Bradford/Wyoming Counties P25 TRS

[Thunderbolt]

Both Bradford and Wyoming Counties have applied to the FCC, in order to construct P-25 trunking systems. Both systems appear to be simulcast TRSs. Are these counties going to have separate systems, or are they going to share resources since they border each other?

Bradford County Application 1

Bradford County Application 2

Wyoming County Application 1

Wyoming County Application 2

73's

Ron

 

[ChrisRupert]

Potter County has also applied for a P25 Phase 2 system.

 

[Septa3371CSX1]

800 MHz - really? These are not the most 800 friendly areas plus these counties aren't rich either. I do wonder if this will end up being a large regional networked system covering these and maybe more counties.

 

[W3DMV]

Doesn't' make sense. My county (Adams) is physically a much
smaller area with better terrain and it required 21 sites and in
excess of 28 million to provide reasonable coverage. Will be
interesting to watch these systems...

 

[xicarusx]

I live in the northern part of Bradford County right on the border of NY actually.

There is no way this county has the money for a P25 system unless they are getting a grant from the state or federal government. My other thought is that they may piggy back on the PaStarnet PSP sites that already exist in the county.

The terrain is going to prove difficult to get this done. The PSP still rely pretty heavily on the VHF conventional frequencies in Bradford County. On the NY side of things, again it is 90% conventional except for businesses such as the Tioga Downs Casino.

 

[HM1529]

Any updates on the 800MHz licensing? https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?fccCallsign=WQZT233

I am not turning up any info online. Anything on the air up in the Endless Mountains?

 

[xicarusx]

I have been monitoring the newly licensed channels on and off. I have not heard anything at all. I am in the northern part of the county not far from one of the repeater sites. So if there was something I would see it on the spectrometer.


I just have a feeling this is going to be a long process and there may not be much activity for a while.

 

[KC3ECJ]

They should tie in with the new state system if they are going P25.

If not, what's the point?

Im guessing Bradford and Wyoming have many FD and EMS, but there's hardly any municipal police departments.

Also how does Lackawanna County fit into this being they, the fire and ambulance anyways, cover some of Wyoming County too?

There will have to be a ton of sites if it is 800mhz.

Nicholson doesn't even have AT&T or T Mobile cellular coverage. You have to drive up to the top of the hill by the viaduct to get any.

 

[klamp54]

I live in the Towanda area and all the PENNDOT trucks and Probation/ Parole Vans have 800 mhz antennas on them, must be using this system by now. My BCD536HP will be in next week, guess I'll know for sure than.

 

[WB3DYE]

Here is an email I sent to the director of the 911 center and the county commissioners---never received a reply.

Jeff:

I see that the FCC has granted Wyoming County frequencies for the 800 MHz system As an amateur radio operator I know the mountainous terrain of the county and I believe officer safety and the public will be endangered with such a system,

You may be asking how do I know this? Take a look at the problems the State Police were having with their 800 MHz system. Poor coverage and cost overruns. They are now scrapping 800 MHz and going BACK to a VHF system which Wyoming county has now. As you know VHF "hugs" the ground better than 800 MHz. I believe upgrading the current county system with repeaters and "voting" sites your system would be more reliable than depending on 800 MHz

https://www.paauditor.gov/press-releases/auditor-general-depasquale-launches-review-of-statewide-radio-network

Statewide radio a nearly billion-dollar boondoggle


Luzerne county is planning an upgrade to their VHF system like Lackawanna county which recently upgraded their VHF system and DID NOT go with 800 MHz.

https://www.thetimes-tribune.com/news/new-lackawanna-county-emergency-radio-network-goes-online-1.2073617

https://wnep.com/2016/08/02/lackawanna-county-emergency-radio-system-gets-upgrade/


This pattern is not located just in Pennsylvania. For example La Vegas police and others dumped their 800 MHz system due to lack of coverage issues.

http://urgentcomm.com/networks_and_systems/news/new-york-terminates-ma-com-contract-0115

https://www.reviewjournal.com/crime/courts/las-vegas-police-dump-problem-radio-system/


I know a "consultant" recommended 800 MHz . When I hear public officials making technical decisions there are going to be problems, I can not understand someone recommending 800 MHz with the history of 800 MHz with the State Police and other jurisdictions .

There's another issue.. Unless there is some kind of "patch" in the 911 center Wyoming county officers won't be able to communicate with surrounding counties .Also while digital P-25 will be used in your new system, again no communication with surrounding jurisdictions. Digital is not compatible with analog systems.

It all boils down to the safety of the public and law enforcement officers which I believe will be compromised by relying on 800 MHz.



Best Regards

Bob Reynolds-WB3DYE

 

[klamp54]

Came across this PennDot 800mhz PuB 23 (7-10)
https://www.dot.state.pa.us/public/PubsForms/Publications/PUB 23/Pub 23-Chapter 19 .pdf

 

[WB3DYE]

I sent a letter to the Bradford and Wyoming county 911 directors with copies to their bosses the county Commissioners I pointed out to Wyoming county how the State Police radio system failed and the county was followiing inn their footsteps---They didn't reply. Bradford county did and this is their repy.
============================================================

Mr. Reynolds,



Bradford County is not switching to an 800 MHz radio system. We’re well aware of the problems that the PA State Police have seen with years of trying to make their 800 MHz radio work. We are aware as well that they are now in the process of reverting back to a VHF system in many areas.



We agree VHF works great, however other areas adding P-25 systems increases the issue with control channels operating 24/7 on VHF frequencies adding additional concerns to a very crowded unplanned spectrum.



We have licensed these channels that came available for future use, that is why we applied for slow growth. First Net for example is built on the 700/800 MHz for nationwide use. The Federal system is committed to this frequency band. Also NEXTEL was built on this same frequency spectrum as are many cellular phone systems.



FirstNet Band14 is defined to include the 758-768 MHz and the788-798 MHz frequencies. Band class 14 does not include the guard band frequencies of 768-769 MHz and 798-799 MHz The license, however, granted by the Commission to FirstNet by law includes the guard band frequencies.



So because that is what is available etc. and with the growth of FirstNet we see future use although it may indeed not be P-25. If we do not license any channels now, we would be severely restricted in the future as we have obtained practically every VHF channel we could in Bradford County.



Perhaps in the future VHF will be reworked, it is indeed concerning to see how little bandwidth has been provided for Public Safety when so many other types of service enjoy less hardships.



Thank you for reaching out to us with your concerns.








Robert Repasky

 

[KC3ECJ]

Has anybody adopted AT&T's FirstNet cellular phone/data system in NEPA?

Their network operator number, 313100, shows up here in Lackawanna County.

 

[xicarusx]

Yes, the Bradford County 911 Center is a customer of FirstNet. I am not sure how they use it, or implement it. They are a subscriber.