Bucks County radio system upgrade

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HM1529

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Radio system could cost $65M

By: PETER HALL
The Intelligencer

The FCC requires Bucks to replace its radio systems before 2013. The county might have to pay for it with a bond issue.

Bucks County faces a tight timeline and a price tag estimated at $65 million to replace its emergency radio network and comply with a federal mandate to use the airwaves more efficiently, county officials told a gathering of municipal leaders this week.

Under a Federal Communications Commission deadline for the project, the county has until Jan. 1, 2013, to replace four radio systems county police, firefighters and emergency medical services use to communicate with dispatchers and transmit data between vehicles, hospitals and law enforcement databases, Emergency Management Director John D. Dougherty Jr. said.

Full story:


PhillyBurbs.com: *Radio system could cost $65M
 

fineshot1

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This article seems to have some flawed info - for one it is not a requirement
of the fcc to move to new spectrum for the narrow banding issue. Every time
I read an article by some news hound they seem to loose something in the
translation of facts regarding radio communications networks.

Does anyone know what version of the Motorola Type II SmartZone Bucks County has?

Ver 3.0?
Ver 4.1?
Ver 7.X?

I assume it must be the first above cause if it was 4.1 or 7.X then moto would not be
ending support for it in 2011. This would most likely be the lion share of the cost to
upgrade or replace. Upgrading is usually less costly than replacement because the
network infrastructure is already in place.

Just my .02 worth....
 

duffyt87

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It looks like they want to move from the 500 megahertz range to the 700. They suggest this because there will be less interference from TV broadcasts and the police can use the 700 megahertz range for not only voice transmission, but data as well. Currently, they use 3G cards from Verizon, Sprint and AT&T in their MDT's to access different LEO databases. Supposedly they can use the 700 range for data, and ditch the 3G cards which frequently go down.

There was just another article written by Peter Hall on the issue May 03. This article has 5x the info the first one had.


PhillyBurbs.com:  Costly radio upgrade looms

Any thoughts?

Thanks,
Tim

(1st post)
 

fineshot1

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It looks like they want to move from the 500 megahertz range to the 700. They suggest this because there will be less interference from TV broadcasts and the police can use the 700 megahertz range for not only voice transmission, but data as well. Currently, they use 3G cards from Verizon, Sprint and AT&T in their MDT's to access different LEO databases. Supposedly they can use the 700 range for data, and ditch the 3G cards which frequently go down.

There was just another article written by Peter Hall on the issue May 03. This article has 5x the info the first one had.


PhillyBurbs.com: *Costly radio upgrade looms

Any thoughts?

Thanks,
Tim

(1st post)
Good article & thanks for posting that. It is very well written except for the one mistake "Adding mega to make megahertz denotes 100,000 waves a second." noted by comments in this article.

It is much more clear now why bucks county is going to have to make the large expenditure
as there are several major issues (see below) driving these expensive upgrades.

DTV Interference in the 500Mhz spectrum
System channel capacity vs loading
Narrow banding - present
Narrow banding - future
 

chankel

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System load? Bucks could have a lot more talkgroups than they use given their current frequency allocations, and they already make good use of 500 MHz simplex channels. They've also barely started to make use of the 3-4 "future expansion" 500 Mhz repeaters that have been installed, at least in the northwest Bucks Co area.
 

fineshot1

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System load? Bucks could have a lot more talkgroups than they use given their current frequency allocations, and they already make good use of 500 MHz simplex channels. They've also barely started to make use of the 3-4 "future expansion" 500 Mhz repeaters that have been installed, at least in the northwest Bucks Co area.
I can not speak to that as i am not familar with the present load on the system.

But when you design a system and run a modeling application there is always
a worst case analysis done - such as a major forest fire or some incident where
as there are many more units using the system than normal. With the prospect
of adding data into the picture the north site at present seems a little shy of
freq resources which is why i added that. Five freqs are the bare minimum for
any moto trunk system despite the present loading and as a designer you are
always trying to stay way ahead of the curve. The last thing that you want to
happen is a fire fighter or ems person getting a system busy bonk when they
need it most. This is always done this way regardless of any conventional resources
in the entire system.
 

Twistabister

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Does this mean I wont be able to receive the transmissions with the digital trunking scanner anymore? Are they going to a system like Trenton uses?
 

zerg901

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1. Is this a case where a distant digital TV signal causes more interference to a digital land mobile radio system than a distant analog TV signal would cause?

2. What bands are used by adjacent countys? 33 Mhz - 46 Mhz - 150 Mhz - 453 Mhz - 800 mhz - 900 mhz?

3. Even a 30 channel trunked system wont be able to cope with 1000 responders in a disaster. That is approx 30 users per channel - ie - for each person talking, 29 cannot. In a disaster - radio load has to drop dramatically, or everyone has to bring their own repeater to the game.

Just my 2 cents - Peter Sz
 

JimBobTerp

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Hi
I was able to hear Bucks County on the system they were on but now I never hear nothing on them have they finally done using the frequencies that i have programmed in my radio? I hope we will all be able to find the new frequencies they are using someday when they upgrade.

Also what band are they looking to use?
 

policefreak

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well in recent weeks their control channel has changed from 501.2125 to 501.2375. That is if you are listening to the south system. Try plugging this in and see if it works.
 

JimBobTerp

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Policefreak,
I dont know what system I have programed I got these list of frequencies from someone else Free Scan zip file. they had these frequencies listed for there Bucks County. Maybe u can tell the new frequencies to plug in to see if I hear active.

Here is what I had..


Old
1) 501.2125 = ##
2) 501.3625 = ##
3) 501.5125 = ##
4) 501.73750= ##


Do I need to keep my Free Scan software system like this Since I Have a Uniden BCD996XT

Custom Frequency Table for Uniden Scanners:
Lower Base Frequency: 501.0375
Upper Base Frequency: 510.5125
Offset: 380 + Polarity
Spacing: 25.00


If not what do I need to change it to??


##= New Frequencies I need to program
 

policefreak

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Well everything else is correct. You do not need to change any of those frequencies. You just need to add in the freq 501.2375 as one of your CC's (I'm assuming you're using CC mode) and you might get something depending on what your location is.
 
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JimBobTerp

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I have add 501.2375 to my scanner and deleted 501.2125 and still have not heard anything and I know there must active going on. So can someone give me all the new frequencies if there is any. So I can hear this system again :)
 

chankel

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All of the information posted on Bucks page for the TRS should be current. I am using it in all 3 scanners and have no problem receiving their signal even with the antenna mast folded down. Is you frequency table set up correctly for the UHF system?
 

JimBobTerp

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I have it set up in FM mode like they told me to set it up and the freqs of what I have cause I got the first 4 frequencies from someone zip folder on freescan and just copied that to my scanner. So can u give me a little more help.

1) 501.2125
2) 501.3625
3) 501.5125
4) 501.73750
5) 501.2375 << New one they told me to add.
 

Thunderbolt

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This system maybe on the air at this time. Project 25 control channel reported on 773.79375 MHz. from western Hunterdon County, New Jersey. Can anyone confirm it?

73s

Ron
 

HM1529

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A quick search of the 700MHz band from my location with a handheld turned up 769.16875 as a control channel showing 00001-006 as the ID in Unitrunker. Site info is showing as 203-001.

PRO-106 is showing Sy: 006 R203 S001 and N01B W:00001
I am in Montgomery County to the south/west of Bucks.
 
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chankel

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Neither of the 2 frequencies identified above show up on an FCC search for Bucks County. Perhaps they're under an "experimental" license for the company bidding on the project and have been set up for demonstration purposes?
 
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