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Building a VHF system with Kenwood components

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adamnfd202

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I have an IG license pending have my frequency pair from my coordinator and can start using them in about 8 days.

My license is for
FB2: 110 watts Repeater
MO: 110 watts Mobile
MO3: 110 watts Mobile Repeater

I would like some advice on building my system, I am in a rural area with very limed cell coverage in the remote areas that my company works in, we are on a river 90% of the time and in wooded areas the other 10% I would like to cover as much as the 40km area around my base as possible.

at the FB2 Base the elevation is 545 feet, I have a 100 foot tower
my mobile repeater, I have a 55 foot tripod style mast

I would like to use the mobile repeater as a link for the mobiles/portables back to the base. I have a in-band mobile extender to use with the system to give the portables more range, the base antenna and the mobile repeater antenna are dipole that I can arrange the dipoles to give a directional pattern.

I plan to use a TKR-750 at the base with a power amp 50 in 110 out
I have not made a decision on the equipment for the mobile repeater.
I have a couple of linear VHF amps that are 25-50 watts drive with 100 watts out
I will be using a notch duplexer with the mobile repeater and a cavity duplexer at the base

Can anyone give some advice on the system setup to cover the greatest area
 

flux4201

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If your going to use a TKR-750 as the base station, get another tkr-750 for the repeater, or use a standard kenwood mobile radio as the base. Hopefully your not planning on using a flat pack notch only, not going to handle 100 watts, unless you buy one that will handle 100 watts, and depending on your frequency seperation on the repeater pair, your probably going to want a BPBR style duplexer if your going to run 100 watts, or a notch only with at least 100db isolation.
 

kayn1n32008

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If your going to use a TKR-750 as the base station, get another tkr-750 for the repeater, or use a standard kenwood mobile radio as the base. Hopefully your not planning on using a flat pack notch only, not going to handle 100 watts, unless you buy one that will handle 100 watts, and depending on your frequency seperation on the repeater pair, your probably going to want a BPBR style duplexer if your going to run 100 watts, or a notch only with at least 100db isolation.

And for a mobile repeater, 100w does not make sense. You WILL need some pretty high isolation to run a in-band mobile repeater @ 100w with a mobile running 100w.

Depending on intended coverage, 100w is pretty excessive for a repeater...


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kayn1n32008

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I have an IG license pending have my frequency pair from my coordinator and can start using them in about 8 days.



My license is for

FB2: 110 watts Repeater

MO: 110 watts Mobile

MO3: 110 watts Mobile Repeater



I would like some advice on building my system, I am in a rural area with very limed cell coverage in the remote areas that my company works in, we are on a river 90% of the time and in wooded areas the other 10% I would like to cover as much as the 40km area around my base as possible.



at the FB2 Base the elevation is 545 feet, I have a 100 foot tower

my mobile repeater, I have a 55 foot tripod style mast



I would like to use the mobile repeater as a link for the mobiles/portables back to the base. I have a in-band mobile extender to use with the system to give the portables more range, the base antenna and the mobile repeater antenna are dipole that I can arrange the dipoles to give a directional pattern.



I plan to use a TKR-750 at the base with a power amp 50 in 110 out

I have not made a decision on the equipment for the mobile repeater.

I have a couple of linear VHF amps that are 25-50 watts drive with 100 watts out

I will be using a notch duplexer with the mobile repeater and a cavity duplexer at the base



Can anyone give some advice on the system setup to cover the greatest area.
For a mobile repeater, 100w does not make sense. You WILL need some pretty high isolation to run a in-band mobile repeater @ 100w with a mobile running 100w.

To cover a 25mile radius 100w seems rather excessive.

If you intend to use a n in-band mobile repeater running a 100w with a link radio(another mobile) also running at 100w you WILL need BpBr duplexers, circulators and you WILL need a **** ton of isolation to get them to operate together. As well this will probably take up most of a 6 foot pick up truck box to hold all the cans it will take to get a 100w link radio and a 100w mobile extender. Mobile notch duplexers will NOT work.

Also if you are using 5w portables, there is no point in having a mobile repeater that puts out anything more than 5 watts.


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WA0CBW

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From what you indicated you have an FB2 (repeater) MO (mobile) and and MO3 (Mobile extender) but you don't have an FB (fixed base). You might want to check your license again to be sure you are licensed for an FB. And as "kayn1n32008" said you are going to need a trunk full of cans. You might want to re-think your design.
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adamnfd202

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The FB2 is licensed for a fixed location, the mobile repeater is only 50 watts. I picked up a TKR-751 and a Henry 100w commercial power amp for the fixed location. The MO3 will use a 50w Motorola GR500 with the CDM750's. The mobile repeater will be setup about 25 miles from the base.

My mobiles are all 45-50 watts except for 3 which are TK-790H's 100 watts

My KW dealer is giving me a little bit of a break on equipment, Im having to do the labor my self. Tower goes up this week, the portable mast will be a 30ft guyed. I had about 125ft of 1/2" superflex line given to me and I have an entire roll of RG-11 and a medium flatrate USPS box of all different kinds of connectors (N male, N female, PL-259's Mini UHF, crimp style, solder style . The tower tapped my wallet out.

My freq pair is 153.1925 and 158.4075 so I have pretty good separation on that aspect.

My base antenna is a CommScope DB224-A 150-160Mhz 6/9dB Dipole Omni, got it for 200.00
The mobile antenna is a Laird YDA1504 4 bay dipole array 6 dBd omni / 9 dBd offset It was given to me, a local taxi company bought it about a year ago an he closed down, gave me this antenna, looks almost new.

I don't plan on using a pyramid extender, just the mobile repeater, what would be the best way to setup the mobile repeater on our job site that is about 25 miles, arrange the dipoles to direct toward base and link it back to the base repeater?

I had the coordinator add a FX1. UTC advised me to use a base repeater all I would need is the FB2 at location 1, I have 2 MO's one if for talk around and now the FX1 and MO3 Location 2. I put in for an exception for 65KM radius around Location 1 with the special circumstance they said OK and filed the 601 and associated forms.
 

kayn1n32008

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Even with an offset pattern the antennas will not be overly directional... What I do not see here is a duplexer... You WILL need at least 90 DB of isolation if you insist on using that Henry amp. Considering the 65km radius I doubt you will need that amp, especially with your some of your mobiles transmitting at 50w. You still need a duplexer, well two actually. With 5-ish MHz separation things will not be quite as costly in that department.

Dump the RG-11 it is 75ohm coax, everything you have is 50ohm. Sell it and re-invest in som RG-214 for duplexer jumpers. Also you should get a poly phaser. I'm sure there are some misc. bits I'm forgetting...


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adamnfd202

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I have the RG-11 and 5 full spools of RG-6 I will try to dump I know a couple of contractors for a cable company and one for dish network who will buy that stuff.

Ordered a RFS 150-162 MHz Compact Duplexer 100 watt max input with minimum isolation of 75db for the mobile repeater

I am looking at a duplexer with 90db isolation right now, trying to haggle on the price, I can get a Sinclair Band Pass Band Reject 4 cavity 100db isolation from my dealer for 1400 new with tuning he wants 900 for the used one thats about 10 years old and then I have to have it tuned, he thinks his stuff is just as good as new stuff and is a regular "Fred Sanford" has a little of everything!

He really does not know what he has or what its used for, he thinks its for a CB antenna to get "more range" he has it confused with a "Kicker" thats what he calls it but I know what it is. If he will come down to about 500 I may have my tech come check it out, if he says go for it I'll get him to tune it and bring it to the shop. I know what "Fred" paid for it and who he got it from so even at 400 bucks he is more than doubling his money almost triple.
 

kayn1n32008

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Really, as long as the duplexer has not been left in the in the rain or snow, they will be just fine. There are a few repeaters near me that are using multi-decade old Sinclair Resloc BpBr duplexers with no issue.

Make sure your jumpers are double shielded, like RG-214. Do NOT use LMR-400, the braid and foil shield are different metals, and can generate noise.


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