Chandler AZ Very Late Entry

[eewoodward]

In my very limited spare time, I have tried to use a Uniden HomePatrol for listening to operations of Fire Departments. After several hours of testing and updating databases via RadioReference, I am highly suspicious that the Chandler Fire Department (ChandFD-B1, ChandFD-B2) are encypted. I finally ran some tests with the squelch practically off to only receive static.

Can someone quickly confirm that this is the case? I do not want to spend more time and money if this is already solved. Attempting to read through the forums only gives results of several discussions about encryption without easily locating the areas that have encryption systems. I am also suspicious that the installation occurred several years ago, and I cannot easily find a message in the archives.

Thanks for any quick assistance.

 

[cellphone]

I don’t think that these frequencies are valid anymore. 154.430 has been repurposed by Phoenix Fire as channel A13. 155.955 might still be used by Chandler as a rarely used TAC channel.

Chandler Fire, as well as most of the valley, is dispatched on Phoenix Fire Channel 1 154.190. I don’t recall which channel Chandler fire calls are assigned to. It is either A12 154.130 or A13 154.430. See under Phoenix below.
Maricopa County, Arizona (AZ) Scanner Frequencies and Radio Frequency Reference

Non-Hazard or medical calls are assigned to a K Channel on the RWC. See under Phoenix Fire Talkgroups below.
Regional Wireless Cooperative (RWC) Trunking System, Phoenix, Arizona - Scanner Frequencies

 

[AZScanner]

No, these aren't encrypted, they just don't see much use and have changed names. I'm not sure why they're still in there. Many of Chandler's hazard calls end up on Phoenix Fire A12 or A14. Those hazard calls are pretty rare in Chandler compared to Phoenix for example - most of Chandler's runs are medical calls and traffic accidents which end up being worked on the K-Deck RWC talkgroups.

There are patches to the VHF A deck channels for Phoenix Fire on the RWC also, but those *are* encrypted (which really sucks by the way, who came up with that bright idea?) The VHF channels are in the clear, however they are simplex so most times unless you're pretty close to the units you will only hear the dispatcher talking.

-AZ

Edit: Ha, cellphone beat me to it. I've got to type faster, LOL!

 

[KB7MIB]

Wirelessly posted (Opera/9.80 (BREW; Opera Mini/6.0.3/27.2354; U; en) Presto/2.8.119 320X240 LG VN530)

A-1 154.190 for dispatch, and primarily A-12 154.130 for fireground on the VHF side in Chandler, Sun Lakes, and Ahwatukee. A-7 154.145 in Tempe and Guadalupe. A-4 154.280 for mutual-aid with Gila River FD.
On the RWC trunked system, use K-1 for dispatch (same exact thing as A-1) and K-8 primarily for EMS and motor vehicle accidents. K-10, K-11, K-12 for mountain rescues and multi-victim (2 & 1 medical or greater) motor vehicle accidents.
They also assist Mesa & Gilbert FD on occassion, so you may want to include 154.340 VHF dispatch, and the trunked talkgroups from the TOPAZ RWC system. (3064 is dispatch IIRC. I don't know the tactical talkgroups off-hand.) Mesa also dispatches for Queen Creek and Apache Junction, and I think Rio Verde.
Adding Gila River FD may be of interest to you. They use a handful of conventional 800 MHz repeaters. (Gila River PD does likewise, but are encrypted.)

 

[KB7MIB]

Wirelessly posted (Opera/9.80 (BREW; Opera Mini/6.0.3/27.2354; U; en) Presto/2.8.119 320X240 LG VN530)

Also, see the thread "RWC Simulcast C Observations". Simulcast C is to be upgraded to P25 Phase II very shortly, and only Chandler PD is currently active on Simulcast C. All of the FD K-decks can be heard on the South Mountain High IR site, so that's what you're going to want to listen to for the K-deck talkgroups, not Simulcast C.
BTW, Chandler FD (actually, all of the FD's under the Phoenix RDC) has their own set of K-2 through K-5 talkgroups. Try the following:
K-2: 1679
K-3: 1678
K-4: 1677 (Encrypted)
K-5: 1676 (Encrypted)
I do not know how active they are, or even if they are. But they may be worth programming in for if/when they do become active. (I have another thread here with all of the K-2 through K-5 TG's, if you or anyone else wants to look for it.)

 

[Kars10az]

The Chandler VHF channels are NOT encrypted, and all frequencies previously licensed by the City of Chandler are still in use. It's been so long, I haven't worked in the Alarm Room for so long, I don't remember all this stuff anymore.

The TGs you list as Chandler are listed as administrative TGs. Chandler FD uses the same tactical TGs as Phoenix FD. K7 is typically the one used for EMS.

154.1900 PHX FD A01 DISP
154.2500 PHX FD A02 INFO
154.0700 PHX FD A03 TAC Central Valley
154.2800 PHX FD A04 Mutual Aid
153.8300 PHX FD A05 TAC North-Central Valley
154.3100 PHX FD A06 TAC Glendale area
154.1450 PHX FD A07 TAC Tempe area
153.7700 PHX FD A08 TAC South Valley
155.6700 PHX FD A09 TAC Northwest Valley
151.3700 PHX FD A10 TAC Far North Valley
154.0250 PHX FD A11 TAC Scottsdale area
154.1300 PHX FD A12 TAC Chandler area
154.4300 PHX FD A13 TAC Chandler area
155.7750 PHX FD A14 TAC
155.7150 PHX FD A15 C2C
154.1900 PHX FD A01 DISP

1795 PHX FD K01 DISP
1753 PHX FD K02 TAC
1786 PHX FD K03 TAC
1772 PHX FD K04 TACX
1754 PHX FD K05 TACX
1615 PHX FD K06 TAC
1614 PHX FD K07 TAC
1613 PHX FD K08 TAC
1612 PHX FD K09 TAC
1611 PHX FD K10 TAC
1610 PHX FD K11 TAC
1609 PHX FD K12 TAC
1608 PHX FD K13 TAC
1607 PHX FD K14 TAC
1606 PHX FD K15 TAC
1795 PHX FD K16 DISP


Ed

 

[KB7MIB]

Wirelessly posted (Opera/9.80 (BREW; Opera Mini/6.0.3/27.2354; U; en) Presto/2.8.119 320X240 LG VN530)

Thanks Ed. Is there a channel assignment map available? I seem to recall an older one that was available, maybe in an old edition of the Southwest Frequency Directory.
From my own monitoring, A-6 is typically Northwest Valley, and A-9 is typically Southwest Valley, with Northern Ave being the rough boundary line between them. Somewhere between 19th Ave and 35th Ave seems to be the boundary between A-5 and A-6. I don't know exactly where the boundaries between A-9 and A-3 and A-5 are.
It also sounds like A-13 is the typical assignment for Tonopah and Harquahala Valley incidents, medical or fire.
Do you have the current list for B-deck? There's a thread here that has it from about the end of 2011/ beginning of 2012, when everyone went narrowband, and switched from CTCSS to DCS on most of the channels.

 

[Kars10az]

I used to have a map. I think I got it from SW Freq Directory as well. With the narrowbanding, and the poor coverage, they were realigning the channel maps to provide half-decent coverage. I'm not sure what the newest alignment is.

A6 is, for the most part, Glendale and A9 is north and west of Glendale. I'm not sure how far south it goes. Typically Channel 8 is south of I10 alignment, all across the south valley. There is no B-deck any more. What used to be B1 and B2 are now on A-deck. B12 is not in use, or, if it is, it's not monitored in the Alarm Room, so it's not used for TAC. It could be a HazMat channel or admin channel, or Buckeye Valley may have taken it back over since they held the license for it. Perhaps the West Valley towns like Tonopah and Harquahala may be using it. I retired in February of 2011, and we were already narrowbanded. It may have switched at the end of 2010. Tonopah and Harquahala, as well as Gila Bend, are not on the RWC, so all of their calls go on VHF.

 

[KB7MIB]

Wirelessly posted (Opera/9.80 (BREW; Opera Mini/6.0.3/27.2354; U; en) Presto/2.8.119 320X240 LG VN530)

So the Mesa VHF channels aren't on B-deck any longer? Can Tempe, Chandler, et al switch to the TOPAZ RWC talkgroups that Mesa-Gilbert-Apache Junction-Queen Creek-Rio Verde use?
The last lineup I had for B-deck was:
154.190 Dispatch
155.745-150.805 Black Canyon City FD
154.265 VFire 22
154.280 VFire 21
154.295 VFire 23
154.370-153.890 Rural-Metro channel 2
154.400 Rural-Metro channel 5
154.340 Mesa FD 1 (167.9 PL, FM)
154.235 Mesa FD 2 (167.9 PL, FM)
153.950 Mesa FD 3 (167.9 PL, FM)
154.340 Mesa FD 1 (DPL 114, NFM)
154.235 Mesa FD 2 (DPL 115, NFM)
153.950 Mesa FD 3 (DPL 116, NFM)
155.475-155.910 VAIRS 1
162.550 NWS Receive-only
154.190 Dispatch

 

[Kars10az]

That's a really good question. I know there are channels on the Blue deck, but no calls are assigned there by Phoenix dispatch. I know Daisy Mtn frequently goes to Black Canyon's channels, but I don't know if it's on a Phoenix radio, or if they have a completely separate radio. When Phoenix goes into the county to assist Rural, or any other small department, the calls are dispatched on Phoenix channels and the other agency comes to the Phoenix channel. This creates more work for the Phoenix dispatchers, and takes responsibility away from the agency who should be in control. Phoenix loves the control and, I think, assumes the smaller departments don't know what they're doing, so they take over.

No calls are currently being dispatched out of the Phoenix Alarm Room on Mesa VHF or Rural Metro channels.

 

[KB7MIB]

Wirelessly posted (Opera/9.80 (BREW; Opera Mini/6.0.3/27.2354; U; en) Presto/2.8.119 320X240 LG VN530)

Thanks.
BTW, I found the older channel assignment map in the 9th edition of the SWFD, circa 2005. I'm not able to scan it or take a pic of it in order to link it here.

 

[KB7MIB]

Wirelessly posted (Opera/9.80 (BREW; Opera Mini/6.0.3/27.2354; U; en) Presto/2.8.119 320X240 LG VN530)

Double

 

[Phoenix805]

Wirelessly posted (Opera/9.80 (BREW; Opera Mini/6.0.3/27.2354; U; en) Presto/2.8.119 320X240 LG VN530)

Thanks.
BTW, I found the older channel assignment map in the 9th edition of the SWFD, circa 2005. I'm not able to scan it or take a pic of it in order to link it here.

Here's the old map for what it's worth. I'm not sure, but I think the 6-9 border is more like Camelback, and 7 is more Tempe/Chandler and doesn't go so far north. The map says 12 is for Buckeye, I thought 12 was far SE valley and Buckey is typically on 9.

Feel free to add your own thoughts and/or corrections.

 

[KB7MIB]

Wirelessly posted (Opera/9.80 (BREW; Opera Mini/6.0.3/27.2354; U; en) Presto/2.8.119 320X240 LG VN530)

154.085R was B-12 at one point. 154.415 and 154.980 are the other two Buckeye/Buckeye Valley channels that I wonder if they are still used for admin purposes. (BFD & BVFD also had another channel lineup at one point that matched Phoenix up to ch 10, then they had their own: ch 11 was Gila Bend 155.055R, ch 12 was 154.085R, ch 13 154.085S, ch 14 154.415S, ch 15 154.980S, ch 16 162.550.)
I wonder the same about the Tonopah (154.325, 154.205, 154.265R) and Harquahala Valley (158.760R & 158.850R) channels. Are they still used for admin purposes? Yes, I know 158.760 is also the Pinal County Sheriff output, but uses a different input.
(R = repeater, S = simplex.)
It would make sense if the border between 6 & 9 was at Camelback, putting all of Glendale on one channel with the rest of the NW Valley, rather than splitting it.
Ch 3's borders may be the I-10/I-17 Inner Loop/Downtown area covered by ch 8 on this map.

 

[eewoodward]

Thanks for Ideas

Hi,

There were several good ideas for exploration. It turns out that some points in the thread on RWC Changes helped the most. My reception in the north side of Chandler, AZ, is rather tricky. I have a HomePatrol-1 and recently purchased the Extreme Upgrade that is priceless in my operations. The Analysis routines helped me to discover that I have a limited amount of sweet spots to receive the trunked radio traffic on the RWC.

I am still exploring a good solution for my antenna. The recent comments on multi-path effects seem to be most relevant to my case. I have a SpectrumForce antenna that works fairly well when positioned in small and specific areas of my house or outdoor areas. I have tested the use of a ground plane, and it seems that quality of decoding is more dependent on location than signal strength.

The database at RadioReference does have the appropriate and most updated Talk Groups and lists of VHF channels. FLANO also updated points on the move within Simulcast C in Chandler, and traffic of the Chandler FD seems to be mostly running through Simulcast F in Tempe. I keep monitoring Chandler, but it seems to be strictly security and open PD.


Thanks for your suggestions and help.