In July I was hearing 8TAC91 simplex quite a bit from Greenwood. It even popped up via CloseCall on my scanner! Never did figure out what agency was using it.
I heard Greenwood Fire once tell units to go to 7TAC71D (I didn't hear the units--must have been out of range from me).
Routine use? Not through the repeaters. A while ago (years) some detail was run on one of the Indianapolis conventional repeaters, I think it might have been some DNR personnel using 8TAC91. But its been a long time since I've heard anything like that.
Back before we had valid IPSC radio IDs (when IPSC was out of radio IDs before they went P25) if I was working and had to contact ISP, I would do it on 8CALL90. I am probably the only person who ever did this on purpose though. Now I just use H-MA1.
Most public safety has no idea these channels even exist, much less what they are for. It has been my experience that firefighters are much more knowledgable about mutual aid and radio. Law enforcement just wants to stay in their own little box and relay everything through their dispatcher. SOPs and training have to change if any of these interoperability options are ever going to be realized to their potential.
So true! Agreed 100%Analog on the 700's is violation of SO MANY proper use guidelines, and the NIFOG. But yes some agencies have to have their own little "special" things. This is why interop in a true SHTF event gets FU... 1 ch, with ten different uses and ten analogs, and a digital... No way in he** that everyone goes to the right one when they get told to go to ch X. "Which cha X???" "I'm on ch X, can you hear me? Anyone" etc etc etc
And the FCC rules...(emphasis mine)Analog on the 700's is violation of SO MANY proper use guidelines, and the NIFOG.
I had a student tell me the same thing about his officers.Law enforcement just wants to stay in their own little box and relay everything through their dispatcher.
Training. Specifically lack thereof.INDOT in the Bloomington area uses the 8TAC frequencies quite frequently for flagging, etc. Sometimes simplex, but frequently repeater. I was always under the impression the mutual aid frequencies were just for that - mutual aid, but apparently no one cares. I also occasionally hear FDs running drills/training and then there are the occasional "unidentified" transmissions (seemingly chit-chat that I can't identify the users). I'm retired LE and before I retired, I remember seeing a memo or SOP that said the *-MA-1 TGs were to be reserved for "hot" dispatches like ATLs, impaired drivers, wanted/missing persons, etc., but I frequently hear multi-agency incidents being ran on *-MA-1 instead of *-MA-2, 3, or 4, which ties up *-MA-1. FDs in Monroe Co. are notorious for using J-MA-1 for multi-FD incidents, even intra-county ones. Why tie up J-MA-1 when all FDs in the county have access to the five county fire ops TGs?
Training. Specifically lack thereof.
Johnson County was involved in some incident somewhere along I-70 in Hancock County the other day. There were ISP and Greenfield PD units on the incident with them as well. It must have been a pursuit that ran all the way out there. They were using it H-MA1, tying up a voice channel at every site in the zone plus one when they could have been on H-MA2, H-MA3, or H-MA4 saving system resources. But since there is very little to no training that actually explains this, nobody does it. I would also guess that maybe their codeplugs probably give them quick access to H-MA1 in their home zone but not the other talkgroups. Since they don't want to have to change zones, they just stay on H-MA1. I find this a lot with LEOs. Its like pulling teeth to get us to change channels, much less changing zones. I must just be weird because I've changed zones running hot up I-65 before to talk to ISP for an incident we were helping them with, but that's just me.
The 8TACs and 7TACs are great for short range operations or training. I see no reason why the INDOT flaggers couldn't use them in simplex mode, in fact I think that's a great idea if they are on simplex. But again, they probably aren't trained to do so. They just spin their channel selector until they can hear each other. Sometimes this means one of them is through a repeater and one of them is simplex. No training, so they don't know any better.
Simple problems like these compounded over time give thevendorsvendor an opportunity to sell /\/\ore "Solutions" to a problem that could be solved a lot cheaper with more comprehensive radio communications training.
My opinion only.
Training. Specifically lack thereof.
Johnson County was involved in some incident somewhere along I-70 in Hancock County the other day. There were ISP and Greenfield PD units on the incident with them as well. It must have been a pursuit that ran all the way out there. They were using it H-MA1, tying up a voice channel at every site in the zone plus one when they could have been on H-MA2, H-MA3, or H-MA4 saving system resources. But since there is very little to no training that actually explains this, nobody does it. I would also guess that maybe their codeplugs probably give them quick access to H-MA1 in their home zone but not the other talkgroups. Since they don't want to have to change zones, they just stay on H-MA1. I find this a lot with LEOs. Its like pulling teeth to get us to change channels, much less changing zones. I must just be weird because I've changed zones running hot up I-65 before to talk to ISP for an incident we were helping them with, but that's just me.
The 8TACs and 7TACs are great for short range operations or training. I see no reason why the INDOT flaggers couldn't use them in simplex mode, in fact I think that's a great idea if they are on simplex. But again, they probably aren't trained to do so. They just spin their channel selector until they can hear each other. Sometimes this means one of them is through a repeater and one of them is simplex. No training, so they don't know any better.
Simple problems like these compounded over time give thevendorsvendor an opportunity to sell /\/\ore "Solutions" to a problem that could be solved a lot cheaper with more comprehensive radio communications training.
My opinion only.
Just out of curiosity, what state?In my area the big problem more so than training is egos, we once had a extremely talented civilian radio engineering/ technician group that due to attrition and positions not being replaced by competent people the troopers started taking a bigger role in the management of the system. When we try to explain the technical limitations of the system we always get overridden because they know more than us because that's what the instructors told them at the academy. "troopers right......civilians wrong...." System loading is the first victim of this type of idiotic management. Our statewide system is in the process of a complete upgrade and they have already steered the ship into the path towards the waterfall.
They make all troopers utilize the statewide system rather than V-tac, U-tac, 700/800 tac frequencies so that some bored captain or major can listen 125 miles away at HQ's that 2 troopers directing traffic on a lane closure telling each other what the last car is so they can shut down and alternate traffic. than the calls come in complaining about system busy's .