zmanpro96
Member
Hey, I was wondering if I could buy a ma/com radio strait from the factory and program it to my counties system, I would just use it to monitor NOT TRANSMIT? I also ask the same question about a motorola xts300?
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cAN I MONITOR PROVOICE WITHOUT HAVING THE ADMINS PERMISSION......
- Thread starter zmanpro96
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The simple answer is no
To even just receive a trunked system on a professional radio, you have to have the system key, which the system administrators give out only to authorized users. AFAIK, this is true for both MA/COM and Moto systems. Not sure if this is true for mobiles, but I know that Moto. systems allow the admins to disable an unauthorized portable radio over the air, which makes it useless until you send it back Motorola. I trust you've invegstigated the prices of the kind of equipment you talk about....it's quite expensive!
Finally, read the sticky below about monitoring San Antonio Texas' Provoice system. Note that it uses another feature called ESK which your Johnston County, NC system doesn't appear to have, but the rest of the info is still pertinent.
http://www.radioreference.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2286
To even just receive a trunked system on a professional radio, you have to have the system key, which the system administrators give out only to authorized users. AFAIK, this is true for both MA/COM and Moto systems. Not sure if this is true for mobiles, but I know that Moto. systems allow the admins to disable an unauthorized portable radio over the air, which makes it useless until you send it back Motorola. I trust you've invegstigated the prices of the kind of equipment you talk about....it's quite expensive!
Finally, read the sticky below about monitoring San Antonio Texas' Provoice system. Note that it uses another feature called ESK which your Johnston County, NC system doesn't appear to have, but the rest of the info is still pertinent.
http://www.radioreference.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2286
M/A Com only uses system keys on ESK systems. No system key needed, however, you do need a valid LID which you must obtain from the system administrator, as your radio (even in recieve only mode) will still log into the system. not to mention that to legally obtain Programmer software, it is more than the radio itself.
Thanks for the correction...good to know.
zmanpro96
Member
Thanks guys, do you know if i got a surplus motorola radio and programed it myself I would be able to receive?
morganAL
Member
Thayne said:
IF auto-login is turned off. Otherwise, when you turn the radio on, it logs in to the site and every time you change talkgroups it talks to the CC.
Most if not all of the above information is incorrect concerning a provoice radio.
True there are issues regarding the legallity of programming an unauthorized radio on a trunked radio system. However on a edacs/provoice system it is quite easy.
Program the radio with auto log in disabled.
Program the radio to have transmit inhibit on the system so it will on transmit.
Then program the radio for the system and it will work fine.
The radio will receive normally and work just like a system radio however it will not transmit.
If the system that you are referring to has esk installed and active, then that is another story and the radio will need to programmed with the system key/code to enable the esk for that system. For that you would need the information/files from the system administrator.
A motorola radio will not work on a edacs/provoice system. Only ma-com radios will work and if it is a provoice system there are only a few models that work on that such as the mrkII and jaguar lpe line of portable radios plus the few models of mobiles that are available.
True there are issues regarding the legallity of programming an unauthorized radio on a trunked radio system. However on a edacs/provoice system it is quite easy.
Program the radio with auto log in disabled.
Program the radio to have transmit inhibit on the system so it will on transmit.
Then program the radio for the system and it will work fine.
The radio will receive normally and work just like a system radio however it will not transmit.
If the system that you are referring to has esk installed and active, then that is another story and the radio will need to programmed with the system key/code to enable the esk for that system. For that you would need the information/files from the system administrator.
A motorola radio will not work on a edacs/provoice system. Only ma-com radios will work and if it is a provoice system there are only a few models that work on that such as the mrkII and jaguar lpe line of portable radios plus the few models of mobiles that are available.
Microwavemike
Member
Monitoring Trunked Systems with a RADIO
Look..... If you got to use a radio to monitor any trunked system, an Illegal act in most States, disable the transmitter. The easy way to do this is to lift the input to the final brick
Amp. The better way is to remove the blocking cap from the transmit VCO.
That way there is NO way to ever transmit.
mm
Look..... If you got to use a radio to monitor any trunked system, an Illegal act in most States, disable the transmitter. The easy way to do this is to lift the input to the final brick
Amp. The better way is to remove the blocking cap from the transmit VCO.
That way there is NO way to ever transmit.
mm
D
DaveNF2G
Guest
More wrong info!?!?!?
It is not illegal to monitor a trunked system anywhere in the United States, regardless of the hardware in use.
It is illegal to monitor any encrypted traffic, trunked or not. It is also illegal to gain access to a proprietary protocol by doing anything that would violate the intellectual property rights of the protocol owner.
Practically anything that can be done with an unmodified scanner, or with a commercial radio (except transmitting without license or authorization), is generally legal in the U.S.
Microwavemike said:
It is not illegal to monitor a trunked system anywhere in the United States, regardless of the hardware in use.
It is illegal to monitor any encrypted traffic, trunked or not. It is also illegal to gain access to a proprietary protocol by doing anything that would violate the intellectual property rights of the protocol owner.
Practically anything that can be done with an unmodified scanner, or with a commercial radio (except transmitting without license or authorization), is generally legal in the U.S.
I think Microwavemike is confusing Motorola Trunked Systems with EDACS Systems.
Mike,
M/A-Com's software actually allows you to inhibit the TX in ALL modes, unlike Motorola's where you are forced to affiliate (in certain situations).
Mike,
M/A-Com's software actually allows you to inhibit the TX in ALL modes, unlike Motorola's where you are forced to affiliate (in certain situations).
Microwavemike
Member
Trunked Systems Monitoring
I must admit, I have never programed any Edacs radio, just conventional channels.
At one time I did program Motorola radios, for my use, to monitor trunking systems.
On those radios, I removed the transmit VCO blocking cap, all surface mount stuff.
The radio never transmitted outside the case.
All I am saying is that if you do use radios to monitor ANY trunking system, remove the ability for that radio to EVER be able to get on the system.
mm
I must admit, I have never programed any Edacs radio, just conventional channels.
At one time I did program Motorola radios, for my use, to monitor trunking systems.
On those radios, I removed the transmit VCO blocking cap, all surface mount stuff.
The radio never transmitted outside the case.
All I am saying is that if you do use radios to monitor ANY trunking system, remove the ability for that radio to EVER be able to get on the system.
mm
zmanpro96
Member
Hey guys anybody know what a provoice edacs radio would go for?Used or New?
TDHG4U61
Member
I saw one GE radio on Ebay the other day around 1k. Also, I use to have a Provoice radio and all you need is the software and edit a few changes in the software menu prior to programming your radio in order to hear those Provoice active channels. Weather the channels are analog they can be ready to use if they decide to change to Provoice. Just make sure your radio has the Provoice board installed as well as the option code 29 shown in the code list. As the above comments, my city does NOT use any kind of ESK, just a regular Ma/Com trunk system. Just do not set your radio to: "log-in, Tx, Icall & last 25 Lid that transmitted" and you will be safe. The story is different as for a Moto trunk system you will be kicked-off.
zmanpro96
Member
Ha yeah you got that right, only i would be sitting in the back of a Johnston county, nc deputys car.....
grem467
Member
DaveNF2G said:
It is not illegal to monitor a trunked system anywhere in the United States, regardless of the hardware in use.
It is illegal to monitor any encrypted traffic, trunked or not. It is also illegal to gain access to a proprietary protocol by doing anything that would violate the intellectual property rights of the protocol owner.
Practically anything that can be done with an unmodified scanner, or with a commercial radio (except transmitting without license or authorization), is generally legal in the U.S.
while tecnically correct, keep in mind that for some trunked systems, you need additional files that are only legally accessable to system managers. The cases out there that deal with an unauthorized trunked radio that is programmed on a system were not dealing with the radio itself. They were charged with computer crimes mainly for possesing the system keys (or the lab software to circumvent such) as well as if they were unfortunate enough to have bootleg CPS, then you have more charges.
Don't forget about "Advanced System Keys". Once a radio is programmed with an Advanced System Key, you won't even be able to program conventional frequencies on the radio - nothing - nada - zip...
Unless someone comes up with a way to hack the Advanced System Keys, then it's gonna be curtains for using a Motorola radio for anything in the future, not even for ham radio.
Unless someone comes up with a way to hack the Advanced System Keys, then it's gonna be curtains for using a Motorola radio for anything in the future, not even for ham radio.
You guys are confusing M/A-Com for Motorola. It is not a Motorola discussion...you guys are walking away from the subject.
The bottom line for M/A-Com.
Not illegal to monitor any M/A-Com driven system with the M/A-Com hardware unless you are dealing with ESK &/or encryption.
Software can be bought from M/A-Com or any Dealer directly legally for a high price $$.
Affiliation is not needed to monitor. Whoever tells you a valid LID is required to Monitor does not know what he is talking about.
The bottom line for M/A-Com.
Not illegal to monitor any M/A-Com driven system with the M/A-Com hardware unless you are dealing with ESK &/or encryption.
Software can be bought from M/A-Com or any Dealer directly legally for a high price $$.
Affiliation is not needed to monitor. Whoever tells you a valid LID is required to Monitor does not know what he is talking about.
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