Bellevue --v-o-l-u-n-t-e-e-r-- Fire Dept; Help Wanted

Status
Not open for further replies.

NeFire242

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Mar 30, 2006
Messages
1,536
Location
Nebraska
Bill Aims to Make Bellevue Have Paid Firefighters

By Kristin Zagurki
World-Herald Staff Writer
Published Thursday | February 1, 2007
http://www.omaha.com/index.php?u_page=2798&u_sid=2323138

13107sqhazmat.jpg





Brian Staskiewicz, a hazardous materials supervisor for the Bellevue Volunteer Fire Department, inspects the inside of a hazmat truck Tuesday at the District 2 station, 2110 Fairview St. The department opposes a legislative bill to switch to a paid department. But an Omaha state senator and the leader of the statewide fire union say the change is necessary soon to improve public safety in the city.

That's why the senator, Brad Ashford, said he introduced legislation that would require any first-class city with more than 38,000 residents to have a paid fire chief and firefighters.

Only two Nebraska cities meet that criteria: Bellevue and Grand Island. The latter has had a paid department for nearly 100 years.

The passage of Legislative Bill 607 would be a blow to Bellevue, which is struggling financially. A paid department would cost the city at least $6 million a year, Fire Chief Dale Tedder said.

Ashford said he introduced the bill after being approached by a family concerned about the Bellevue department's response times and by the Nebraska Professional Fire Fighters Association, a statewide union.

Ashford said he believes everyone in the Omaha metropolitan area should have access to equal public safety services.

"The City of Omaha, the City of Bellevue and, potentially, other areas in Douglas and Sarpy Counties should all have a professional, full-time fire department," he said.

The City of Bellevue opposes the bill because of its costs, said City Administrator Gary Troutman. "Due to our financial situation, we just can't swing that."

In addition, he said, the bill's effect would be bigger than its impact on city finances and the fire department, because it involves the state telling a city how to run one of its departments.

The Kearney Volunteer Fire Department, which has seven full-time equipment operators, is rated Class 2. La Vista and Grand Island's departments both are rated Class 3, and Papillion's Class 4."It's not a fire department issue, it's a city issue," Troutman said.

Tedder also said he believes a community should be able to decide for itself when to switch from a volunteer to a paid fire force.

Bellevue's current property tax rate could not support a paid department, said John Collins, city finance director. In addition, the city faces cash-flow problems and needs to repay its wastewater fund more than $3 million it improperly used over the past decade to cover daily expenses.

The city will work with State Sen. Abbie Cornett of Bellevue to oppose the bill, Troutman said.

A public committee hearing has been scheduled for Feb. 13.

Mike McDonnell, president of the Nebraska Professional Fire Fighters Association, said his group's issue isn't with the training of volunteer firefighters in Bellevue or elsewhere.

The issue is that it takes volunteers longer to reach emergencies than paid firefighters, said McDonnell, who also is president of the Omaha Firefighters Union. That's because when a call comes, volunteers must first go to the fire station and then to the call site, whereas a paid firefighter already is at the station.

Tedder agrees that firefighters get out the door more quickly when they already are at the station. But other variables, such as a station's location, also affect response times, he said.

"I think our response times are great, compared to everybody else in the county," Tedder said.

It took the Bellevue department an average of 5 minutes, 47 seconds to respond to a fire call in the city in 2004. That compared with Papillion's average that year of 3 minutes, 23 seconds and La Vista's average of 6 minutes, 54 seconds. More recent statistics were not immediately available.

Papillion, which has fewer than half the residents of Bellevue, has a half-paid, half-volunteer department. La Vista, which has one-third Bellevue's population, has an all-volunteer force but is hiring a paid chief.

The issue of whether Bellevue should switch to a paid department has been raised in the past, including after a fire there killed 10-year-old Lita Lee Virgilito in December 2002.

Lita's family was critical of the department's response time to the fire - the first fire engine arrived 11 minutes after being notified.

Lita's father, Jim Virgilito, said at the time that he didn't think the firefighters could have saved the girl. The home had no working smoke detectors, and the house was well on its way to destruction by the time a neighbor saw the fire and called 911.

McDonnell, of the statewide union, questioned at the time why Bellevue didn't ask the Omaha or Papillion Fire Departments, both of which had paid firefighters on duty, for help fighting that fire. Help was requested from La Vista's volunteer department.

McDonnell said this week that the bill isn't about any one city or incident.

State Sen. Don Preister, whose district includes part of northern Bellevue, is a co-sponsor of the bill. He declined to say this week why he believes a paid department is a good idea for Bellevue.

Cornett, Bellevue's other state senator, said she would work to oppose or amend the bill.

The city doesn't have the money to implement a paid department by Oct. 1, as the bill would require, Cornett said.

Even if funds were available, the city could not set up a testing process, screen applicants and hire them in a handful of months. "You're talking more than a yearlong process here," said Cornett, a former police officer.

Cornett believes the bill has widespread support in the Legislature, which is why she is working on amendments to ease the burden on Bellevue.

One idea would be to phase in the conversion: first hiring a chief, then paramedics and, finally, firefighters.

The bill requires cities to use a National Fire Protection Association staffing standard as a guideline.

McDonnell's group also worked with State Sen. Tom White of Omaha to introduce a legislative resolution that would require all paid fire departments in Nebraska to follow the standard, he said.

The standard does not suggest staffing levels based on population, nor does it say when a city should switch from a volunteer to a paid department, said Gary Tolke, a vice president with the association.

It says there must be a minimum of four firefighters per "company," or vehicle. It also says a department must be able to respond to 90 percent of its calls in four minutes or less.

For a city, such as Bellevue, with four fire stations, meeting the standard would require hiring a "significant number" of firefighters, Tolke said.

Grand Island, which also has four fire stations, employs 69 fire and rescue personnel, said Fire Chief Jim Rowell. The fire and rescue budget is $6.3 million.

Tedder believes Bellevue would need 96 firefighters - four for each of the city's eight firetrucks over three shifts. The department now has 146 volunteers, 100 of whom are "very active," he said.

If 96 firefighters were paid an average of $35,000 a year and given $15,000 in benefits, that would mean $4.8 million for payroll alone, Tedder said. That's not including salaries and benefits for a chief and other commanders or operating expenses.

The board of the Bellevue Volunteer Fire Department voted last week to oppose the bill.

The city budgeted $1.74 million this year for fire and rescue services. That includes operating costs and salaries and benefits for six paid employees.

The city would have to come up with at least $4 million more each year to run a paid department, under Tedder's projected cost.

Ashford said he is aware of Bellevue's financial problems but said a paid department still needs to be discussed.

"I look upon this as really a big issue," he said, "and not just an issue about Bellevue's finances and their inability or ability to do something this year."
 

KAA951

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Sep 9, 2004
Messages
822
Location
Kansas
This is pretty well off the topic of scanning but I need to put my 2 cents worth in.

Since when did the simple act of getting paid for a job automatically make it "professional"? From all the excellent volunteer firefighters that I have known over the years, people who give their time and risk themselves for their neighbors, I believe that they are just as professional- or more so- then a paid firefighter. Volunteers are not at the job to chase a paycheck- they are there to help their communities.

More than 73% of the 1.1 million firefighters in the US are volunteers- and most paid departments are in major metro areas.

I have a hard time believing that in a state as rural as Nebraska that bill like this would have much support.
 

NeFire242

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Mar 30, 2006
Messages
1,536
Location
Nebraska
Ah, we're laid back here, nothing is off topic!

I've always like the argument over paid Vs. Vollies. (its almost like that ham one code vs no code deal)...

It's the same training. Just one person is getting a paycheck for it, and the next guy isn't.

I can see where having a paid department would benefit Bellevue due to its size, etc. It would help with response times and lower insurance ratings. All are a plus for home owners, except when you mention their property taxes would need to be increased to pay for all the firefighters they are going to have to add to the payroll.

Bellevue is large enough to sustain a fully paid fire department too, not like how Papillian does their mixed paid/vol.

The reason you'd see support for such a bill would come from insurance lobbyists, etc so that pressure would be there.
 

SCPD

QRT
Joined
Feb 24, 2001
Messages
0
Location
Virginia
I will agree Bellevue is large enough and the department covers enough area to have paid volunteers.

Will Bellevue have a any full time members?
It might say in the article I'm just too lazy to read it right now.:lol:
 

djm

Member
Joined
Dec 19, 2002
Messages
124
Location
Fredericksburg VA
Why not just hire enough folks to man one engine per station for "first due." Wouldn't that be a suitable compromise?
 

NeFire242

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Mar 30, 2006
Messages
1,536
Location
Nebraska
Even if they had enough staffing for just an engine company, you're still looking at 3 platoons, officers in charge, 4 districts, etc. It all adds up.
 

NeFire242

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Mar 30, 2006
Messages
1,536
Location
Nebraska
The other night I the low band I could hear Bellevue had a call for a 14mo old with a high temp of like 108. They paged dist 2 for it. No response, finally, dist 2/3, no response, finally dist 1/2/3 and dist 1 is the one who makes the run and gets it taken caren of.

This morning Dist 2 yet again gets a call, Bellevue Med 1 finally asks for it to be toned out as a Dist 1/2 rescue call just so he can get a squad from Dist 1 to actually come.

I could see why perhaps they want to go paid just to get the manpower. Dist 2 must have the slowest response times.
 

nosrednanoraa

Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2006
Messages
18
NeFire242 said:
The other night I the low band I could hear Bellevue had a call for a 14mo old with a high temp of like 108. They paged dist 2 for it. No response, finally, dist 2/3, no response, finally dist 1/2/3 and dist 1 is the one who makes the run and gets it taken caren of.

This morning Dist 2 yet again gets a call, Bellevue Med 1 finally asks for it to be toned out as a Dist 1/2 rescue call just so he can get a squad from Dist 1 to actually come.

I could see why perhaps they want to go paid just to get the manpower. Dist 2 must have the slowest response times.


This is one of the drawbacks of volunteer fire departments. It's especially hard in the Omaha Metro area where people commute to jobs and have other things to do making manpower a hard thing to find usually during the daytime.

Another approach they could do but would also be financially strapped for is have paid personnel during the daytime which is when it's hardest to find people to arrive for calls. They could pull a 8 to 4 shift or something like that.

Also, since the majority of calls coming into 911 nowadays are of a medical nature, how about just hire 2 paramedics for each station to staff the puke boxes. It'd be a little cheaper.

My last idea that I could think of is instead of staffing all the fire stations, staff 2 of them. It'd make some areas have a long response time but it'd make less of an impact on the finances of the city. Some fire departments in the Maryland area do well with having college students live in the station for free in return for them responding on calls. There would be a better possibility of someone being in the station and ready to respond at a moments notice making the response time lower and the patient could receive care faster.

Bellevue is in for some big changes if this bill passes. If it does, all hell might break loose. Doesn't everyone just love Omaha area politics?
 

NeFire242

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Mar 30, 2006
Messages
1,536
Location
Nebraska
*nods* Yup gotta love the politics.

The only problem was the two calls I heard were at night. They have rescue teams at night, so I dont know why they still lack the manpower and stuff. Crazy.

In order for Bellevue to work right it mostly like would have to be an all or none approach. I'd love to see them study some different models to find the best fit for their approach to the problem.

Yes I agree, they're in for some big changes.

Speaking of changes... when does the new La Vista Fire station open? Does anyone know what units will be stationed there? Are they going to call it Dist 1, Dist 2? This will mean a new QCII tone for the scanner most likely.
 

nosrednanoraa

Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2006
Messages
18
La Vista is getting some new units and I think they are going to the main station. The ones they replace are going to district 2. That's what I think it is. I know that recently they have received a new ambulance if not 2. I also think it's going to be called La Vista district 2. From what I've heard it was going to open this month but honestly all this stuff is just things that I have heard. I'm probably wrong about all of it. If anyone knows I'm wrong, speak up because I want to know these things too.

You're probably right about them getting a new tone too but it'll probably sound like every other tone in Sarpy County. I know that Papio, La Vista, and the Bellevue districts all have tones that sound really similar. I like how Douglas County has different sounding tones. It makes it easier to figure out who's who. Gahhh... Poor Elkhorn. Another metro area politics fiasco.
 

NeFire242

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Mar 30, 2006
Messages
1,536
Location
Nebraska
Yeah I like how Valley is now worried they are going to be taken over.

Some Sarpy stuff sounds different especially like Gretna than the rest. I see now they're wanting to build a Super Walmart out there at I-80 and Hwy 370.
 

nosrednanoraa

Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2006
Messages
18
I hear what I think is Gretna's tones here and there but I must be far enough away from their tower that I get no voice. I asked someone last night about the new La Vista fire station issue and he said that it was supposed to open up this month but it looks like that's not going to happen. They're also going to take their old equipment and throw it out at their new station. Not a bad deal for the people staying at their main station and not a bad deal for the personnel going out to the new one.
 

NeFire242

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Mar 30, 2006
Messages
1,536
Location
Nebraska
Well this morning Gretna's been getting hammered with calls. Bellevue 2/1 is just getting paged out to a fire call 701 Fort Crook Rd S.

I don't hear tones on the low band but I hear them on the UHF side. From what I can recall they will do the 911 standard alert tone on the talk groups. If you are just hearing tones and nothing being said perhaps you are hearing them activate the sirens. Springfield, Gretna and once in a while depending on the call or volume, Papillion and La Vista will have their tornado sirens set off as an additional alert. This could be what you are hearing. Its a lower QCII than the rest, and I agree Bellevue's are all very close, last time I was playing with the decoding software and stuff it was like 900 for the first tone, then 1100 range for the second, and this was the same way with all of them.

The best time to record calls is the first Saturday of the month because they even do the all call and alert tones, so that's the best time to capture them, or just record for a week or two and see what agency and call type of tone you've got on tape.
 

nosrednanoraa

Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2006
Messages
18
i have no idea who's tone it is. maybe it is a siren tone. what time do they set off their tones on the first saturday?
 

SCPD

QRT
Joined
Feb 24, 2001
Messages
0
Location
Virginia
They can only do "alert tones" on trunking systems. Trunking systems will not support paging tones.

Nefire were did you get the software to decode the pagning tones.

You got to like how Elkhorn FD response to the DCSO when OFD station 44 is at 144 and maple.
 

nosrednanoraa

Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2006
Messages
18
Whoa, are you saying that Elkhorn ran a call at DCSO? Could it be an evil twist by Mayor Fahey to get them used to some Omaha roads?
 

cellphone

Silent key.
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Dec 28, 2002
Messages
1,811
Location
Ahwatukee, AZ (Phoenix)
KG4WHM said:
Nefire were did you get the software to decode the pagning tones.

KG4WHM,

I decoded all of Lancaster County's paging tones by leaving a scanner holding on the paging frequency and plugged into recording software for a week. I then played back the weeks worth of recording and ran tone decoder to determine the tone frequency for each page.

Here is a link to recording software:
http://bellsouthpwp.net/k/d/kd5eis/IDTracker/IDTracker.htm

Or a more basic recorder:
http://www.davee.com/scanrec/index.html

Here is a link to the tone frequency decoder:
http://home.nexgo.de/ubertholdt/files/elektron/messwert/counter.zip

--Joe
 

NeFire242

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Mar 30, 2006
Messages
1,536
Location
Nebraska
Yeah just do like cellphone says, record them as wav or mp3s then take them through the software and it will tell you what it is. Pretty nice.

Station 44 could have been out on a call, or special duty.

Look at how Bellevue and Papillion do it. Bellevue has dist 3 at 36th street like 2 miles north of Twin Creek Cinema, who's fire district responds to the cinema? Its a Papillion fire call, even though there is a Bellevue station just literally up the street. This is why you'll hear them page both departments out for a dual response. They should just make it a Bellevue fire zone and be done with it.
 

SCPD

QRT
Joined
Feb 24, 2001
Messages
0
Location
Virginia
Thanks guys.

OFD does not responds outside the city limits. They won't respond to any area that is not apart of Omaha, even sections that are surrounded by Omaha. Example NW corner of 108 and Blondo Irvington FD and DCSO territory.
I can see if my friend can email me the coverage map for the county, including OFD.
 

nosrednanoraa

Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2006
Messages
18
KG4WHM said:
Thanks guys.

OFD does not responds outside the city limits. They won't respond to any area that is not apart of Omaha, even sections that are surrounded by Omaha. Example NW corner of 108 and Blondo Irvington FD and DCSO territory.
I can see if my friend can email me the coverage map for the county, including OFD.

They do respond outside the city limits for mutual aid so they do respond to areas that are not parts of Omaha.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top