Amateur Radio HTs With More Than Five Watts Of Transmit Power

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kayn1n32008

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If better range is the goal, get the 8W handheld and then buy the highest gain antenna you can. Figure out where the antenna will be installed and run a very low loss cable using the shortest route possible. This goes for both mobile or base installations.

Lets use a base installation for example: an 8W talkie hooked up to a 30 foot cable and then to an antenna that has an 8.7dB gain on VHF.
So I buy an antenna (Tram 1481) with a VHF gain of 8.7dB. Then I have a 30ft run of RG-213/U. And lets say my SWR is 0.5:1
I have 8W into the cable, my cable and SWR combined loss is 0.9dB, so the power going into the bottom of the antenna is 6.5 Watts.
The antenna gain is 8.7dB, which makes my Effective Radiated Power (ERP) a whopping 48.3 watts!
Given the same scenario and the radio were only 5 Watts, I would still have a 30.2 Watts ERP.
That is the difference 3 watts will make when you use top quality cable and an antenna with decent gain.

It’s a difference of less than 3dB in transmit power and Your ERP figures are less than 3dB different.

Even ignoring your SWR error, using an 8w radio over a 5w radio won’t net you any increase in range.

It was me that made the error of 3w. I transposed the 3w increase from 5 to 8w, rather than 3w to 5w increase.
 

kayn1n32008

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Me (and thousands of others) will believe the calculator over anybody who cannot substantiate their claim that it's wrong.

5W with 8.7dBd gain = 30.7 watts ERP
8W with 8.7dBd gain = 49.1 watts ERP
That's TWENTY (20) watts difference, it can and does make an impact. That is roughly a 66% increase.
I think you are confusing this with someone who wants to double their distance - then THAT requires 4 times the power.

Oh lord. 30.7 to 49.1 is less than 3dB. In fact it’s slightly more than 1.5dB.

3dB increase would from 30.1w would be 60.2w or half an s-unit. The vast majority of radio users can not hear a half s-unit difference in signal strength.
 

kayn1n32008

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I think you are confusing this with someone who wants to double their distance - then THAT requires 4 times the power.

Nope.

universally one S-unit increase in signal strength is a gain of 6dB.

With a signal at S-5, to increase it to S-6 requires an increase of signal strength of 6dB.

A transmitter putting out 5w(regardless of antenna gain) being received at S-5 will need to increase its power to 20w to increase the receive signal strength to S-6.
 

majoco

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A good few years ago I tweaked my Icom IC-2A for maximum output on 2m into an SWR/power meter and a dummy load - hey, I went from 4 watts up to 6 plus a bit. However I could not get into our local repeater or the one further down the road that I could reach previously. This got me baffled for a bit so one lunchtime at work I went to the radio workshop and used one the the spectrum analysers via an attenuator. Hey - lots of spikes out of band and all over the place! After a retune for the maximum spike on 2m I got just a bit more power but it was all on the right frequency now!
 

k7ng

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How about a 2kW backpack radio?

Whooof. Not on MY back!
 

jonwienke

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Some folks seem to think that it's ok to use Baofeng the same way some people use the n-word...
 

MTS2000des

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The segment of radio users that Baoturd radios are the best thing going, that don’t actually have a clue of what they are talking about.
The Urban dictionary for Baofeng is quite interesting:
Top definition

Baofeng
Literally, "Bear turd".
A bear casting, usually from the Ailuropoda melanoleuca, better known as the Giant Panda.

Baofeng was used in ancient civilizations as masonry mortar in the region of China known today as Baofeng County. In modern English, Baofeng is used to describe lousy things that are ****ty or superficial people who are fake ***holes or are like pieces of excrement for some other reason.
I can't understand what you're saying. Your cell phone is a piece of baofeng.

I'm tired of all the corporate baofengs that try to take advantage of consumers.

The baofeng cop wouldn't arrest the peeping tom because he claimed it was a civil matter.
#baofeng#
by baofeng August 02, 2012
 

KK4JUG

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If anyone has anything else here, do it now. I can see this one being closed. When it resorts to name-calling, it's gotten out of hand.
 

kayn1n32008

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The Urban dictionary for Baofeng is quite interesting:
Top definition

Baofeng
Literally, "Bear turd".
A bear casting, usually from the Ailuropoda melanoleuca, better known as the Giant Panda.

Baofeng was used in ancient civilizations as masonry mortar in the region of China known today as Baofeng County. In modern English, Baofeng is used to describe lousy things that are ****ty or superficial people who are fake ***holes or are like pieces of excrement for some other reason.
I can't understand what you're saying. Your cell phone is a piece of baofeng.

I'm tired of all the corporate baofengs that try to take advantage of consumers.

The baofeng cop wouldn't arrest the peeping tom because he claimed it was a civil matter.
#baofeng#
by baofeng August 02, 2012

That’s gold!
 

Firekite

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Lots of angry inaccuracies in this thread. 8W vs 5W won’t double your reach, but the increase in radiated RF power is absolutely and inarguably greater than zero.
 

kayn1n32008

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Lots of angry inaccuracies in this thread. 8W vs 5W won’t double your reach, but the increase in radiated RF power is absolutely and inarguably greater than zero.

Increasing your power output by less than 3dB(with all other variables being the same) will NOT increase your range.
 

jonwienke

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Increasing your power output by less than 3dB(with all other variables being the same) will NOT increase your range.
Actually it will. Not dramatically, but measurably. Doubling power increases range by about 40%. Going from 5W to 8W will increase range by about 25%.
 

AK9R

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Ya know, 10 days ago, I thought this thread would die. And, it did die. Only to be resurrected.

The OP's question was about amateur radio handhelds with more than 5 watts output power. However, what I see for the last several messages is people disagreeing about something other than the OP's question. The age old question "how many angels can dance on the head of a pin?" comes to mind.

There are a few handhelds built for the amateur radio market that will output a legitimate 6 watts or 7 watts, but they often do it at the expense of battery charge life or heat build up. There are also handhelds being sold outside the traditional amateur radio marketing streams that are being advertised with unsubstantiated claims of their power output. In some cases, these radios will only output 5 watts on the available battery packs, but will output higher power when connected to a 12 volt DC source.

As for the 6 or 7 watt radios, whether or not a 1.5 dB, or less, increase in output power makes a difference in the real world depends on a lot of factors. And, I'm sure there are all kinds of anecdotal stories about how a few watts more power made the difference between clear communications and not. OTOH, on a carefully calibrated communications receiver, it takes about 6 dB difference in incoming signal to make a 1 S unit difference.

All that said, I think the OP's question has been answered.
 
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