Bell FleetNet down?

Status
Not open for further replies.

alex288288

Member
Joined
May 9, 2015
Messages
61
Location
Hamilton Ont
just wondering if anyone knows why the BellFleetnet isnt currently active? I haven't heard anything in the last hour, even though Fire shows Medicals being dispatched?
 

gary123

Member
Joined
Sep 11, 2002
Messages
1,297
Sometimes a tower has protected TGs on it. The most common is the ambulance TACs for various hospitals. Dispatch can actually have 2 different users on the same tac but on different towers. IE tac 3 can be being used on the oxford tower to talk to Woodstock hospital while at the same time someone else is using tac 3 on the london tower to talk to london general.

There are a few TGs that are also blocked from certain towers so that the tower is not saturated with traffic from the TG. A unit attempting to go to that TG/tower on log in would be sent to the proper neighboring tower. It is possible that one half of a patched pair might be ok on a tower but not the adjacent neighboring.
 

mikewazowski

Forums Manager/Global DB Admin
Staff member
Joined
Jun 26, 2001
Messages
11,755
Location
Central Ontario
Bellfleetnet

Sometimes a tower has protected TGs on it. The most common is the ambulance TACs for various hospitals. Dispatch can actually have 2 different users on the same tac but on different towers. IE tac 3 can be being used on the oxford tower to talk to Woodstock hospital while at the same time someone else is using tac 3 on the london tower to talk to london general.

Sorry but it doesn't work that way. A talkgroup is the same across the entire system. If one user is already on it, it cannot be used anywhere else. You can't have two simultaneous conversations on the same tac even if it is restricted by area.
 

gary123

Member
Joined
Sep 11, 2002
Messages
1,297
With all respect Mike yes you can. Specifically the Oxford/Perth and Huron counties are set up so that TG 8A2-8A7 can be isolated on a single tower. The towers this is done on are 18,21 and 33. Under normal operation everything is as you say, a user on the TG will access the tower closest and patches will be sent out on any tower that is being used by someone on that TG.

In the area being discussed and usually on TG 8A4 what often happens is for example a Woodstock unit will request and be granted a patch on TG 8A4 this patch will occur on Twr 18 (oxford). Occasionally the patch or part of it will be heard on Twr 33 (Stratford) or 21 (London) but be dropped almost immediately from these towers. The woodstock unit will continue to use the patch. While this is happening unit in Perth county or London may be assigned to the same TG 8A4 for a patch to their local hospital that is in their coverage area. That patch will occur on their local tower on TG 8A4. Both the Woodstock patch and the Stratford or London patch are on the same TG but different towers at the same time talking to different hospitals.

Clarification
tower 18 TG 8A4 to Woodstock general
tower 33 TG 8A4 to Stratford general
both at the same time.

I have confirmed this with one scanner on Twr 18 and a second one on Twr 33. Its weird but it happens. If you can monitor London east TG 89F and London city TG89D you should be able to catch the dispatcher sending a Perth or Woodstock unit to tac3 at the same time someone is being sent to London tac 3 or if you monitor just London East you might get a Woodstock and a Perth unit being sent to the same Tac at the same time.
 

mikewazowski

Forums Manager/Global DB Admin
Staff member
Joined
Jun 26, 2001
Messages
11,755
Location
Central Ontario
I understand what you are describing but I still believe that this is not possible on a Smartzone system.

Guess we'll agree to disagree.
 

Forts

Mentor
Database Admin
Joined
Dec 19, 2002
Messages
5,973
Location
Ontario, Canada
Those areas are also dispatched by London CACC, so I can't see how they would be doubling up. Plus London City doesn't use TAC3, they are typically on 1 & 2. 3 thru 6 are usually (although I'm sure not exclusively) used for the county channels (LON EAST/WEST/NORTH).
 

Jay911

.
Feed Provider
Joined
Feb 15, 2002
Messages
9,298
Location
Bragg Creek, Alberta
The only way I can envision that "two conversations on one TG" would be possible would be if site trunking was in effect, i.e. the system was broken, and both conversations' parties were on the same site (i.e. ambulance A and hospital A were on site 1 and ambulance B and hospital B were on site 2).
 

SCPD

QRT
Joined
Feb 24, 2001
Messages
0
Location
Virginia
Sometimes a tower has protected TGs on it. The most common is the ambulance TACs for various hospitals. Dispatch can actually have 2 different users on the same tac but on different towers. IE tac 3 can be being used on the oxford tower to talk to Woodstock hospital while at the same time someone else is using tac 3 on the london tower to talk to london general.

There are a few TGs that are also blocked from certain towers so that the tower is not saturated with traffic from the TG. A unit attempting to go to that TG/tower on log in would be sent to the proper neighboring tower. It is possible that one half of a patched pair might be ok on a tower but not the adjacent neighboring.
Gary would you explain the concept of "a tower has protected TGs on it" within the boarders of how a Smart zone system works. What is a protected TG(s) I have never come across this in all my readings of this system.

Retired ADGA tech.
Federal Contracted service.
 

KevinC

Moderator
Super Moderator
Joined
Jan 7, 2001
Messages
5,965
Location
Somewhere other than home :(
The only way I can envision that "two conversations on one TG" would be possible would be if site trunking was in effect, i.e. the system was broken, and both conversations' parties were on the same site (i.e. ambulance A and hospital A were on site 1 and ambulance B and hospital B were on site 2).
We have a winner! :wink:
 

mikewazowski

Forums Manager/Global DB Admin
Staff member
Joined
Jun 26, 2001
Messages
11,755
Location
Central Ontario
From what I understand, the TAC channels are wide area and not restricted to certain towers as well.
 

exkalibur

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Aug 15, 2006
Messages
2,700
Location
York, Ontario
I know what Gary is talking about and I see where his misunderstanding is coming from.

For example - right now - on the Toronto (Mowat) tower, it shows MTO Toronto Operations being patched with MTO Peel Operations and MTO York Operations. Having a look at the Charlton tower, it shows a patch between MTO Peel Operations and MTO Halton Operations. In reality, Toronto, Peel, York and Halton are all patched together.

This DOESN'T mean that the same TG is in use for different users on different towers. The system does not announce every patch announcement on every tower. What that means is that while Tower A might show TG 1 and 2 patched, and Tower B might show TG 2 and 3 patched - in reality, TGs 1, 2 and 3 are patched together. A tower will only announce talkgroup patches for talkgroups that actually have radios affiliated to that particular tower. This is also why at times you'll see a patched talkgroup but it doesn't show what it is patched to - that particular site only has radios affiliated to that single talkgroup so there's no reason to announce the other groups.

In his example, TG 8A4 is patched with both Stratford AND Woodstock hospital (and possibly more), but you'll only see that on sites that have the particular groups in use.
 

gary123

Member
Joined
Sep 11, 2002
Messages
1,297
Excaliber might be right. I will do some heavy monitoring and attempt to catch a situation where Woodstock and Perth are on Tac 3 simultaneously.

I will leave some hardware dedicated to just the Tac TG and the specific towers and see if I can catch anything..

for the protected TGs

I have seen a few situations where a units on a specific TG are in a specific area covered by a known tower but the units are directed to another tower. That TG will not access that tower. The dispatch console might be responsible for this and not the system.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top