Angeles National Forest - Station map ?

xilix

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Been listening to the ANF frequencies lately - They are about the busiest I have ever heard them.

From listening to LA County Fire for the last 30 years or so, I mostly have the locations of the various stations in my head, so when LACO Fire is dispatched, I at least know the general area. Not so with ANF.

Does anyone have a map of ANF Station numbers and their location in the forest ?
 

rlmurray56

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A quick google search turned up this. Locations, but not a map, so if you go to this site and click on "resource status" it will show you the station locations for all resources on the Forest, unless they are assigned to a fire, then it shows you that status instead.

click here..... WCCA-ANF
 

Paysonscanner

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Good morning, this is what I found.
It does not show any of the stations on the old Saugus Ranger District: Acton, Oak Flat and Los Alamos stations, plus a few others. I'm not sure of the accuracy of the map. I have something, somewhere, but I don't know if I can find the digital source. The printer/scanner is on the fritz, doing weird things I can't fix.
 

Paysonscanner

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Well, I should not doubt myself in the ability to find things. Here we go:



It needs to be cross checked with the Wild Web ANF resources page. I have no idea yet, what year it was produced. Shucks, it didn't post, back to you when I find time.
 
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Paysonscanner

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Well, I should not doubt myself in the ability to find things. Here we go:



It needs to be cross checked with the Wild Web ANF resources page. I have no idea yet, what year it was produced. Shucks, it didn't post, back to you when I find time.
OH, FUDGE, FIDDLESTICKS! There is some sort of problem in the permissions or sharing. Late Hubby filed it and I don't know what to do. I can open it here, but it won't open when it is posted. I've tried for 20 minutes to fix it, but no success. It only had symbols for station locations anyway, with no station names, so maybe it is just as well.
 

Paysonscanner

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Good morning, this is what I found.
It is missing some more stations as well. I would have to cross reference with the Angeles NF Visitor Map to make sure. It is missing the "Shortcut Station" on the Angeles Crest Highway, the station in Big Tujunga Canyon and the station at Big Pines, near Wrightwood. That is all I have time to check, and it is from memory.
 

Paysonscanner

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Been listening to the ANF frequencies lately - They are about the busiest I have ever heard them.

From listening to LA County Fire for the last 30 years or so, I mostly have the locations of the various stations in my head, so when LACO Fire is dispatched, I at least know the general area. Not so with ANF.

Does anyone have a map of ANF Station numbers and their location in the forest ?
Here is a link to a list of stations without a map.

List of Angeles NF Fire Stations

I think you should buy a copy of the Angeles National Forest Visitor Map. It will show the stations at the time of publication. I would still do as suggested, cross reference the stations shown on the resources page on the CAD for the dispatch at the link rlmurray56 posted. You will have to wait until all of the units show in quarters and given the status of the fire season, that might be a period of months.
 

xilix

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Thanks everyone. Station numbers are the best since that's how they are dispatched. The Google Earth map would be pretty useful, but I've already found a few inaccuracies. For example, the map shows "11ACRST" off to the side of a hill. I think that belongs at the intersection of Angeles Crest Hwy 2 and the Mt Lukens truck trail. The Lukens trail actually begins at the rear of the fire station.

"34CLCRK" Clearcreek is also off by 1/4 mile or so. With all of the info so far provided in this thread, I can probably build my own map in Google Earth (or fix the linked one). If I do, I'll repost it.

Thanks everyone!
 

es93546

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Thanks everyone. Station numbers are the best since that's how they are dispatched. The Google Earth map would be pretty useful, but I've already found a few inaccuracies. For example, the map shows "11ACRST" off to the side of a hill. I think that belongs at the intersection of Angeles Crest Hwy 2 and the Mt Lukens truck trail. The Lukens trail actually begins at the rear of the fire station.

"34CLCRK" Clearcreek is also off by 1/4 mile or so. With all of the info so far provided in this thread, I can probably build my own map in Google Earth (or fix the linked one). If I do, I'll repost it.

Thanks everyone!
Dispatches are organized in their CAD based on initial attack (IA) zones. Every station has their own zone, but some zones don't have a station. Dispatch plugs the fire danger and likely the burning index, ignition component, spread component, Haines Index (atmospheric stability) and the national and area preparedness levels into the computer, along with the daily lineup. This generates the units that are dispatched for each IA zone. Sometimes the dispatch is adjusted for the type of report they receive, at least I think so. The public and particularly aircraft call in a lot of what turns out to be false alarms. In my experience I haven't heard one aircraft call in a new smoke that is validly a smoke. This during my career and the 20 years of scanner listening since. They will call in a lot of actual smokes that are previously reported though.

Zones are drawn up based on access, topography and fuels. There are also automated mutual aid zones outside the NF boundary. They might have the same number as an adjacent, on forest, zone but a "M" is added to the number. I think all of the 14 is in such zones from Sand Canyon to the bottom of the grade south of Palmdale.

I just found the 2014 edition of the zone map. This will show what I've written above.
 

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es93546

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The numbers of the zones were based on the three Ranger Districts that existed in 2014. That has changed and now its only two, San Gabriel Mtns. National Monument and L.A. Gateway. I think there are still three fire divisions on the forest so unit id's will still be 1-3, so will IA zones. I haven't been south of Mojave and Kramer Junction since 2012 so I don't know this for sure.
 

tkenny53

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ANF uses Areas to identify location, such area 35 is Chilao Station, Patrol 35, Engine 35 and such, 35 and 34 are divided by Upper Big T.
There is a map somewhere, I also have seen one had drawn with the areas defined, I wont see that until sept 10th...
 

zerg901

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WildCAD has the engine numbers, and the area numbers, and the station names for the ANF. But the engines move around a little bit every morning ; so it would be best to watch the listings for a week and try to figure out the real match between area numbers / sta names / eng numbers. The Area Numbers usually match the engine numbers.



There is lots of ANF info here but it is definitely free range info. LOL. Angeles National Forest Calif - Resource Listings go back to 2010 (shows WildCAD engine numbers from 2010) - other years have Resource Listings - in case you want to do a historical review of the engine numbers and station locations - I have made up multi maps of the ANF fire stations but could never get a real good handle on all of the units - such as - 'San Dimas Tech' - where the heck is the San Dimas Tech Station?



2009 - Angeles National Forest Calif - includes - Direct Protection Map from 2009
 

es93546

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WildCAD has the engine numbers, and the area numbers, and the station names for the ANF. But the engines move around a little bit every morning ; so it would be best to watch the listings for a week and try to figure out the real match between area numbers / sta names / eng numbers. The Area Numbers usually match the engine numbers.



There is lots of ANF info here but it is definitely free range info. LOL. Angeles National Forest Calif - Resource Listings go back to 2010 (shows WildCAD engine numbers from 2010) - other years have Resource Listings - in case you want to do a historical review of the engine numbers and station locations - I have made up multi maps of the ANF fire stations but could never get a real good handle on all of the units - such as - 'San Dimas Tech' - where the heck is the San Dimas Tech Station?



2009 - Angeles National Forest Calif - includes - Direct Protection Map from 2009
I tried pulling up the 2009 ANF DPA map and the link doesn't work.
 

zerg901

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Angeles National Forest - map of fire stations - Google My Maps - here is a fairly good map of the fire stations in Angeles National Forest that I pulled together today. The hard part is getting the engine numbers placed at the correct stations.

Correction to earlier post - wildcad does not show area numbers presently. Some of the Area Numbers are listed here - Fire Resource List - Angeles National Forest Calif - seems to be info from 2010 and 2013 - not sure where the Area Numbers came from
 
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zerg901

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I forgot to say - if you really want to know which engines are in which stations daily - you can listen to the ANF feed between 9 and 10 am approx - you will hear the daily rollcall - and later whatever 'Move Ups' they do
 

Paysonscanner

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Angeles National Forest - map of fire stations - Google My Maps - here is a fairly good map of the fire stations in Angeles National Forest that I pulled together today. The hard part is getting the engine numbers placed at the correct stations.

Correction to earlier post - wildcad does not show area numbers presently. Some of the Area Numbers are listed here - Fire Resource List - Angeles National Forest Calif - seems to be info from 2010 and 2013 - not sure where the Area Numbers came from
Daddy likes your station map. He would love to have one for each forest, however, on many forests all resources are assigned to the Ranger District office. The number of apparatus on national forests in California and the need for better response times drives the need for stations out on the ranger districts. In addition travel can involve roads with a lot more traffic and congestion.

He does mention one big, big mistake on the maps. You use the term "U.S. Forestry Department," a big no, no for anyone who works, has worked or was a Forest Service brat growing up. The correct term is "U.S. Forest Service." In the federal government the designation "department" is only used at the cabinet secretary level, that is, Department of the Interior, with the Secretary of the Interior, the Department of Agriculture, with the Secretary of Agriculture, the Department of Commerce, etc. There are agencies like the National Park Service, the National Resource Conservation Service, National Oceanographic and Atmospheric Administration, but none are called "departments" as they all work within and under the direction of the "departments."

Daddy has never understood why so many people, even those who have worked with the U.S. Forest Service as permittees, contractors and such that can't seem to get the name straight. It was Daddy's pet peeve. I sort of have a similar perspective. Then there is the general public who must have forgotten or never paid attention to their civics instructions. They can't distinguish well known federal, state, county and municipal governments. Daddy recalls when someone came up to him when the governor of Arizona was going after the budget and cutting many programs. That person mentioned the governor and said "boy, he is really going after you guys." Daddy said, "he isn't affecting us at all, he, by law, can't. A short lesson in civics followed.
 

zerg901

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Re - "U.S. Forestry Department,"

I try to use the map markers provided by Google Maps. When I clean up the map markers, I put my guess as to the station name - and then in parenthesis, I show how Google Maps names the marker. Sometimes the finished product is not as finished as it should be.

Today when I get a chance, I want to look over the historical resource info on the ANF. That should really help nail down exactly which engines live in which stations. Maybe NASA would call them "nominal engine locations". (Maybe we can tie the Area numbers to the map markers also).
 
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