through changes and the database is always being updated.

 

[jonwienke]

Database updates won't help with simulcast, and if the database was out of date, all of the OP's radios would be having problems.

 

[Ronaldski]

While we know database updates doesn't cure simulcast, we are all assuming this is the only issue. Updating the database is a lot cheaper hehe than a new scanner. Other thing is also to check on firmware updates since Uniden put out those while it doesn't alleviate simulcast issues it does help reception of those systems.

We also don't know as yet how old the database in the hp1, 536Hp is for the OP. Throwing this out as an example is all. Came across someone with an HP1 just a month ago, couldn't get anything on their 4 tower simulcast county at all. Checking the database , it was from spring of 2014! Updated database... works perfectly now.

 

[brumey]

Rondaldski:
Thanks for the suggestion. I did update the databases on the 536, HP1 and SDS-100 this weelend. I loaded the full database and wiped all the favorite lists except for the SAC Moto Smartnet II and Sac P25. I am convinced the data is the same on all three radio's. The 536 and HP1 work fine on other P25 systems, admittedly, more local to me. Seems like the SDS-100 is doing some magic.

 

[maus92]

Rondaldski:
Thanks for the suggestion. I did update the databases on the 536, HP1 and SDS-100 this weelend. I loaded the full database and wiped all the favorite lists except for the SAC Moto Smartnet II and Sac P25. I am convinced the data is the same on all three radio's. The 536 and HP1 work fine on other P25 systems, admittedly, more local to me. Seems like the SDS-100 is doing some magic.

Typical behavior when using a non-optimized radio to monitor a P25 simulcast system, particularly from outside of the system's service footprint. We saw similar behavior in our area when local simulcast systems transitioned from SmartZone / SmartNet / EDACS to P25 systems. People experienced difficulties monitoring the new systems just a few miles outside the jurisdiction's borders, both because of waveform differences, and the "shaping" of coverage produced from their border sites when using directional antennas.

 

[ofd8001]

I suggest whenever a simulcast system is suspected to be a problem, that a scanner be taken pretty close to a transmitter, on the order of 1/4 - 1/2 mile away.

Then see how the scanner performs. If reception comes in clear, that all but confirms simulcast problems. You are under a pretty strong umbrella of coverage from just one site.

Based on the maps, Auburn is on the "back side" of the coverage area. This often is helpful for simulcast reception because of just one tower affecting the outside perimeter. Of course you could be in the magic spot of overlap with the Folsom and Rockville towers.