Where I live we have a province-wide analog EDACS system that is divided into 7 others dependiing on location. There is one digital talkgroup which happens to be our city police station here in town. We have determined with the police being digital they have to be using AEGIS, now if they are using PROVOICE or not I don't know, I don't know if there is a way of telling if they are PROVOICE either. I noticed the police have MRK II's on their belts I don't know if that particular model is PROVOICE capable or not. Now my question is what cost and what kind of work would be involved if I want to buy a radio to listen to them seeing that there currently isn't a AEGIS capable scanner out.
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AEGIS and Provoice
- Thread starter mark2117
- Start date
- Status
I don't think the M-RK is ProVoice capable but I may be wrong.
I would bet they are Aegis. Try this site and compare them to what you hear:
http://www.kb9ukd.com/digital/
The possiblity exitsts that they could be using digital without encrypting it. It's an odd concept if you're familiar with Moto stuff but the manual says so:
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Unencrypted Digital (Aegis and ProVoice):
· More secure than analog (clear) voice communications and provides protection against monitoring of communications (IE: scanners).
· Limited to no communications protection if a radio is stolen, depending on the System.
VGE Encryption (Voice Guard, Aegis and ProVoice):
· More secure than analog (clear) voice communications.
· Provides very high level security against monitoring sensitive communications, with 1.8 x 10 to the 19th power possible cryptographic codes. (64-bit code)
· The number of possible cryptographic codes is increased to 3.4 x 10 to the 38th power with the use of a CUE code (Customer Unique Encryption code). (128-bit code)
· If a radio is stolen, changing the cryptographic keycode in the remaining radios maintains communications security of your system.
· This digital voice algorithm is not exportable without a license from the US Government.
DES Encryption (Voice Guard, Aegis and ProVoice):
· More secure than analog (clear) voice communications.
· Provides very high level security against monitoring sensitive communications, with 7.2 x 10 to the 16th power possible cryptographic codes. (56-bit code)
Copyright © M/A-COM, Inc. All rights, including trade secret rights, reserved.
I would bet they are Aegis. Try this site and compare them to what you hear:
http://www.kb9ukd.com/digital/
The possiblity exitsts that they could be using digital without encrypting it. It's an odd concept if you're familiar with Moto stuff but the manual says so:
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Unencrypted Digital (Aegis and ProVoice):
· More secure than analog (clear) voice communications and provides protection against monitoring of communications (IE: scanners).
· Limited to no communications protection if a radio is stolen, depending on the System.
VGE Encryption (Voice Guard, Aegis and ProVoice):
· More secure than analog (clear) voice communications.
· Provides very high level security against monitoring sensitive communications, with 1.8 x 10 to the 19th power possible cryptographic codes. (64-bit code)
· The number of possible cryptographic codes is increased to 3.4 x 10 to the 38th power with the use of a CUE code (Customer Unique Encryption code). (128-bit code)
· If a radio is stolen, changing the cryptographic keycode in the remaining radios maintains communications security of your system.
· This digital voice algorithm is not exportable without a license from the US Government.
DES Encryption (Voice Guard, Aegis and ProVoice):
· More secure than analog (clear) voice communications.
· Provides very high level security against monitoring sensitive communications, with 7.2 x 10 to the 16th power possible cryptographic codes. (56-bit code)
Copyright © M/A-COM, Inc. All rights, including trade secret rights, reserved.
epfdtracktrunker
Member
Sounds like AEGIS to me......Provoice sounds very different from that.
It's AEGIS. The police in my city use it now and again for undercover activity. I have no way of listening in and from what I have read in various forms on this site it would be difficult and expensive (but not impossible) to buy AND PROGRAM a radio to listen to either AEGIS or ProVoice. You could buy a radio off EBay but you would need to find the software and some hardware (cables) to program the radio.
The problem is taking the gamble whether or not it's encyrpted.
If it is you're out all the money and effort it took to mess with the radio.
If it is you're out all the money and effort it took to mess with the radio.
D
DaveNF2G
Guest
ProVoice is digital. Because it is a proprietary method, attempting to decode it violates U.S. law. If M/A-Com decides to license ProVoice to third-party developers for scanners and such, then its legal status will change.
AEGIS is encryption. Any encryption is illegal to try to break under the laws of most, if not all, nations in the world. Its legal status will not change unless our government suddenly decides that legal protection against unauthorized decryptions by third parties is no longer necessary. When's the last time you saw a federal law repealed? :twisted:
AEGIS is encryption. Any encryption is illegal to try to break under the laws of most, if not all, nations in the world. Its legal status will not change unless our government suddenly decides that legal protection against unauthorized decryptions by third parties is no longer necessary. When's the last time you saw a federal law repealed? :twisted:
N
N_Jay
Guest
DaveNF2G said:
No it is not!
AEGIS is the previous version of digital offered by M/A-COM (GE-Ericsson at the time).
It had encryption options just like ProVoice does today
D
DaveNF2G
Guest
Sorry about that. I've always seen Aegis referred to in connection with encryption, so I just ASSumed that it was a form of encryption. My bad.
Legally, Aegis and ProVoice are the same - proprietary, and therefore "not readily available to the general public" as defined in ECPA.
Legally, Aegis and ProVoice are the same - proprietary, and therefore "not readily available to the general public" as defined in ECPA.
N
N_Jay
Guest
DaveNF2G said:
That is an interesting definition.
If you can buy the equipment without restriction (Like ProVoice and AEGIS radios), then would it not be "readily available to the general public"?
D
DaveNF2G
Guest
No. The phrase "readily accessible..." applies to the content of the transmission. If traffic is carried via non-accessible protocol - encrypted or proprietary - then it cannot be decoded lawfully without specific authorization from a party to the communication.
N
N_Jay
Guest
DaveNF2G said:
That is interesting. What even FM is not "readily accessible" without a receiver?
Where does the court draw the line?
Is there any case law?
D
DaveNF2G
Guest
Most of the info is in the plain language of the statute.
18 U.S.C. sects. 2510-2520.
Laws of the U.S. define the word "accessible" differently from the laws of physics.
18 U.S.C. sects. 2510-2520.
Laws of the U.S. define the word "accessible" differently from the laws of physics.
N
N_Jay
Guest
DaveNF2G said:
Not being a legal scholar, do you have the wording or a link to the wording.
I tried a search, and got lots of references to "18 U.S.C. sects. 2510-2520." but not the text.
D
DaveNF2G
Guest
Googling won't get you official documents, at least not reliably. You need to go to official government sites for the text of statutes.
http://uscode.house.gov/usc.htm
http://uscode.house.gov/usc.htm
N
N_Jay
Guest
DaveNF2G said:
Well found lots to read, but not anything specific.
The law is one thing, but does it define "readily accessible", or is that left to a comkmon definition?
Has it been defined in case law.
I do not (nor have I seen it used) that just encoding is in any way encryption.
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